Yay! I didn't see this entry before I posted my suggestion to at least TALK to a vet. So happy that one has offered advice and hope!
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13 Week EE Injured (17 wks now) ~Vet Update Not Good~ *Graphic Pics *
- Thread starter Lolliegee
- Start date
Definitely like the flush idea. I had a horrendous sinus infection once, just really a terribly smelly and seemingly non-ending affair. My mother was also plagued by them, as was my aunt. (Bless our family-nose and sinuses!)
I remembered that my mom irrigated her sinuses and that's what caused relief and eventual cessation of her infection. Ironically, she used the tooth cleaning tool recommended by Nancy! I used a Neti-pot from the pharmacy. It was only after I did twice daily flushing of my sinuses that I was able to get everything out.
If you're seeing stuff come out, and her sinuses are flushing, go for it! The boric wash is what I would choose as Nancy suggested.
I also love lorimary's post and think it's right on. I do think that the injections really need to continue at least as long as suggested there.
I just love to see you getting great help like you have from the people here, and am amazed at how wonderfully patient you're doing. Had this only been a bite not involving sinuses, it probably wouldn't have been quite as long lived. But carrion-eating possums have nasty mouths, and he happened to get both sinuses in one bite. Amazing.
You'll be able to write the book on sinus injuries when this is done!
It's a good thing this is chronicled here so that people can learn from this. I suspect it'll save a few lives in the future, due to your persistence and hard work!
I remembered that my mom irrigated her sinuses and that's what caused relief and eventual cessation of her infection. Ironically, she used the tooth cleaning tool recommended by Nancy! I used a Neti-pot from the pharmacy. It was only after I did twice daily flushing of my sinuses that I was able to get everything out.
If you're seeing stuff come out, and her sinuses are flushing, go for it! The boric wash is what I would choose as Nancy suggested.
I also love lorimary's post and think it's right on. I do think that the injections really need to continue at least as long as suggested there.
I just love to see you getting great help like you have from the people here, and am amazed at how wonderfully patient you're doing. Had this only been a bite not involving sinuses, it probably wouldn't have been quite as long lived. But carrion-eating possums have nasty mouths, and he happened to get both sinuses in one bite. Amazing.
You'll be able to write the book on sinus injuries when this is done!
- Thread starter
- #163
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Thanks for the encouragement, Nancy. Where would I get the tooth irrigator? It sounds ideal. I've been using a sterile syringe, with the needle still attached, but being very careful how far I put it in. It just seemed to get in there better than the syringe alone. Also, where would I get boric acid solution?
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Debbie, Thank you SO much for doing this. It's so helpful to know from a vet that everything I'm doing is right. It's kinda what I figured, but it sure is nice to have confirmation.
I'm getting ready to do her fist cleaning/feeding for the day. I'm running really behind today. I'm wondering if there's a way to irrigate the other side now too. I tried to find the original wound...looked at the older pictures, but there is nothing there anymore, no puffiness or anything. I'd love to get it into her sinuses on that side too. Could I use the tooth irrigator thing in her nostril? I've been putting drops of saline in her nose, to aid in cleaning them out, but doing it that way, I obviously can't get a whole lot in there.
Thanks again for the wonderful support! I so appreciate it!
Thanks for the encouragement, Nancy. Where would I get the tooth irrigator? It sounds ideal. I've been using a sterile syringe, with the needle still attached, but being very careful how far I put it in. It just seemed to get in there better than the syringe alone. Also, where would I get boric acid solution?
Quote:
Debbie, Thank you SO much for doing this. It's so helpful to know from a vet that everything I'm doing is right. It's kinda what I figured, but it sure is nice to have confirmation.
I'm getting ready to do her fist cleaning/feeding for the day. I'm running really behind today. I'm wondering if there's a way to irrigate the other side now too. I tried to find the original wound...looked at the older pictures, but there is nothing there anymore, no puffiness or anything. I'd love to get it into her sinuses on that side too. Could I use the tooth irrigator thing in her nostril? I've been putting drops of saline in her nose, to aid in cleaning them out, but doing it that way, I obviously can't get a whole lot in there.
Thanks again for the wonderful support! I so appreciate it!
I do hope she gets better.
A couple of notes about predators. Recently my flock was ravaged by a raccoon and a possum. It took me some time to get my hands on a have a heart trap, so in the meantime I put a radio out in the shed, playing the most obnoxious music I could find. It kept everybody away. The chickens and my goats weren't too happy, but they got used to it. I turned it off during the day.
Once I got a trap I found that sardines (in oil) were the best bait. I tried cat food, and I still lost chickens. With the sardines, I have caught a feral cat, a possum, no raccoon yet, but I haven't lost any chickens in about 4 nights now.
A couple of notes about predators. Recently my flock was ravaged by a raccoon and a possum. It took me some time to get my hands on a have a heart trap, so in the meantime I put a radio out in the shed, playing the most obnoxious music I could find. It kept everybody away. The chickens and my goats weren't too happy, but they got used to it. I turned it off during the day.
Once I got a trap I found that sardines (in oil) were the best bait. I tried cat food, and I still lost chickens. With the sardines, I have caught a feral cat, a possum, no raccoon yet, but I haven't lost any chickens in about 4 nights now.
- May 17, 2009
- 45
- 2
- 22
Hi there,
I would try the nearest oral surgery office, or a dentist who extracts wisdom teeth even. They should know exactly what I mean.
Also a Intra-cath used for an IV would work but will be harder to aim since it is a bit floppier and longer. Paramedics, hospitals, blood banks, places that drawn blood would all carry them. Even a vets office might let you buy one if you brought in her pic. Another place that might have some is a DME company, like one the gives wheelchairs and IV supplies to patients. You might call them and explain and ask if they have any outdated or unsterile ones you could have. Apria and Lincare are large national companies that might have branches near you.
Nancy
I would try the nearest oral surgery office, or a dentist who extracts wisdom teeth even. They should know exactly what I mean.
Also a Intra-cath used for an IV would work but will be harder to aim since it is a bit floppier and longer. Paramedics, hospitals, blood banks, places that drawn blood would all carry them. Even a vets office might let you buy one if you brought in her pic. Another place that might have some is a DME company, like one the gives wheelchairs and IV supplies to patients. You might call them and explain and ask if they have any outdated or unsterile ones you could have. Apria and Lincare are large national companies that might have branches near you.
Nancy
- Thread starter
- #166
Here's tonight's update...
Got another shot in her. Finally found a spot that had a little bit of muscle and luckily doesn't seem to bother her at all when I do it. (It's in her thigh) This is great since I usually have to do it by myself.
The weeping continues...both eyes have thick clear fluid weeping from them. The right eye is still the worst, but the other eye is doing it too. This morning, she looked just awful. Actually had some shavings stuck to one eye and shavings stuck to the inside of her mouth. A lot of hardened goo around her nostrils and both eyes were glued shut. Tonight, it wasn't quite so bad...No shavings and although the eyes were glued shut, they came open easily. The nostrils still had a bunch of gunk clogging them up.
Her poo is looking closer and closer to normal, although when she sits in it it's hard to tell!
I'm gonna have to give her another bath tomorrow, she smelled like poo tonight, but it was too late to do it then.
Still keeping the wound open, although that's getting harder and harder to do. It really wants to close. I've been sort of massaging it open with the side of the toothpick, but would love to know if there's a better way. I don't know how much longer I'll be able to keep it open at the rate I'm going.
I'll try my dentist office for the tooth irrigator. I think one of my kids has an appointment this week.
Oh yeah, I do have a call out to a local wildlife place, hoping they will call back soon, so I can get capture that opossum and not have to worry about it so constantly. (Although, I certainly won't be lax about closing up my flock at night.)
I think that's all for now, sorry if I missed anything, it's late and I'm not thinking so straight. I think it's time for bed!
Got another shot in her. Finally found a spot that had a little bit of muscle and luckily doesn't seem to bother her at all when I do it. (It's in her thigh) This is great since I usually have to do it by myself.
The weeping continues...both eyes have thick clear fluid weeping from them. The right eye is still the worst, but the other eye is doing it too. This morning, she looked just awful. Actually had some shavings stuck to one eye and shavings stuck to the inside of her mouth. A lot of hardened goo around her nostrils and both eyes were glued shut. Tonight, it wasn't quite so bad...No shavings and although the eyes were glued shut, they came open easily. The nostrils still had a bunch of gunk clogging them up.
Her poo is looking closer and closer to normal, although when she sits in it it's hard to tell!
Still keeping the wound open, although that's getting harder and harder to do. It really wants to close. I've been sort of massaging it open with the side of the toothpick, but would love to know if there's a better way. I don't know how much longer I'll be able to keep it open at the rate I'm going.
I'll try my dentist office for the tooth irrigator. I think one of my kids has an appointment this week.
Oh yeah, I do have a call out to a local wildlife place, hoping they will call back soon, so I can get capture that opossum and not have to worry about it so constantly. (Although, I certainly won't be lax about closing up my flock at night.)
I think that's all for now, sorry if I missed anything, it's late and I'm not thinking so straight. I think it's time for bed!
- Jul 20, 2008
- 973
- 15
- 234
Keep fighting!!!
YAY on the new shot-spot.
That's good news.
The eyes and nostrils, they're worse yes? What are you using at this point to flush them with? I'm curious if it's one thing, maybe another thing can be tried.
On the wound, how large is the actual opening at this point? Were you ever able to locate the other opening?
I'm thinking a different approach may be needed now. I think this is transitioning from a simple wound infection to being a sinus infection instead. Or some combination. Since you're transitioning into some sinus infection treatments anyway, let's explore that option more - give it more of a fight in that area as well. The penicillin will do its job on the possom bacteria.
Sinuses. I found a good article on how exactly to flush the sinus in birds. In it, they recommend a warmed saline solution. They say to press the syringe up to the nares and form a seal there, and slowly squirt the saline. It says that the fluid will come out of the choanal opening (that opening in the roof of their beak) and out of the mouth. For this, the bird must have their head lower than their body, beak pointing down. Of course, never force the flush - there should be something clogged in there.
If I were to do that, I'd clean the choanal opening first and get as much of the gunk away from it as possible. Very warm water. Honestly I'd really use VetRx for that part.
There's also the option of switching to an antibiotic that will treat her sinusitis specifically. This is one of those cases where I would consider treating with Enroxil, which is enrofloxacin which is Baytril. Baytril is the Bayer brand name.
http://www.allbirdproducts.com/newproductpages/enroxil.html is the best price and a reasonable supplier.
Baytril is a very strong drug. You'll definitely need to give probiotics while you give it. It's NOT one that I recommend ever for general illnesses because it's a "big gun" drug that you don't want to give indiscriminately. But it's killer to bad bacteria stuck up in sinuses.
The good news is that it's effective in wounds and abcesses by E. coli, Klebsiella, P. mirabilis, and the dreaded Staphylococcus. It's also good for respiratory infections. When I had a hen that was injured and prescribed antibiotics, and a cockatoo with wounds, this is what the vets gave. Just the Baytril form - in solution, syrup.
Maybe a slight change in angle of approach would get her past this plateau in the upward rise of her improvement.
In the mean time, I hope you're able to get the possom. If they do a live trap and you have to replace the bait, our possoms are really big fans of molasses on bread (or in our case, oats = horse feed). that way you won't get feral cats in the trap. It's worth a shot.. I need to do the same; a possom, or his droppings, almost killed my best horse this year and now he's still in a neurological rehabilitative process. Possoms, by the way, are also notorious carriers of the disease 'sarco' which is devestating to birds. They poop where they eat, so he'll infest your chickens' area so good riddance to him.
I hope today finds you and your gal well!
The eyes and nostrils, they're worse yes? What are you using at this point to flush them with? I'm curious if it's one thing, maybe another thing can be tried.
On the wound, how large is the actual opening at this point? Were you ever able to locate the other opening?
I'm thinking a different approach may be needed now. I think this is transitioning from a simple wound infection to being a sinus infection instead. Or some combination. Since you're transitioning into some sinus infection treatments anyway, let's explore that option more - give it more of a fight in that area as well. The penicillin will do its job on the possom bacteria.
Sinuses. I found a good article on how exactly to flush the sinus in birds. In it, they recommend a warmed saline solution. They say to press the syringe up to the nares and form a seal there, and slowly squirt the saline. It says that the fluid will come out of the choanal opening (that opening in the roof of their beak) and out of the mouth. For this, the bird must have their head lower than their body, beak pointing down. Of course, never force the flush - there should be something clogged in there.
If I were to do that, I'd clean the choanal opening first and get as much of the gunk away from it as possible. Very warm water. Honestly I'd really use VetRx for that part.
There's also the option of switching to an antibiotic that will treat her sinusitis specifically. This is one of those cases where I would consider treating with Enroxil, which is enrofloxacin which is Baytril. Baytril is the Bayer brand name.
http://www.allbirdproducts.com/newproductpages/enroxil.html is the best price and a reasonable supplier.
Baytril is a very strong drug. You'll definitely need to give probiotics while you give it. It's NOT one that I recommend ever for general illnesses because it's a "big gun" drug that you don't want to give indiscriminately. But it's killer to bad bacteria stuck up in sinuses.
The good news is that it's effective in wounds and abcesses by E. coli, Klebsiella, P. mirabilis, and the dreaded Staphylococcus. It's also good for respiratory infections. When I had a hen that was injured and prescribed antibiotics, and a cockatoo with wounds, this is what the vets gave. Just the Baytril form - in solution, syrup.
Maybe a slight change in angle of approach would get her past this plateau in the upward rise of her improvement.
In the mean time, I hope you're able to get the possom. If they do a live trap and you have to replace the bait, our possoms are really big fans of molasses on bread (or in our case, oats = horse feed). that way you won't get feral cats in the trap. It's worth a shot.. I need to do the same; a possom, or his droppings, almost killed my best horse this year and now he's still in a neurological rehabilitative process. Possoms, by the way, are also notorious carriers of the disease 'sarco' which is devestating to birds. They poop where they eat, so he'll infest your chickens' area so good riddance to him.
I hope today finds you and your gal well!
- May 15, 2009
- 1,997
- 42
- 181
I've read every line regarding this chicken and it is breaking my heart. People can say stop when it hurts or that makes me feel better. A poor animal can't let us know how or what they are feeling. She must be in a great deal of pain and distress. I understand that you can not afford a visit to the vet. Please make an appointment with a vet and get an estimate on how much treatment will cost and I will gladly pay for it.
Call a vet and ask him/her to read the sequence of events and treatment and see what they have to say about cost to make her well.
Let us know what the vet says and I will tell you how to reach me and we can go from there.
Justine
Call a vet and ask him/her to read the sequence of events and treatment and see what they have to say about cost to make her well.
Let us know what the vet says and I will tell you how to reach me and we can go from there.
Justine
- May 15, 2009
- 1,997
- 42
- 181
One more thing....get rid of the possom. Mash up a can of sardines in oil and add plaster of paris to make a thick paste. Place next to the chicken coop with a nice bowl of water. The possom will eat the sardine mixture, drink some water and you will never see it again. The plaster of paris will turn to concrete in it's belly and its good bye.
To the owner of the horse that became ill because of a possom. I'm very sorry and hope he/she makes a speedy recovery.
To the owner of the horse that became ill because of a possom. I'm very sorry and hope he/she makes a speedy recovery.
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