2 dogs to protect the farm?

[islandgirl82]

Catmoose is correct, their cheaper, they can the more healthy if you pick them right, and also because I prefer to rescue as opposed to buying from a breeder, and it's way easier to to find mutts then it is to find purebreds. And when you do find purebreds at a shelter they tend to be much more expensive, at least where I live, but if I got purebreds I would get a German shepherd and a boarder collie, which I am considering.

And centrarchid, I am hoping to get goats, cows, horses, hogs, turkeys, ducks, geese, guinea fowl, and maybe some alpacas or llamas, or both, and of course I have the chickens. And the predators we get here are minks, hawks, coyotes, and occasionally fox, and I do not have much experience so your right there.

And thanks for all the answers so far!

I know what you mean about preferring to rescue but there are rescue groups everywhere that specialize in certain breeds or some times mixes that include those certain breeds that would be well suited for the job you're looking to have it do. Guardian breeds, not to be confused with guard dogs, have been bred specifically for protecting livestock and do well over a large range; breeds like great pyrenees and maremmas which are the two of many but like all breeds will still require training.

 

[centrarchid]

Get your fencing up first. Ideally dogs will be raised around animals they are to guard but you are interested in a lot making that a challenge. You may also have some conflicts with the camelids and dogs. When it comes to protecting chickens, dogs I consider to protect the location first and they can learn to use the chickens as their alarm system. Pup acquisition needs to be staggered by at least 18 months, ideally more than 2 years. All breeds I am familiar with require nearly three years tg fully mature.


How many acres do you have for this? Will your ground be able to support what you want or are you prepared to go the feed lot route?

We need a feel for your resources. The mammals and their keep is not cheap. Dogs often not cheapest route when area to be defended is small.

 

[centrarchid]

I know what you mean about preferring to rescue but there are rescue groups everywhere that specialize in certain breeds or some times mixes that include those certain breeds that would be well suited for the job you're looking to have it do. Guardian breeds, not to be confused with guard dogs, have been bred specifically for protecting livestock and do well over a large range; breeds like great pyrenees and maremmas which are the two of many but like all breeds will still require training.

Most people can make do with guarding breeds with confined groups of animals. The LGD's were developed to guard mobile herds which very few people on this sight employ. If the predators of concern are small, then you can get away with dogs less than a hundred lbs but they still need to be at least 50% larger than threats and ideally you have more than one dog.


OP needs to consider winter time climate.

 

[LoganTW]

Ok, I just looked at livestock guarding dogs, and I'm not sure what breeds I will get but I'll probably get mastiffs, so thanks for everybody's help!

 

[LoganTW]

Get your fencing up first. Ideally dogs will be raised around animals they are to guard but you are interested in a lot making that a challenge. You may also have some conflicts with the camelids and dogs. When it comes to protecting chickens, dogs I consider to protect the location first and they can learn to use the chickens as their alarm system. Pup acquisition needs to be staggered by at least 18 months, ideally more than 2 years. All breeds I am familiar with require nearly three years tg fully mature.


How many acres do you have for this? Will your ground be able to support what you want or are you prepared to go the feed lot route?

We need a feel for your resources. The mammals and their keep is not cheap. Dogs often not cheapest route when area to be defended is small.

I have 11 acres, and hoping to get more next year. And curiously why would camelids and dogs be a problem?

 

[cynroux]

For what it's worth, I have an adopted, purebred, 5 year old neutered GSD. He's brilliant, well mannered, and very well trained. At 110 lbs, it's imperative that he is attentive to commands, or else all hell would break loose. I know that when he is introduced to our soon to be flock, he'll be curious, but he'll respect the boundaries and within a day or two, begin to guard them. It's his nature. I also have an adopted 5 year old, neutered Rat Terrier/Chihuahua and he'll be curious as well, but I won't be able to trust him as far as I can throw him with the chickens. GSDs are herders and guardians. Terriers are ratters/vermin killers with very little care about what they are going after, as long as it's small and makes noise. My little guy, Willie, is a notorious mouse/rabbit/groundhog murderer, but he's very very respectful of cats, kittens, and other small dogs. Introducing him to the flock will be a very controlled process.
Purebred or mongrel, whatever you decide, dogs are individuals and should be treated as such. Some of their nature may win out...as in the case of my guys, but every dog is his or her own individual. Spend time with the pup you decide to bring into your pack and around your flock. Best of luck!

 

[centrarchid]

I have 11 acres, and hoping to get more next year. And curiously why would camelids and dogs be a problem?

The larger animals are going to chew that acreage up quickly. I would work to get birds to stay in a core area (=barnyard) and have so dogs consider same area to be their core as well. Sheep and goats with young will need to be kept tight so something like a coyote does not have option to snatch and run with small juveniles. Dogs covering such an area will have a tougher time than what a typical LGD normally experiences with a tight herd of sheep or goats.


The camelids naturally prone to be unpleasant to dogs but can be overcome.

 

[LoganTW]

The larger animals are going to chew that acreage up quickly. I would work to get birds to stay in a core area (=barnyard) and have so dogs consider same area to be their core as well. Sheep and goats with young will need to be kept tight so something like a coyote does not have option to snatch and run with small juveniles. Dogs covering such an area will have a tougher time than what a typical LGD normally experiences with a tight herd of sheep or goats.


The camelids naturally prone to be unpleasant to dogs but can be overcome.

Oh! Thanks for the Info!

 

[MrsBrooke]

English Mastiffs were bred to be war dogs. They were used by Roman soldiers in battle and to guard their camps, and eventually commoners used the dogs to guard their homes. This eventually led to bear baiting, lion hunting, and blood sport. Today, they are bred for docile temperament and companionship. I wouldn't necessarily use a Mastiff to guard a flock of birds.

I would personally go with a breed used specifically for guarding livestock or fowl. Australian Shepherds are so-named, not because they were bred in Australia (they are actually a Californian breed), but because they were bred to herd Australian geese specifically. This gives them a very gentle, calm nature with a hard-working attitude without the intensity and high-strung nature of a Border Collie (I had a Border Collie, too, so I feel experienced enough to speak on both

). Aussies are bred to work with birds by moving around them, where Border Collies work with cattle, usually with "The Eye" and by biting and nipping.

I got an Australian Shepherd two years ago with the intent of someday having chickens. He turned into an 80 lb teddy bear. He is very gentle and docile with a "soft mouth" (he doesn't bite down when things are put in his mouth). A few months ago, I got another Aussie. He's 6 months old and is an absolute terror in a way my first Aussie never was. Maybe it's that he's hitting puberty (he's starting to hump EVERYTHING), and he's running on straight testosterone. He gets the snip next Friday to calm him down, so I can start working on him with the chickens when we get them.

ANYWAY.... this is not an anti-Mastiff/Pit Bull/fighting dog post. Pit Bulls used to be bear-bait dogs, but they were then used to guard nurseries due to their loyal nature and desire to protect their owners and territory. Sure, you get a "cool factor" with the Mastiff, but are they the BEST choice for guarding livestock? Ehhh, I'm not so sure about that.

Any dog can be trained to do anything you want it to do. I feel the key is selecting a breed for your purpose, so that you don't have to "reprogram" a dog to do something he wasn't necessarily bred to do.

Plus, the cost of feeding a Mastiff is something to consider. Big dog, big food bowl, BIG POOPS!

 

[The ChickenKing]

I would definately recommend a Border Collie, I have a ten week old puppy and she is already completely ignoring the chickens, and a few days ago she even warned me of a hawk trying to get the flock! Luckily my rooster jumped in and showed that hawk who's boss, with a little help from me of course.