3.5-year Red Star hen; no appetite and runny poop. Tube-feed?

[h c hennery]

[Beware: poop photo below]

Star has always been our most enthusiastic eater, but now she has no appetite. Star hasn’t laid eggs since last September, but otherwise seemed healthy until a couple weeks ago.

The vet is stumped; her poop sample had no parasites. Our two other hens (different breeds but shared living conditions) are fine.

We’ve tube-fed Star a couple times, but wonder how much more we should do.

On the one hand, force-feeding her may save her life, if her immune system can save her.

On the other hand, if she has a terminal disease (cancer?), force-feeding her will just cause needless suffering.

I’ll describe her symptoms below. I’ll also attach a picture of her poop. If these symptoms sound familiar to anyone, please let me know.

Thanks for any input.

Symptoms:

she was a little lethargic beginning about 2 weeks ago; still eating, but less enthusiastically.

last weekend: we noticed her butt was poopy.

last sunday: she pretty much stopped eating.

monday: i took her to the vet. he found dried and matted poop blocking her vent. he cleaned and trimmed around the area; advised she could go back in the coop with our 2 other hens. she weighed 4 pounds 6 ounces.

last tuesday & wednesday: she stayed in the coop all day; she drank some water; but didn’t appear to eat anything. at first I thought just going to the vet had shocked her; but now i think the poopy butt was secondary to a primary illness.

wednesday evening: my husband brought her into the house, for warmth. she moved very little. we've kept her inside since.

thursday: she willingly drank water and chick-gatorade, but had no appetite for food. her poop was liquidy yellow, and brown and white; somewhat gelatinous. i took a fecal sample to vet, who found no evidence of parasites. [she's been pooping every few hours, although she's eating little to nothing.]

friday: she weighed 4 pounds 1 ounce. we tube-fed her about 25 ml kaytee exact.

saturday morning: she was more alert and curious; wanted to explore outside her dog crate. she enthusiastically ate about 1-2 tbsp of dried mealworms.

sunday (this) morning: she nibbled at cabbage; didn’t want mealworms. she weighed 3 pounds 14 ounces. we tube-fed her about 42 ml kaytee exact this morning at 8:30 a.m.

 

[ChicNmom]

I have an older hen that routinely goes through a phase where she will not eat. I took her to the vet the first time and they couldn't find anything wrong. It happens to her usually in late fall or winter. Maybe it's just an excuse to live in the basement and get treats.

If she hasn't been eating much for a while her body will stop telling her she is hungry. Humans in starvation situations also get to that point. Or if she eats a tiny bit she will feel full.

My hen has been at this for about 2 months and finally started eating. I will give her anything I think she will eat just to get her going. Last week I pried her beak open and just stuffed in bits of scrambled egg and some slices of grapes. It seems like for my hen she wanted lettuce and deli meat. That got her going this time and now she's eating her treats but also ate her whole dish of chicken feed yesterday.

Give her some of whatever you think she might eat just to get her going.

There could be something wrong internally. Hard to know. I usually give mine some probiotics if they have runny poop. If it looked eggy I'm sure the vet would have noticed it.

Also, if you are tube feeding her she will feel full and not be as likely to think she needs to eat anything. Try something extra tempting like scrambled egg or anything they really love and see if she goes for it.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Star has always been our most enthusiastic eater, but now she has no appetite. Star hasn’t laid eggs since last September, but otherwise seemed healthy until a couple weeks ago.

Maybe molted and haven't returned to lay yet.. lay hormone is light triggered?? That can be a very challenging time!

EYP, Salpingitis. internal laying, or ascites or reproductive tumors is my first guess...

https://the-chicken-chick.com/salpi...he most common,in The Chicken Health Handbook.

Have you checked crop function to make sure it's emptying over night?

https://the-chicken-chick.com/chicken-anatomy-crop-impacted-crop-sour/

At 3.5 years old.. that's a fair life span for a sex link which has been known to suffer reproductive disorders very commonly. Is the vet able to do an x ray or ultrasound to look for tumors, etc?

Sorry y'all face this!

Maybe the following link will have amounts for tube feeding..

(6) Step-by-Step Tube Feeding Guide

Honestly.. at her age, with her breed.. I would consider prognosis to be poor and Euthanasia to POSSIBLY be the kind thing.

Noting that an animal can have a heavy parasite load that passes intermittently and never shows up on fecals.. so SOMETIMES worming despite a clean float is recommended.. shown under the header of prophylactic de wroming in the following link..

http://www.exoticpetvet.net/avian/challenges.html

What is her standard feed?

Consider using a supplement like Rooster Booster brand Poultry Cell product or Rooster Booster brand Poultry Booster. Meal worms are crud at best if a patient is refusing them, they aren;t easy to digest and limited on nutrients. Try a scrambled egg instead.. there are much more micro nutrients and easier to digest.

Wish I could give a better answer.

 

[h c hennery]

I have an older hen that routinely goes through a phase where she will not eat. I took her to the vet the first time and they couldn't find anything wrong. It happens to her usually in late fall or winter. Maybe it's just an excuse to live in the basement and get treats.

If she hasn't been eating much for a while her body will stop telling her she is hungry. Humans in starvation situations also get to that point. Or if she eats a tiny bit she will feel full.

My hen has been at this for about 2 months and finally started eating. I will give her anything I think she will eat just to get her going. Last week I pried her beak open and just stuffed in bits of scrambled egg and some slices of grapes. It seems like for my hen she wanted lettuce and deli meat. That got her going this time and now she's eating her treats but also ate her whole dish of chicken feed yesterday.

Give her some of whatever you think she might eat just to get her going.

There could be something wrong internally. Hard to know. I usually give mine some probiotics if they have runny poop. If it looked eggy I'm sure the vet would have noticed it.

Also, if you are tube feeding her she will feel full and not be as likely to think she needs to eat anything. Try something extra tempting like scrambled egg or anything they really love and see if she goes for it.

I have an older hen that routinely goes through a phase where she will not eat. I took her to the vet the first time and they couldn't find anything wrong. It happens to her usually in late fall or winter. Maybe it's just an excuse to live in the basement and get treats.

If she hasn't been eating much for a while her body will stop telling her she is hungry. Humans in starvation situations also get to that point. Or if she eats a tiny bit she will feel full.

My hen has been at this for about 2 months and finally started eating. I will give her anything I think she will eat just to get her going. Last week I pried her beak open and just stuffed in bits of scrambled egg and some slices of grapes. It seems like for my hen she wanted lettuce and deli meat. That got her going this time and now she's eating her treats but also ate her whole dish of chicken feed yesterday.

Give her some of whatever you think she might eat just to get her going.

There could be something wrong internally. Hard to know. I usually give mine some probiotics if they have runny poop. If it looked eggy I'm sure the vet would have noticed it.

Also, if you are tube feeding her she will feel full and not be as likely to think she needs to eat anything. Try something extra tempting like scrambled egg or anything they really love and see if she goes for it.

Thanks for this info!

I've tried tiny bits of cheese, scrambled egg, little bits of deli meat, yogurt, broccoli, and this morning bacon and cabbage. Yesterday morning mealworms interested her, but not today. She did swallow little bits of cabbage, but it seems like at this rate she'll wither away if we don't intervene. ?

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I took her to the vet the first time and they couldn't find anything wrong.

Well, you found something wrong and the vet you used couldn't identify the cause..

Crop dysfunction.. even mild can be a symptom of Marek's.. that repeats every now and then.. with no identifiable "root"..

Force feeding a bird with crop or gizzard dysfunction.. might NOT help them..

Identify the cause before pushing masks over it!! Otherwise watch it repeat time and time again.

EDITED first link in first post to valid information.

 

[ChicNmom]

Well, you found something wrong and the vet you used couldn't identify the cause..

Crop dysfunction.. even mild can be a symptom of Marek's.. that repeats every now and then.. with no identifiable "root"..

Force feeding a bird with crop or gizzard dysfunction.. might NOT help them..

Identify the cause before pushing masks over it!! Otherwise watch it repeat time and time again.

EDITED first lonk in first post to valid information.

Is crop dysfunction seasonal? She has done this for the last 3 years in late fall or early winter. Why does it only happen to this one hen? Wouldn't they all have Marek's?

Please enlighten me oh great chicken expert who knows more than my avain vet and also the OP's vet? LOL


If a chicken is losing weight and not eating I fail to see how putting a few pieces of egg in her beak is going to make things worse. Probably less traumatic than a tube feeding.

Also, I have a black sexlink that is over 5 years old. She is beating the odds. I won't write any of them off until they decide to quit.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Is crop dysfunction seasonal? She has done this for the last 3 years in late fall or early winter. Why does it only happen to this one hen? Wouldn't they all have Marek's?

Please enlighten me oh great chicken expert who knows more than my avain vet and also the OP's vet? LOL


If a chicken is losing weight and not eating I fail to see how putting a few pieces of egg in her beak is going to make things worse. Probably less traumatic than a tube feeding.

Also, I have a black sexlink that is over 5 years old. She is beating the odds. I won't write any of them off until they decide to quit.

Hi there.

Lol doesn't take away sarcasm.. but I can handle it. Thank you for inquiring about things I say which don't add up to you!

Please understand I do NOT claim to be an expert or know more than anyone's vet. I do consider EVERY ONE to fallible and have the ability to miss something and hopefully an open enough mind to realize they can NEVER know it all. I do understand what made you defensive, sorry.

Now that the air is a little clearer..

Crop dysfunction.. can damn well be seasonal as can parasites, molting, weather changes, hormones, and SOO many more things.. So uhm.. YA.. Marek's flares seasonally SOMETIMES. And nutrients might be what's changing AT that time of year.. ANY "stress" CAN make episodes of ANYTHING being carried flare up MORE than usual. It well KNOWN common FACT. People who keep their Marek's diagnosed birds.. support them through their flare ups each year!!!! Education, knowledge IS power. Ignorance.. is WAY to often bliss for those amidst it.

ONE hen is the only one with her personal; genetics, grooming habits, bathing habits, forage habits, mating habits, personal strength and weakness.. etc.. EVEN if ALL had something doesn't mean they will ALL show it in the same way or even succumb to it at the same time, if EVER.. that's what makes avian medicine among other so challenging. I'm not saying it is Marek's.. I said "it CAN be ONE symptom".

I'm glad you have a sex link beating the odds (nice birds).. she's not the only one! I beat the odds too.. and live clean despite being birthed to heroin addicts and kicked around foster care. Even after we beat the odds, our eventual fate is the same.. the only difference is timing. One is NOT better than the other.. it's different

Never give up is good attitude to have, yes!

Prolonging suffering due to selfishness is NOT humane. You cannot equate YOUR situation to another as no two are ever the same.. In sex links as well as any other breed, species, race, etc.. someone gets good genes and some get the sorry genes... There will ALWAYS be the outliers that "beat the odds".. and that DOES give us hope! Something to work towards.. it doesn't change reality though.. I made a LOT of valid suggestions and things to discuss with the veterinarian, in addition to giving my personal OPINION. Please don't let petty stuff (like how I unintentionally come across TOO cocky) get in the way of the big picture.

I guess you haven't watched a furry friend suffer end of life symptoms if you won't consider euthanasia until they quit.. The first dog I HAD to put down as an adult, my daughter was in kindergarten.. TJ (toe jam) had lost over 50# and being a skeleton of himself didn't have the strength to hold his legs together and stand up.. His spirit was willing.. but his body was riddled with cancer tumors at only 7 years old and he could NOT absorb nutrients period. Not even tube fed.. what should I have done injections, IV nutrients.. What.. we all draw the line somewhere!

Definition of euthanasia
: the act or practice of killing or permitting the death of hopelessly sick or injured individuals (such as persons or domestic animals) in a relatively painless way for reasons of mercy.

Source.. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/euthanasia

What I'm describing dear friend is an act of LOVE and kindness and NOT an act of giving up! KNOW the difference and please DON'T judge!


ONE quality of life assessment tool that may help if one faces the question of Euthanasia..

HowDoIKnowWhen

Hopefully later than sooner.

 

[ChicNmom]

Dear @EggSighted4Life,

I'm sorry to hear that you have had a rough personal life and I'm glad you got through it.

I have also euthanized beloved pets and chickens. when the time was right. My last line said :
" I won't write any of them off until they decide to quit."
You must have missed that to go on and on about suffering and euthanasia.

When you say this with your all caps words:

"What I'm describing dear friend is an act of LOVE and kindness and NOT an act of giving up! KNOW the difference and please DON'T judge!
"
It appears you have already made the judgement, even with the huggy emoji.

I'm sure you know things that I don't know. I likely know things that you don't know.
Everyone here likely knows their chickens better than we do. We are all operating on one dimensional information from what someone writes about their situation. That is an incomplete picture to work with but we all offer what we can. Maybe something will work. Maybe it won't.

All of these chickens are lucky to have owners that care enough to try.


If you need to discuss this further please PM .

 

[h c hennery]

I appreciate all your input.

Star was vaccinated for Marek's disease as a day-old chick. That suggestion led me down the rabbit hole of "avian leukosis" -- scary stuff. I wish these things were easier to diagnose.

 

[ChicNmom]

Thanks for this info!

I've tried tiny bits of cheese, scrambled egg, little bits of deli meat, yogurt, broccoli, and this morning bacon and cabbage. Yesterday morning mealworms interested her, but not today. She did swallow little bits of cabbage, but it seems like at this rate she'll wither away if we don't intervene. ?

It sounds like she is still a little bit interested in food. Canned peaches chopped into bits has worked well for me. Also, surprisingly steak or roast beef bits. The more expensive items seem to taste best.

It's not ideal but they can lose a surprising amount of weight and bounce back. Especially if they are just being still in a crate in a warm place not expending energy. Plus you gave her a good feeding this morning. Likely more than shes had at one time in a few days.

I'd keep at it. You're doing a great job.