4-H provides exemption for homeowner's agreement restrictions?

[CityChicker]

I truly feel for you. I just don't get people. One would hope they would have a heart and let your kids keep your birds since they are using them for 4-H. You would think they would prefer this to drug dealers (or any other obnoxious people) living next doors.

We are fighting our HOA too. It is all so ridiculous. We had to go cut a $750 check to an attorney to help us fight it and the covenants are over 30 years old and now VOLUNTARY! Our attorney has told us though to not be very hopeful because the courts usually side with the HOA, even if the rules are ancient and/or haven't been kept current. We don't have any roosters and live on a .5 acre lot across the street from a lake and neighbor that has a huge pasture and probably a dozen horses. It is all just pure meanness.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

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Agree.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

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Well, a contract is valid regardless of age. Now if the covenants are voluntary, you have a pretty strong leg to stand on. As to courts siding with HOAs, that is not necessarily accurate. It really depends on the specific issue. You need to read your state laws governing HOAs as well as your community documents. However, if you do not like the restrictions, why did you purchase that home?

 

[illegal avian]

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Kind of like having a horse, and then when it takes a dump, you repeatedly go about beating it on the head with a stick?

 

[halo]

Hey, I resemble that!!

 

[CityChicker]

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Well, a contract is valid regardless of age. Now if the covenants are voluntary, you have a pretty strong leg to stand on. As to courts siding with HOAs, that is not necessarily accurate. It really depends on the specific issue. You need to read your state laws governing HOAs as well as your community documents. However, if you do not like the restrictions, why did you purchase that home?

We bought the home because we were inaccurately told that the covenants were expired and no longer valid. We were told that the association is voluntary. We didn't sign any contract and we don't pay HOA dues. In fact, we didn't hear even a word from the HOA the first couple years we were here. We didn't know they even still met. We are working with an attorney that is very experienced with HOA's, so I am inclined to trust what he says. What he has told us is that even though they are expired, the courts here generally side with the HOA or the covenants that were originally filed unless someone has at some point got a majority of home owners to abolish them. Are you an attorney in the state of CO and somehow know more than our attorney?

 

[Dingleberry]

I do agree with this however there are far more homes with HOA than not.
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[Over Easy in Adna]

Edited to remove flame - please see the rules

I hate to say tough, but the rules are in place. You can try to change them, but someone will always be the loser in that. If 99 out of 100 want chickens, you will be forcing the 1 out, or forcing him to deal with something that he never wanted in the neighborhood.

You can only control your actions. My actions would involve looking for a new house where I could enjoy my hobby without any issues.

 

[CityChicker]

I read the HOA rules just fine, thank you very much. They are EXPIRED. They were established in 1971 and expired years ago. They are voluntary. We didn't have to sign anything or agree to anything to purchase this house (as far as the HOA). In the first few paragraphs of the covenants they say they are only legally binding for 30 years (long since passed).

Our attorney has said that it doesn't really matter though that they are expired and voluntary. He has simply said that if we go before the board of adjustments, they typically will refer back to the original covenants that were filed when the community was built. Again, he has said "usually", not "always". In the last month since this happened, we have spoken to several of our neighbors and only one of them even knew that there was any sort of neighborhood association. That should tell you something. None of us pay fees or anything. In our case, this isn't about the birds to begin with. It is about the bitter, mean, old man across the back fence that we had a fencing dispute with. Long story short, he refused to share the cost when us and the other neighbors next door wanted to replace the 35 year old fence that was falling to pieces. Our birds being reported to the "HOA" is simply our punishment for asking him to chip in (which he didn't do for even a dime, but the other neighbors say this is typical behavior for him).

Anyway, there you have it. I am done with this thread.

Edit to remove reply to flame

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

When one purchases property that contains covenants, the purchase is considered acceptance of the terms of the covenants. HOA CC&Rs are considered a contract. In some states during the process of purchasing, one must sign an acknowledgment that the property is in an HOA and that the covenants and assessments are a contractual obligation. This is becoming more common as the numbers of HOAs rise, and as there is case law developed. However, not having signed such a notice does not mean that you are not party to a contract. Purchasing the property in an HOA or with covenants perfects the contract.

However, not all covenants create an HOA. Often developers attach covenants to the land to provide some uniform conditions for the development: minimum square footage for dwellings, maximum height, disallowing further subdivision, allowable building materials, landscaping, animals, fencing, etc.

Sometimes covenants are perpetual--they never end; other times they self-renew every so many years, usually with an option to modify them during the last year before renewal; sometimes they expire. Typically anyone who resides in the same development can sue to enforce them, and if there is an HOA, the board has the responsibility of enforcing them.

If the covenants expired prior to your purchasing the property, especially since you researched it before your purchase, you have a strong case. The neighbor's case is that that was the covenants when HE purchased. What is decided will depend on the judge, case law and written statute, as well as the specific language in the covenants (yes, I understand they expired, but hte language used is important). I hope your attorney is well versed in real estate law, particularly relating to HOAs and convenants.

No, I am not an attorney. However I am in my 5th year on my HOA board, and the 3rd year as its president. Previously I was on a committee that rewrote our CC&Rs (which passed with upwards of 95% of all homeowners approving them). During my 2nd year on the board I prepared amendments to the CC&Rs and Bylaws, both of which were approved. I am also the person who works with our attorney when we need legal advice. She specializes in real estate and HOA law (representing both sides, depending on the client) and is an adjunct law professor. I regularly keep up to date on HOA laws around the country in general and in my state in specific.

Well written covenants provide protection and structure for all parties. I do not live in a neighborhood with extensive nit picky rules; that is a deliberate choice by the neighborhood. We would not have purchased here if it had been that type of neighborhood.

As to the fence, different states and cities have dfferent laws. Unless he was obligated to share the costs by law or ordinance, while it would be nice if he had been willing, he was not required to.