A question for Candadians and UK folks and the Universal Healthcare

[Dunkopf]

You're right to be concerned Phoenix. It's a struggle. I'm 52 with just a HS education. No family money. Married 25 years. I struggled from 18 till about 42. I now have a good check and good benefits. Very little retirement and a home that used to have about 100k in equity. My home now has negative equity. We still live basically paycheck to paycheck. The big difference is we still have some cash at the next paycheck. It used to be, get paid on Friday pay the bills and buy food and be broke by Monday.

Our system is badly broken. Big business controls everything. Don't count on the government for anything. America has a me first mentality with very little empathy for those without. On the flip side there are a lot of people that feel they are entitled to a free ride and are not willing to work for a living. Unfortunately there are a lot of people that truly can't work or can't earn enough to live on. Minimum wage will not support a family in a safe and healthy environment.

Your choice is to either work 2 or 3 jobs or get a good education or training for a decent paying job. One of these days the clowns in DC will figure out that allowing big business to send all the jobs for regular people overseas is destroying the country. The world is not flat. Just because it benefits an elite few in this country to make it flat doesn't make it good.

Until people in this country start looking at what is really going on and stop listening to certain media outlets, things will never change. People are very ill informed. They worry about issues that don't really exist instead of the issues that are really destroying America.

I hope you can make it work Phoenix. I only have another 20or 30 years in this mess. I worry a lot about my kids. They have to try to make it for another 60-70 years. My 5 adopted kids have issues that will make it difficult for them and we have a society that is trying to strip help away from people like that. It seems that when things get bad the people that are least able to fend for themselves are the ones that get dumped on the streets first.

I apologize for my generation and the one before us. It seems we didn't do a very good job overall.

 

[birdsNbeesNseeds]

Just a quick statement.....

I got married (and subsequently divorced) VERY young and was a single parent of two kids and was extremely poor- almost homeless, if it wasn't for some of the help I received. There ARE plenty of programs out there for the desperately poor if you know where to go. I was driven to get out of it (that is just me) - I had some help going to college, etc. and received my Master's and lived on food stamps and WIC for awhile. Yes, I was still told NO on some programs which were full but didn't let that get me down. I went for a while with no insurance (stupidly) and told the docs, do the cheapest thing, give me the cheapest meds, and they did. Luckily they did- and I was never in an accident or had anything SERIOUS at THAT time or would have been in big trouble. The kids were on Medicaid. Yes, I probably should have purchased self insurance if I was in an accident, but I was young and had the attitude that nothing was going to happen. Luckily I was right at the time.

I think the people really stuck in the mess are the "lower middle class" or working class- those that work paycheck to paycheck and don't qualify for Government programs.

America is not really as 'heartless' as some people make it, but there are definitely some issues to be worked out.

 

[BlackBart]

Those in Canada, and I'm sorry if I missed it if already posted... and I realize it varies by province... but what kind of percentages are you paying for what you've got... all told, income, health, roads, the whole enchilada?

I think most Canadians don't know or want to know or care to know. We pay a lot of taxes for our benefits.
You would have to have a Accountant tell you the exact amounts and who pays for what.

Cost of living varies from Province to Province, so does wages. On a side note, if you hold a mortgage with a Financial institution you must hold some form of house insurance or they will not give you a mortgage. Car Insurance is mandatory, Health-care registration is supposed to be mandatory. Our bank accounts are covered by Federal Insurance up to $100,000. (last I heard)

Both Provincial and Federal tax pay for a combination of services. Property tax pays for your individual city/town operating cost (Schools, roads, libraries, recreation facilities etc), except if it is a major expense then transfers come from the Provincial and Federal reserves. The theory being is they all work together.

Individual tax both Federal and Provincial is shown below in the Canada Tax website. If you are able to put your maximum RESP (Registered Retirement Savings Plan) away per year and have a good Accountant and tax deductions then of course those figures would vary your take home pay.
http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html

Realize that I am not a Accountant or tax expert, (my sister-in-law is

) this is just a very basic breakdown. I don't really care what I pay, (as long as I can pay it) I am happy and feel fortunate to live in Canada. But taxes are why most Canadian celebrities move to the USA because they pay less taxes there.

 

[Hillsvale]

Quote:
Right on... but lets not forget about our GST/HST/PST depending on where you live.

In Nova Scotia I pay 15% on top of the sticker price of almost everything except most food. Our cost of living is very high in my opinion given salaries....

for example the cost:
of a litre of petrol today is 1.109 cents... that would be 4.20 a gallon in the US, the majority of which is government imposed taxes
a 40 oz of spirits is about 55.00, same booze you folks buy for a 1/4 or less
of a big mac combo... we pay about 7.60

 

[PineappleMama]

Cool Bart... using the currency calculator our income would be 29520 there... doesn't get past the first tax ceiling so it'd be 15% for us, or 4368. That is not including property, sales, etc taxes, just the Uncle Sam bit. Seems cheap, but if your local property taxes are higher, or sales tax is higher, then in the end it might be the same, higher or lower.

Whoops, see that Hills posted.... 7.60 for McD's... yikes! That's some major sales tax... well and may have import taxes thrown in too. The tariffs they tack onto SOME incoming goods here can be pretty weird too. And other stuff, look at the Basa Swai conflict.

Seems like you're paying more... like I said earlier I donno my local property tax rates because it's just part of our rent, we aren't buying. And of course that varies by town, n'mind county or state. But sales tax here is 8% on shampoo to school supplies... no tax (again, this is Texas) on milk and eggs, etc. Gas and Cigs have sneaky taxes hidden in their sticker price... And those aren't always a percent tax... with cigs for instance they just passed a flat $2/pk increase... so the pack that used to cost $1.99 plus regular sales tax = $2.15 now costs $3.99/$4.31... more than double the cost on generics... not as high a percent on the name brands, they were already high, but still quite a hike. Meanwhile there's no one pushing to tack on added taxes "because it's bad for your health" onto booze ... I imagine if folks had to pay double what they pay now for their six pack they'd give it a second thought. But then it's acceptable for politicians to drink, it's not acceptable for them to smoke. So they can target smokers and have no ill effects on themselves, no so with alcohol... just an opinion on that one. But if nothing else it shows just how convoluted the taxing is. I live here and I can't calculate all the picky details... assuming I can find honest numbers anyways.

But if you're having to pay that much for those few things you listed it's got to be high sales/gov't tax added... on top of the 15%... and on top of any local property/etc... if I had to guess I'd say you're paying more than we are, but I don't know that I could say for sure.

Raise your hand if you think keeping it all so convoluted that no regular citizen (heck maybe not even the politicians) can actually ever get a grip on the numbers is on purpose?? Some days I wonder.

But Phoenix... it isn't just ONE major political party that's being controlled... aka paid off... by big businesses, it's both of them. Different companies paying, one might be oil another might be insurance for instance, but both sides accept funds from large companies to further their interests... and not just at the DC level either... state, even city has this problem. Used to you took a job, paid for it, well you did the dang job. You didn't accept money from someone else to piddle and not do the work you'd already been paid to do so that they could get ahead. Basically what we're dealing with... if you can't match the millions, then don't expect to keep your employee honest.

 

[BlackBart]

In our area because we have farm status we pay $350 per year for property taxes. Millionaire's who rent out their property to farmers for pasture or hay sales can claim farm status as well. We call them Gentleman Farmers

We pay 14% HST on almost everything. This was supposed to be income generated for social programs.

We pay just over $5 for a A&W Teenburger, just a burger.
Two for one Pizza will cost you approx $30
A case of beer will cost over $20 a dozen, 26 oz of hard booze approx $35
Booze, gasoline and cigarettes are taxed very heavily. A pack of 20 cigs will cost you approx $8. I'm not sure, I don't smoke.
I can of automotive oil, good quality, is about $4.50 per litre.

Wages are higer in BC.
The average Teacher makes $70,000 per year and a basic Nurse will make over $30 per hour plus benefits. Both belong to Unions. Doctors do not belong to a Union so they cannot go on strike.

I pay $70 per hour to have my car worked on at a Repair shop, that is cheap.
Landscapers and House cleaners make $25 per hour on the average.

There is a tongue and cheek joke about BC residents work 6 -1/2 months just for taxes, the other 5 1/2 months is "our" money.


Raise your hand if you think keeping it all so convoluted that no regular citizen (heck maybe not even the politicians) can actually ever get a grip on the numbers is on purpose??

I raise my hand and support all of the other Mushrooms (Mushrooms, kept in the dark and fed BS)

 

[PineappleMama]

Mushrooms??!!? I gotta show that one to DH.

Teachers down here, supposedly one of the highest paid (may be based on COL I donno) have a starting salary in the 40's in our district. No experience, just have your papers, opening pay. Even with the converter that's still significantly less than what yours make. But then, if the COL amounts to that much more... may not be as much of a gap as it looks like. Hard to tell really.

Burgers... depends on the burger. The Big Guys, McD's, Jack in the Box, etc that buy in major bulk offer a $1-2 burger... but they also have ones that are 3, 4, 5, even 6 before tax... and that doesn't even cover the 'gourmet' shops or the mom and pop places who don't get that bulk discount and have to charge more.... again before taxes, and no tariffs involved since these are American companies. We pay a LOT for advertising I think.

Pizza... easily $30 for two... sometimes they'll have a special where you can get them for $10each IF you order 3... but that's the special, not their regular pricing. But you also have the option of going to the grocery and buying from the deli or from the freezer and heating it at home and it's a LOT cheaper. Tom Thumb has Family Fridays where you can get a pepperoni for $5 that you cook... haven't tried it so I donno how it compares to Pizza Hut, but price wise *hops to pizzahut.com* Ah, yeah they just lowered their menu price so you can get a large (up to three toppings) for $10.. of course that doesn't include the delivery fee, taxes, or tip. Pizza at the grocery store is considered food and thus isn't taxed, just the flat $5. Depends just how much cooking it is worth to you.

I don't know much about beer, but I know that a six pack can easily cost six dollars, plus tax... I've noticed those signs in the grocery. Seems there's a discount for buying a case, rather than six, but I can't quote those prices off hand.

Booze... depends SO much on what booze. If you get the off brand you can get a jug of the stuff for $15-18... but if you want the 'real stuff' then that same jug can cost you $30, 40, 50... depends a LOT on brand (and thus ad costs) and that's before tax.

Gas varies, but mostly it's staying between 2 and 4 dollars per gallon, not litre. And that does include all applicable taxes. But that's in Texas, it varies not only by state, but even by STREET. Go a mile down the road and you could save a dime/gallon or more. Oil isn't that expensive either... the good stuff, in a case of 12, I've seen for $15 or less, tack on 8% sales tax and still not bad.

Cigs... again it's BRAND that makes the difference. Marlboro can easily run you $7/pack... but the generics are $4 plus sales tax... other taxes are already in there. Same poisons involved, but one spends millions (billions?) on ads and the other doesn't.

Actually, come to think of it there's a lot of that here.... I usually stick to generics myself, cereals and milk and shoes and toilet paper... they're easily less than half the price and IMO just as good. You notice the slightly different recipe in some things, like peanut butter... but then you notice the diff between Jif and Peter Pan and pick which works for you. But a lot of folks, MIL for instance, just HAVE to have the name brand... gotta gotta... and so they pay for it. Do you guys have those kinds of huge gaps in pricing up there? I've never visited so I really have no idea.

Mechanics, landscapers... easily that high around here. They'll charge you $40 just to put the computer on your car and find out why your gas light is on (friend was really peeved to find she'd paid $40 bucks because when she filled up she didn't screw the cap in tight enough)... n'mind the cost to fix anything. And there are constantly landscaping folks going around with flyers and cards... just to mow (and remember we're talking city yards, MAYBE 1/4acre for most including the house, driveway, etc.) can easily run you $20... and that's the cheap ones... $30 is more common... add in any extras, like edging or blowing all the clippings out... shoots way up. Just like the pizza thing, way cheaper to DIY... really boils down to how much your time is worth to you.

But still, having to tack on 15% to all those things... even the ones where our pricing is close... OUCH! But if you were getting an awesome system like UKs for that price... hey I'd prolly be for it. But it doesn't sound like you are... sounds like you guys are somewhere between what we've got and what UK has instead... service wise you're us, tax wise your (more than?) UK.

 

[Hillsvale]

well I am not certain that the McD's thing is sales tax unless they are importing stuff from the US and that is taxed to death but our minimum wage in Nova Scotia is 9.65... that wage is supposed to put someone working a 40 hour week at that rate onto the "cost of living, scarping by" list. Everything is more expensive here... cigarettes are taxed to death, I think they are about 10.50 a package of 25!! Housing prices....

 

[rebelcowboysnb]

Pizza... easily $30 for two...

Thank god for CiCis Pizza. $5 all you can eat pizza bar.​

 

[redhen]

Quote:
Thank god for CiCis Pizza. $5 all you can eat pizza bar.

Man.. i tried finding one of those places around us up here when i saw those commericals... it looks good.

But theres none in our area..