Mommarunyon

Chirping
Oct 8, 2021
28
86
54
Ohio
The feed you have pictured is not layer feed. I'm confused.
You are correct it is not a layer feed, the layer feed was in completely different bags, it was personally mixed via the feed store and was in all white feed sacks, sewed shut with ingredients written on the bag.

The feed pictured is an all flock feed "FOR POULTRY OVER 8 WEEKS"

According to the sales rep, this type of feed has crumbles to large for 1 week old guineas and chicks to digest. If this is untrue, then I'm back to searching for the cause of death😭😭😭; however since I put them back on chick starter every is happy and healthy🙂
 

U_Stormcrow

Free Ranging
Jun 7, 2020
5,234
15,833
626
North FL Panhandle Region / Wiregrass
One of my chicks died because Feed store gave me medicated chick feed and I didn't notice until to late.
"Medicated" feed doesn't kill birds. Amprolium in the doses found in feed can't block enough Thiamine (B1) to matter (to them). Moreover, its easily reversible and hardly sudden in its effects. You'd have to ignore your birds clearly very sick behaviors for a lengthy period for them to die of Thiamine deficiency.

Correlation is not causation.

At 5x normal doses, in a study of Ross 308 chicks (male and female) submitted for EU approval of Amprolium, there were NO CLINICAL DIFFERENCES between birds fed no Amprolium, standard dosage Amrpolium, and 5x the recommended dose of Amprolium, apart from their observed coccidia loads. Give this a read.

This is from back in 1962. The doses studied were 2,000 ppm, 4,000 ppm, and up to 20,000 ppm. The current standard dosage is 125 mg/kg, or 125 ppm.

Here in the US, Amprolium-treated feed is offered essentially non-stop to commercial battery egg layers all their lives. Its one of the safest drugs we have available to us as chicken keepers, and is extremely well studied over a lengthy period where high toxicity costs commercial growers interested in maximizing the bottom line.
 
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Kiki

🙄🤚Do More!😘🖖
Project Manager
Premium Feather Member
6 Years
Jul 31, 2015
126,006
834,023
2,182
Houston, TX
My Coop
My Coop
I was not aware that was a possibility. According to the feed rep the feed killed them due to the larger crumbles and their inability to digest them?
Birds eat rocks and can digest them.

Just because a person works for a feed company does not necessarily mean they know what they're talking about.
 

Kiki

🙄🤚Do More!😘🖖
Project Manager
Premium Feather Member
6 Years
Jul 31, 2015
126,006
834,023
2,182
Houston, TX
My Coop
My Coop
You are correct it is not a layer feed, the layer feed was in completely different bags, it was personally mixed via the feed store and was in all white feed sacks, sewed shut with ingredients written on the bag.

The feed pictured is an all flock feed "FOR POULTRY OVER 8 WEEKS"

According to the sales rep, this type of feed has crumbles to large for 1 week old guineas and chicks to digest. If this is untrue, then I'm back to searching for the cause of death😭😭😭; however since I put them back on chick starter every is happy and healthy🙂
For the 12th time this feed did not kill your birds... Unless it was full of mold. Please remember that you can send a dead bird overnight to your state lab to get an answer.
 

Wolf River

In the Brooder
Sep 4, 2021
11
40
44
North East Wisconsin
I am sharing my story of stupidity in hopes of preventing another senseless tragedy from occurring in another coop.

Backround: Recently my small farm decided to start supporting small family owned companies over large box stores. In doing this we choose to purchase feed from a local feed store, that has been owned by the same family for several generations.

Upon arrival I felt warm ❤❤ knowing I was supporting a local business, instead of a large company. I pulled in at saw pedigree swine show feed clearance for $10 instead of the $21 we would normally pay at TSC or Rural King! I couldn't believe it and began looking around for other good deals. I took my time strolling through the store comparing prices to that of the Big stores, everything seemed about the same or cheaper; so I grab what I need and headed to the counter. Once at the counter, I inform the owner I want all of the clearance swine show feed, 1 bag of chick starter (non medicated due to feeding ducklings) 2 bags of barley seed (to grow foliage) and 8 bags of mixed egg layer(to stick up for winter feeding)
I paid around $350 because my daughter added some items she wanted to get her little sister, who will be showing a market steer at the fair for the first time, for Christmas; I'm and I leave. When I arrive home I unload and put away all my feed, until I come to my chick starter and I see it's medicated; we are all human, mistakes happen🤷‍♀️. I call and arrange an exchange the following day.

The following day I drive the hour back down, 1 way, to exchange my the medicated feed for 2 bags of non medicated chick starter. As the worker loads me I see the bag says livestock feed and I questioned him. "Are you sure that is chick starter, it says livestock feed? " he replied "yes, we only carry 3 types of crumble which is medicated, and non- medicated 20% chick starter and a layer crumble. We have sold this to the tri-state area for years without problems" I left confident that I had the right feed. When I get home, I fill my feeders give fresh water and proceeded about my day.

The following day I go about my feed routine, everything is going great until I get to the guinea pin, where I found 3 dead guineas. Now my guineas are only a week old; considering it was my first time raising them, I thought it may have been from the stress transporting them or something I did. I removed the deceased, bury them and continued about my day.

During my evening feed check, I find 2 more guineas dead; again I figure I must be doing something wrong since it's only affecting my guineas. Determined to figure out what was going wrong with my guineas, I start a deep dive into how to raise guineas. The only thing I find that I was doing was using pine chips as bedding, which I thought might be killing them. I rush to change the bedding and turn in fir the night.

The following morning I make my rounds again, paying special attention to guineas, 2 had died, leaving me 1 left. The next pin I now have 1 chick dead and 1 who looked as if he was on his way out! Finally this point I realize something else is going on and start racking my brain to figure out what we did differently. The only thing we changed was the food, instantly I pulled the food!

My next step was to call the feed store and discuss what happened and what could be wrong with the feed they provided me. They assured me nothing was wrong and that it had to be something else. She said she would further investigate the problem and call me back.

She called me back and stated, "the head of wildlife came in and she discussed it with him even if I had fed my ducks or guineas medicated it wouldn't have harmed them; that he feeds it to his flock all the time! Further stating the feedthey sold me was chick starter! " Now I'm unsure where this statement came from as I was concerned about the feed not being a chick starter as I knew it wasn't medicated. I'm starting to believe that these so called experts are NOT experts and call the manufacturer. The manufacturer asks me to refer to the tag attached to the bag. I inform the manufacturer that a tag wasn't attached to this particular bag; however I had another bag at our other farm and would check there! I was told since the tag was MIA there was no way to identify my feed; also, it should not have been sold it without the tag it! The only option left was to direct me to the regional sales reps, which I received his cell number, called and left a message.

In the meantime I headed to the other farm to check for a tag on the other bag I purchased. Luckily the tag was still attached to the other bag but by this time the mill I purchased the feed from was closed. I called another mill and told them what happened to my flock; then read him the information from the tag. The other mills owner requested pictures of the bag and tag text to him during our conversation, which I obliged. He examined the photos and said " your problem was the feed; examine the small print! The instructions say for poultry over 8 weeks! " this destroyed me as i trusted the experts and didn't even think to read the small print.

Today the sales rep called me, we discussed everything that happened to my flock, the feed I was sold and what the feed store told me; also requesting pictures of the bag and tag. He assured me that what I was sold was NOT chick starter and apologized over and over to me; even offering me a free bag of feed. I explained that I was just happy to get to the bottom of the issue and requested he re-educate the mill to prevent this situation from happening to other first time feather parents, while declining the free bag of food. He promised he would be at the mill within the hour and the mill WOULD NOT sale this food as chick starter again!

If you have made it with me this far thank you for reading my story of stupidity and tragedy! Please use my experience as a precautionary tale to:

ALWAYS TRUST YOUR GUT, IF SOMETHING DOESN'T FEEL OR SOUND RIGHT IT PROBABLY ISN'T RIGHT!

IF THE TAG ISN'T ON THE BAG DON'T BUY IT

ALWAYS READ ALL TAGS, EVEN THE SMALL PRINT!

IF YOU ARE STILL UNSURE CALL SOMEONE FOR A SECOND OPINION!

Most importantly NEVER BLINDLY TRUST ANYONE, EVEN THE ONES THAT SHOULD BE EXPERTS, WITH YOUR BABIES FOOD!

Pictures below are of the bag and tag that I was sold as chick starter!


I felt it was urgent to get my experience out, to other first time feather parents, which is why i quickly wrote this in between chores and have not proof read it; therefore, please excuse all grammatical and spelling errors!

Thank you in advance
Momma Runyon
Holy Shit. If that happened to me some heads woulda rolled!
 

U_Stormcrow

Free Ranging
Jun 7, 2020
5,234
15,833
626
North FL Panhandle Region / Wiregrass
I was not aware that was a possibility. According to the feed rep the feed killed them due to the larger crumbles and their inability to digest them?
[ahem]

BULL $#!+

That is all.

Send the bird for Necropsy, call the mill with the feed label, ask for production date.

What are the facts? Again and again and again-what are the facts? Shun wishful thinking, ignore divine revelation, forget what “the stars foretell,” avoid opinion, care not what the neighbors think, never mind the unguessable “verdict of history”--what are the facts, and to how many decimal places? You pilot always into an unknown future; facts are your single clue. Get the facts!

- Robert A Heinlein
 

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