Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

[Christie Rhae]

Quote:
mmm M&M'S... Chocolate eggs......mmmm I think I need a snack. lol

 

[Rainwolf]

For those who have questions about breeding, building coops, trap nest, and poultry management.....

www.Archive.org is a great source for the heritage information. I use these books a lot, for breeding information, combined with today's genetic knowledge.

Anyhow it is great reading

Poultry breeding and management (1916)
http://www.archive.org/details/poultrybreeding00drydgoog

Breeding poultry for exhibition (1900)
http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924003178112

Breeding poultry for egg production (1911)
http://www.archive.org/details/breedingpoultry00unkngoog

The people's practical poultry book: a work on the breeds, breeding, rearing, and general management of poultry (1871)
http://www.archive.org/details/peoplespractical00lewi

I also use archive.org for information on food storage, construction, carpentry, recipes, and much more!

 

[flowerchild59]

Thanks for posting such good links and great information.

 

[Rainwolf]

Thanks for posting such good links and great information.

welcome
Enjoy reading! I love the fact that some books come in kindle format too.

 

[Hennypen]

Tail feathers.. Yes I agree somewhat with your perspective but pedigree and strain are essentially the same thing in chicken breeding world. Chickens have no pedigree therefore strain and pedigree is one and the same.

I do understand where you are coming from in regards to what traits have been bred for in someone's lines, but I would rather use birds from tthe same strain as my birds over birds from a totally new (unknown) gene pool. You say it's best to maintain a closed flock, why is using the same strain from a different farm any different than using your own closed flock? It's essentially the same thing, other than being several generations removed, is it not?

And I say there are many different ways to "skin a cat" so to speak so who cares how someone gets there. It may take "the flock breeder" longer to get that perfect chicken but if it doesn't bother them why should they be seen as any less of a breeder? I don't get why the need for that long dissertation.

 

[Fat Chick]

Quote:

HP, your post is logical. However, I'd add a couple of things. First, you may be confusing "strain" with "line". Secondly, and perhaps even more important, it makes no difference whatsoever whose "line" you get five generations back IF you don't know a whole lot more information.

For example, suppose you get birds from someone who got birds from me five years ago. But they focused on entirely different traits than I have been. Or more importantly, the least of their focus was on traits that are the most important to you and that you've been working on five years with continued improvement. Getting those birds would, in all likelihood, probably set your current status back five years.

This is just another reason why I recommend maintaining a closed flock and linebreeding.

In the interest of saving time, I'm pasting a post from an Anthony Francis on the Welsummers Group. He makes some excellent point which really emphasis much of what's going on today. Here is something he recently said:

"Another problem I see is hobby breeders can be breeders with many
different techniques for all kinds of purpose-I.E.

1.The "quick buck breeders"- They are the buy the lastest (overly) high priced "fad" that they better be quick about producing "stock" to
sell before the bottom falls out breeder. Cull none, sell all, and on to the next! If they take long and breed to serious, they could be
caught holding the bag!

2.The "became a breeder over night breeder"- They are the Buy the most exspensive dozen of eggs and a cheap bator from the hottest line of their preferred breed breeder. I.E.- 150 $ dozen hatching eggs and a 49 $ incubator and what ever hatches out are ALL bench quality breeders! I'm sure its hard to cull from this hatch when so much is spent and all go to the breeding pen brothers and sisters alike!
Faults and all!

3.The "true breeders"- They are the take time to learn breeding tech., breed to the standards, cull heavy, small numbers, keep track, learn the line, take years to improve, ect,ect, breeders!

4.The "kinda nasty breeders"- They are the have decent stock, use somewhat good breeding practices but may have a little sickness which they cant seem to be able to get rid of breeder.

5.The "flock breeders"- They are the as long as they seem to be of right varity within the breed, a flock is made breeder. They may Cull
extreme faults depending on the supply/demand then adjust the size of the flock according with possible all in all out breeding tech. using brothers and sisters generation after generation!

6.The "closed flock breeder" - They are the get what varity of breed their wanting, take the good with the bad, then try breed with the
best of their abilty to get the best they can breeder.

The list can go on and on with even combinations included! and depending on the breeding tech. used by the breeder, they may never
quaify for either term to be properly used.


I might not have said that all the same way but I think he covers the bases pretty well.

God Bless,

That's a great list! I can think of 2 more places that needs to be about now....

 

[BarnGoddess01]

Quote:

I know we would all like to divorce ourselves from the garbage that inevitably crops up but what if I take birds that are F1 birds out of, for example, Jean's birds or John Blehm's, but I made the decision about who to breed to whom to create the birds, then start cleaning up at the shows - Jean and/or John are to get no credit for that? I'm not entirely sure I agree with that. Folks are going to want to know where my birds came from - and they have a right to know where my birds came from - good OR bad. It goes without saying that I might have a hand in what crops up BUT I don't think it is reasonable to expect folks to walk away from blood lines - in any species.

 

[mendocinosunris]

Thanks for the links. This is very helpful

For those who have questions about breeding, building coops, trap nest, and poultry management.....
www.Archive.org is a great source for the heritage information. I use these books a lot, for breeding information, combined with today's genetic knowledge.
Anyhow it is great reading

Poultry breeding and management (1916)
http://www.archive.org/details/poultrybreeding00drydgoog
Breeding poultry for exhibition (1900)
http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924003178112
Breeding poultry for egg production (1911)
http://www.archive.org/details/breedingpoultry00unkngoog
The people's practical poultry book: a work on the breeds, breeding, rearing, and general management of poultry (1871)
http://www.archive.org/details/peoplespractical00lewi
I also use archive.org for information on food storage, construction, carpentry, recipes, and much more!

 

[FLF]

I have to say that breeding horses are entirely different. With a horse's pedigree, you know that you are getting select genes from an individual horse. Like I know if I see Impressive on a pedigrree, I'd best test for HYPP if the ofsprings status isn't listed. So yes, HORSE pedigree tells you alot. Horses also don't reproduce as quickly. It is a lot harder to ruin (or improve) an entire line in a year or two.

Chickens don't have a pedigree that tells you which exact chicken they come from. So you have to hope that the parents are great examples of the breed. They also reproduce so quickly that alot of harm (or again improvement) can be done in a couple years time. There are certain ranches/breeders out there I'd by a horse with Sonny Dee Bar on the papers, but wouldn't another horse from them, just because it's a horse they've bred.

I do think, if possible, it's good to take into account where the lines originate from (and how long ago they recieved thier birds from that breeder), I'm just saying one shouldn't be blinded by seeing "Such and Such's" line, and say well that's jus like buying directly from Such an Such. You never know, those birds could be culls, sold at a sale, or they could be great birds. It's a gamble unless you get them directly from that specific breeder.

I don't think Tailfeathers is being mean, just sharing veiw point. It's a great point of dicussion, there is alot of it going on out there.

 

[Reyvaughn]

Oh, this topic is just like a Discovery Channel Soap Opera. Never a dull day! Well, if there is, it's because no one posted.

On the subject of who's line is or isn't... I like to know where the person got their flock from. I want to see if it's Blehm, Schaffer, Smith, ect. If they have 2 generations into there breeding, I'd like to know that, too. If I go and get birds from Smith and I keep my Smith birds in their own pen and I still call them Smith's line, I believe I am in the right. And, for example, if I cross them with my CrystalCreek and Blehm lines and cull for what I want, then they are my line.

And on a whole different subject... TSC sucked me in. I had a moment of weakness and came home with 6 new Easter Eggers. I feel like such a traitor to my Ameraucanas...