animal protein chicken feed

[Fairview01]

I've given up on finding any quality poultry feed with animal protein. Its an issue for me during the winter months. My chickens free range. I was pleased to see Purina is producing a feed with black soldier fly larva (as another poster mentioned in this thread) but when I contacted them about how much was in the feed I got a disappointing answer. After reading the label it turns out there is more calcium than BSFL and they wont disclose how much is in the feed. So its probably very little. Chickens didn't find it very palatable so I suspect it doesn't reduce cravings for animal protein and is mostly soy based.

The irony of it is three years ago Purina decided to make a feed for honey bees with an animal based protein using chicken blood of all things. Honey bees don't EVER require animal proteins and the beekeeping community did not receive it well at all.

I would gladly pay extra for a quality feed just like others are willing to pay more for organic.

Readily available from most feed stores. Always read the label. I mix my own custom feed ration and include this. Adult birds will eat it like corn once they recognize it as food. I had to withhold hold their regular food for a day or two and get them hungry and once they learned it was food they would jump on it.

You will not find a wholly based animal protein poultry feed on the market. It is just too expensive. My poultry ration is based on USDA poultry formulas from circa 1910-1920. They contained animal protein but first protein listed is plant. Once consumed protein is protein. The only reason animal protein is considered superior is because it contains essential amino acids that are naturally absent or severely deficient in plant proteins.

 

[Folly's place]

Which is why feeds are supplemented with the amino acids necessary to make the feed complete for poultry.
Mary

 

[Fairview01]

Which is why feeds are supplemented with the amino acids necessary to make the feed complete for poultry.
Mary

There are 12 amino acids that are considered essential amino acids. Since these can not be created by rearranging other amino acids poultry need to comsume them in that form. When any of these are deficient they become limiting growth factors. Of these 12, 5 are considered especially critical in juvenile poultry - lysine, methionine, arginine cysteine* and tryptophan. Are there any US poutry nutrition labels out there that list the 12 less alone the last 5.

The fatty acids linolenic and arachidonic acids are essential fatty acids.

A deficiency of choline can cause fatty liver syndrome and perosis in chicks.

The catfish feed i use to supplement my plant based poultry feed does a better job listing these essential ingredients than any bag of poultry feed I've read.

I don't trust what i cant read. Across the counter poultry feeds are formulated to contain the minimal level of ingredients to return an acceptable profit for the investment made by corporations that purchase feed by the rail car load.

 

[Apis mellifera]

Which is why feeds are supplemented with the amino acids necessary to make the feed complete for poultry.
Mary

When I compare poultry that are fed just a commercial feed without access to forage, to my flock, they do not look as healthy and productive. In fact I know a few people who do that and have a hard time getting eggs, especially this time of year. I maybe totally wrong, but I cant see feeding poultry just a commercial feed and expecting them to be fine and live a long an productive life. To me something is missing with or without amino acids and whatever else is added to poultry feed. When I bring chickens to sales the difference is more apparent and I sell out fast.

 

[Folly's place]

This is not about having an argument, at least not from my end.
'Forage' is also relative, and covers a lot of turf, depending on so many factors. My birds range too, but there's less available to them on snow and frozen ground that during other seasons. And I have been happy with them on their current diet, not home made, and with limited animal proteins available during the winter.
We buy what's fresh, by mill date, and that varies depending on everyone's location, not on some 'perfect' diet available only one place.
Discussions are fun and interesting though.
Mary

 

[Cindy in PA]

But you gave them Kudos...and you've been in this game long enough to know how the big print on the bags is very often misleading in order to sell more product.

Yes, you are right, bad Purina. We don't know enough to give them credit, but we do know enough to condemn Purina for jumping into a possible wave of the future. I know of no national company that will give proprietary info to the public. There are smaller companies that are very forthcoming. I know now that if you do not free range your birds, they are in fact not healthy. To each his own. I will continue to try to get more info.

 

[aart]

Yes, you are right, bad Purina. We don't know enough to give them credit, but we do know enough to condemn Purina for jumping into a possible wave of the future. I know of no national company that will give proprietary info to the public. There are smaller companies that are very forthcoming. I know now that if you do not free range your birds, they are in fact not healthy. To each his own. I will continue to try to get more info.

I'm not condemning Purina
(I've used Purina for cats, dogs, and chickens for decades)
or any other brand.
But I do freely condemn any manufacturer of any product for misleading labeling and/or advertising....and am also not too tolerant of people who spread that misinformation.
I call it how I see it, untruths set me off.

Like, this is BS:

I know now that if you do not free range your birds, they are in fact not healthy.

That may be the case of some confined birds, but not all of them.
There are too many variables involved for such a blanket statement.

 

[Cindy in PA]

I'm not condemning Purina
(I've used Purina for cats, dogs, and chickens for decades)
or any other brand.
But I do freely condemn any manufacturer of any product for misleading labeling and/or advertising....and am also not too tolerant of people who spread that misinformation.
I call it how I see it, untruths set me off.

Like, this is BS:
That may be the case of some confined birds, but not all of them.
There are too many variables involved for such a blanket statement.

Ok, my bad, the free ranging stuff was contained in this thread, it was my attempt at a joke from frustration, I don't free range. Not sure how you know Purina's label is in fact misleading, but OK. My point is that we have one contact with Purina & that now means we know they are in fact misleading the public. Calcium is contained in higher amounts than fly larvae, unless someone has done all the calculations for this feed, we still know next to nothing.

 

[aart]

Ok, my bad, the free ranging stuff was contained in this thread, it was my attempt at a joke from frustration, I don't free range.

Sorry, missed the facetious sarcasm aspect....but did wonder if you were serious or not as I've always found you to be down to earth.

Not sure how you know Purina's label is in fact misleading, but OK. My point is that we have one contact with Purina & that now means we know they are in fact misleading the public. Calcium is contained in higher amounts than fly larvae, unless someone has done all the calculations for this feed, we still know next to nothing.

They tout the larvae but it's almost to little to even count...yes, just by the one contact and no, we don't really know. Long experience tells me it IS a marketing ploy.
I am a truly jaded skeptic, but for pretty good reason.

 

[Acre4Me]

Just out of curiosity and since others were looking for animal-protein based feeds to use as a supplement, I came across what appears to be a high level of animal protein feed (for dogs) and is $$$. Canidae feeds. There are 4 choices.

The info below is from the dry FISH formula:

So, primarily animal protein. Salt and Ca levels? Are Garbanzo beans ok for chickens?

The cheapest price is for a 20# bag, which costs approx $80, but is available in smaller bag sizes.