Answer to the Delaware Dilemma

[speckledhen]

The female Del has barring at one end and laced black at the other. Another very difficult situation. In dogs you have recognized colors that are pretty predictable and possibly something like a white chest, forehead, etc to go along with the main color. In addition most of us don't really know how these chickens were "made". A chicken can look like an APA recognized breed and have very little if any of that breed in them.

Walt, you are so right about that one! I have one pullet who looks just like a rich, dark RIR. She has nice single comb, yellow legs, lays a brown egg. Her sire is a BLRW rooster and her mother is an Ameraucana, a Blue/Black/Splash variety (not sure which exact color); I watched her hatch from a blue egg sent to me as an extra by someone. How she came out looking this way is just one of those weird genetics puzzles, though someone did tell me that if the rooster wasn't pure for rose comb and the hen wasn't pure for pea comb, a small percentage come out with single combs. Of course, her body shape is off for a RIR, but if someone doesn't realize that, they'd peg her a RIR and a very nice, dark one.

I've always said the Delaware was very challenging. And we're also dealing with a breed that almost disappeared entirely, so breeding stock was hard to come by, and coming back from obscurity in addition to the different male/female colors makes it really an uphill battle.​

 

[fowlman01]

Quote:
Walt, you are so right about that one! I have one pullet who looks just like a rich, dark RIR. She has nice single comb, yellow legs, lays a brown egg. Her sire is a BLRW rooster and her mother is an Ameraucana, a Blue/Black/Splash variety (not sure which exact color); I watched her hatch from a blue egg sent to me as an extra by someone. How she came out looking this way is just one of those weird genetics puzzles, though someone did tell me that if the rooster wasn't pure for rose comb and the hen wasn't pure for pea comb, a small percentage come out with single combs. Of course, her body shape is off for a RIR, but if someone doesn't realize that, they'd peg her a RIR and a very nice, dark one.

I've always said the Delaware was very challenging. And we're also dealing with a breed that almost disappeared entirely, so breeding stock was hard to come by, and coming back from obscurity in addition to the different male/female colors makes it really an uphill battle.

Shhh......don't tell anyone, but I know of a case where a bird won super grand champion at a National meet with 3500+ birds and it was only half Plymouth Rock. Visually there is no way to know if a chicken is pure bred, with the color and type fixed. That rich dark mahogany red of the RIR is specific to the Red, so it is a great example of what can happen. You had a very extreme example of this. The body form of the Del should not take too long to get, but the color is very challenging. Anytime you have a different color at the extremities, you are going to have problems. Lakenvelders are an example of that and they don't have barring! The barring adds to the color problems. Most of the Dels I have seen on here tend to be light colored and what is even stranger about them is that the color is migrating to other parts of the body even though they are light. That usually only happens in birds that are too dark.

Walt

 

[speckledhen]

I'll never tell, Walt, LOL!

 

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
Are you saying that the color in the hackles should be darker, for example?

 

[fowlman01]

Quote:
Are you saying that the color in the hackles should be darker, for example?

Yes. The females seem to have more of a problem with this than the males. The females also seem to have problems getting rich black feathers in the tail. I can only see what is visible in the posted pics though. I had a female Del here a few years back that had rich black tail feathers and she even had partial lacing around them. It would be interesting to see if the darker hackled birds still had white quills and shafts in the hackle feathers.

Walt

 

[joletabey]

I wondered about that, too. My girls hackle feathers are all grey, except for the one with really messy markings. I had wondered if she would breed it out with my too light roo, but since he died yesterday, I guess I will not know.

She has the best tail, though, since she does have an ATTEMPT at the laced feathers, even if they are messily laced and incorrect. None of my other girls have that, and it is on the picture in the SOP.

I think her tail is getting closer to what it should be, but her hackles are a mess:

hehehe, just for an example of what a mess is!

Oh, and her quills are white.

 

[fowlman01]

Yes, she does have an attempt at lacing and her feathers look pretty black. In the picture below....... that the female "appears" to have some Columbian lacing going on at the shoulder level. That is usually accompanied by black in the feather shaft, but not always. It looks as if it is barred further up though. Are people putting Columbian colored birds into Dels? It would be hard to tell unless the you see a black or partially black shaft. Even that would not be not be a positive indicator. That bird has white quills, so I'm not sure why it is showing some Columbian type color.

Walt

 

[speckledhen]

Walt, some hatcheries have been actually breeding in Columbian Rocks, though Beth's birds are not hatchery stock. Hers were progeny of mine and mine came out of Meier and McDaniel lines. I even saw an old Welp Hatchery ad that said "Delaware/Columbian Rock".

 

[jeremy]

I have a question about black feathers that are visible underneath white ones, specifically in the back and saddle areas. My pullet from Cyn has some of these "hidden" feathers along her back and I was wondering genetially what that might mean?

It's not the typical smutty black that you usually see, it's like there are random black feathers hidden below several others, making the pullet have a gray appearance in some places. Have you seen this before Cyn? Does it typically molt out?

Also, is this the "black creeping into the white areas" that you were talking about Walt?
I'll try to get some pictures today.

 

[fowlman01]

Quote:
It is not quite as bad if they tell you they did it, but it still makes it difficult for people who want the proper color/type. Someone in this thread has some Welp birds, and they are not regular posters, but I can't remember where I saw that. Barring usually overpowers everything, but that does not seem to be the case with Dels for some reason. As you noted the Dels are difficult. I will be visiting with Duane Urch of MN in a couple months, so I will pick his brain about Del conformation and color. He had very good ones. That is where the female I had came from.

Walt