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So what is the answer? Could that it be much worse than adding light sussex or coumbian? mostly unrealted birds except slightly similar color. I just read an article where one of the heritage breeding farms was working on correcting the barring in the tails, darkening the barring and working to eliminate the washed greys and lightness...How bad can it be to add a little of the foundation stock back into the breed..Australian breeders did it with australorps they were deliberate and knew what they were after...they re-introduced the cooper type blk orps to reduce tail size and give the birds a better curved shape back on the great bird of curves...granted not a color breed like dels...So Im just asking wouldnt it strengthen slightly the critically endangered del breed that according to a few breeders Ive talked to seem to go infertal younger than some other breeds..It just sounds like the whole thing kind of needs a shot in the arm , but not a breed that just looks similar color a delaware in color.
Boy if you ever judge a show walt, your not going to take this breed lightly are you..LOL
I will be judging at Columbus, but I don't know what I will be judging yet. I don't know much about breeding Delawares for color, but I am learning. I feel confident judging them, but not giving breeding advice other than techiniques that are used in most breeds. I don't know how to make that color, but I know that the barring has to come from a Barred Rock.
They did come from sports with the BRXNH cross. I had never thought of sports in that way because once you cross breeds anything can happen, but the sports from that cross come out with white bodies. I don't know how often they occur either.
Maybe the new Del club can make this a breeding project.
Walt
I thinks its a great idea that this group make it thier project.
An example is this:
When a man in england didnt think a barred breed of chicken had a finished look, he worked on a project to improve the over all look of the breed but did not call the breed the origional bird whcih was lets say a barred rock, I read the story a while ago (still out on net somewhere) practical poultry featured it).. and cant remember the name of what breed he wanted to give a finished look..except it was barred...Instead of calling his beautiful new creation a barred rock, he named his new bird the sussex checkered...He was very specific in methods and kept detailed records of what he was doing... then he worked on getting this new breed into the british standard by attracting followers ect... all of that.
When it comes to this delaware dilema,,,the decision was not made by someone trying to make a small improvement and the name of this cross was never changed --delaware,X columbian...not such a bad thing, but needs a new name...this was decided by hatcheries to not improve the bird but to improve the bottom line..a big demand for a heritage breed that tends to go infertile a little younger than other breeds...Many new breeds are based in an old breed but give it a new name..columbaware or delaian or something..I dont think it was a project idea just a supply and demand bottom line decision...Now if somone wanted to improve this breed, there is an answer they just need to find it..I agree with joletabey that the records were messy and not very well written out on the origional breeders thoughts on how this happened and evolved and I would be willing to bet that some english bird like light sussex might have been way back there not columbian...Too bad he didnt write his thoughts on this when he started breeding them...Maybe he did..well theres part of the project...contact the family who origionally bred this bird and see what old things you might find out..be like the history detectives on PBS...there might be a lot more written about this story out there we just dont know , might be worth the effort..
Its just too bad that he didnt write a better history and thoughts..I think some of todays breeders see what happened and write details of what they did and how they did it..There is a group in australia who are working on a series of educational books on thier breeds , why cant we...the australorp by ray connor is a great book for both beginner and expert get something out of that mans experience..we need to scrape every bit of information together and someday publish our own detailed books like that that are both interesting and educational.and might have to admit we just dont know on some of it, lost to time are some of the peices.maybe somone who is really determined can dig out more historical info....as for ray connor, he was 18 time world champion australorp on a bare minimum no more than 50 birds at any one time..people say, well that cant be done you need thousands, not true and he proved it..
So what is the answer? Could that it be much worse than adding light sussex or coumbian? mostly unrealted birds except slightly similar color. I just read an article where one of the heritage breeding farms was working on correcting the barring in the tails, darkening the barring and working to eliminate the washed greys and lightness...How bad can it be to add a little of the foundation stock back into the breed..Australian breeders did it with australorps they were deliberate and knew what they were after...they re-introduced the cooper type blk orps to reduce tail size and give the birds a better curved shape back on the great bird of curves...granted not a color breed like dels...So Im just asking wouldnt it strengthen slightly the critically endangered del breed that according to a few breeders Ive talked to seem to go infertal younger than some other breeds..It just sounds like the whole thing kind of needs a shot in the arm , but not a breed that just looks similar color a delaware in color.
Boy if you ever judge a show walt, your not going to take this breed lightly are you..LOL
I will be judging at Columbus, but I don't know what I will be judging yet. I don't know much about breeding Delawares for color, but I am learning. I feel confident judging them, but not giving breeding advice other than techiniques that are used in most breeds. I don't know how to make that color, but I know that the barring has to come from a Barred Rock.
They did come from sports with the BRXNH cross. I had never thought of sports in that way because once you cross breeds anything can happen, but the sports from that cross come out with white bodies. I don't know how often they occur either.
Maybe the new Del club can make this a breeding project.
Walt
I thinks its a great idea that this group make it thier project.
An example is this:
When a man in england didnt think a barred breed of chicken had a finished look, he worked on a project to improve the over all look of the breed but did not call the breed the origional bird whcih was lets say a barred rock, I read the story a while ago (still out on net somewhere) practical poultry featured it).. and cant remember the name of what breed he wanted to give a finished look..except it was barred...Instead of calling his beautiful new creation a barred rock, he named his new bird the sussex checkered...He was very specific in methods and kept detailed records of what he was doing... then he worked on getting this new breed into the british standard by attracting followers ect... all of that.
When it comes to this delaware dilema,,,the decision was not made by someone trying to make a small improvement and the name of this cross was never changed --delaware,X columbian...not such a bad thing, but needs a new name...this was decided by hatcheries to not improve the bird but to improve the bottom line..a big demand for a heritage breed that tends to go infertile a little younger than other breeds...Many new breeds are based in an old breed but give it a new name..columbaware or delaian or something..I dont think it was a project idea just a supply and demand bottom line decision...Now if somone wanted to improve this breed, there is an answer they just need to find it..I agree with joletabey that the records were messy and not very well written out on the origional breeders thoughts on how this happened and evolved and I would be willing to bet that some english bird like light sussex might have been way back there not columbian...Too bad he didnt write his thoughts on this when he started breeding them...Maybe he did..well theres part of the project...contact the family who origionally bred this bird and see what old things you might find out..be like the history detectives on PBS...there might be a lot more written about this story out there we just dont know , might be worth the effort..
Its just too bad that he didnt write a better history and thoughts..I think some of todays breeders see what happened and write details of what they did and how they did it..There is a group in australia who are working on a series of educational books on thier breeds , why cant we...the australorp by ray connor is a great book for both beginner and expert get something out of that mans experience..we need to scrape every bit of information together and someday publish our own detailed books like that that are both interesting and educational.and might have to admit we just dont know on some of it, lost to time are some of the peices.maybe somone who is really determined can dig out more historical info....as for ray connor, he was 18 time world champion australorp on a bare minimum no more than 50 birds at any one time..people say, well that cant be done you need thousands, not true and he proved it..
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