Anyone non-religious here? Please be nice!

[AngieChick]

I think where we live is the opposite of the Bible Belt, Benton County OR was found in a 2003 study to be the "least religious" county in the US, per capita. It's also consistently listed as one of the top 10 places to live, and as one of the safest cities of its size in the US. So, religion is obviously not completely necessary for morality.

I have lived in the Bible Belt (TN), and while it's a beautiful place with many kind people living in it, I certainly didn't feel that I could state my religious beliefs there (even when asked). It's a different place to be an atheist, that's for sure.

 

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
This goes back to what I said before- the people who truly live their faith are typically a delight to be around because they are at peace; and they live by the concepts you mentioned. Others merely wear their faith as a shield, or sometimes a sword. I don't sense any peace at all in such individuals; what I sense is defensiveness; any difference of opinion is seen as a challenge to their beliefs and it seems to unnerve them. That is why it is so essential to them that you believe the same as they do.

That echoes my experience too, Redux. I have friends from several different faiths and have met and worked with many more. The ones that I have regarded as genuine in their beliefs appear no different from other decent people. I have rarely met red faced earnest bible thumpers and god botherers in England except for the occasional eccentric looking person or beaming born-again 20 something year old yelling in a shopping street and they don't trouble anyone. Is there a difference between the cultures of the UK and US that gives rise to the presence of these people in one place and the absence in the other?

I don't want to labour this issue but it seems to underlie quite a few posts and I find it quite disturbing. Would I be going to far if I compared these people with radical Islamists that we see on the television news? Perhaps it is they and their like who are damaging religion and putting off people who might otherwise be inclined to take an interest, despite the good ambassadorship of those who evangelise only by personal example.

 

[deb1]

I live in NC. Trying to explain this region of the country is difficult. It has its own culture, slang and food. There is much that is beautiful here. People can be very polite and kind. There seems to be a lot of respect for elders (out of respect most younger people will call older people Mr or Ms insert first name).

But along with the good, there is a streak of intolerance. There are a set of Christians who are more extremist in their beliefs. If you are the wrong denomination(Catholic or Mormon for example) many people won't consider you a Christian at all. It is assumed that a 'real' Christian has a certain set of believes that are the only true way to believe. I've sat in services where preachers claimed that any other belief system was created by demons! Many people here assume also that a 'real' Christian would never believe in evolution, for example.

I have not told my friends that I am interested in paganism. They would probably not let their children play with my kids if I did so.

I wrote this story on the pagan thread but it exemplifies some of the thinking here.

My 13 year old daughter is highly creative and intelligent. She also likes to play with fashion. Lately she has taken to wearing some black. Her personality is still the bubbly girl that she has always been though. The boy next door is good friends with both my daughters. One day he came to my house and was frightened. A person at his church, who knows our family through his, had told him that because my oldest daughter wore black, her soul could be sucked away(I guess by Satan) and to inform me. This woman terrified not only this poor boy but tried to frighten me through him. So, I assured him that my daughter hadn't changed any and he seemed to feel better.

The Bible Belt is not all bad but it is an unusual place. I don't want to give anyone a completely bad impression of the south. People can be very generous and if someone knows that you need help, they are likely to give you aid even if they have never met you before.

The best way to describe this part of the country is that it has a split personality. The parts that are good are amazingly wonderful and the parts that are bad are really, really, bad.

 

[debilorrah]

Deb1 religion is weird all across this nation. And I know what you mean about the Christians that have to push their beliefs on others too. It is why I left my church. Not my beliefs, but the church.

 

[chicken_china_mom]

My mother always said that she believed the Bible was written by man, for man, and not dictated by God as it is implied. And I tend to agree with her. Also, taking into account the political turmoil that was going on in the Middle East dating all the way back to the time of Moses, it would have been impossible, with the lack of education, for men to write out scrolls with any real degree of accuracy. I find it interesting when I sit in church and I listen to sermons that admit that some of the books of the Bible weren't even written until hundreds of years AFTER the supposed author had died. How is that even possible? It brings to mind the ghost writers for V.C. Andrews. Just because they slap her name on it years after she died doesn't mean she wrote it. I believe that most of the books in the Bible were written with the intentions of influencing people politically, and then later religiously. I find myself faced with more questions as time goes on instead of fewer, and while I am not a conspiracy theorist (I just can't think quite that complicated, lol), I do believe that some religions cover things up in order to maintain a certain sense of control over their followers, and to make themselves seem more rightious. I find it difficult to believe that Jesus, a man, died in his 30's without having married or had children. In a time where they married young and marriages were often arranged, and he was single? Nearly all of his apostles were married, yet their wives weren't mentioned either. Why? I believe that is primarily for the benefit of the Catholic church. The whole idea that only the priest has a direct line to God and that we must go to the priest to ask forgiveness just seems like nonsense to me. I don't think I've been in a confessional since I was 10, and I will never step foot in one again. I have a direct line to God. I don't need to be on my knees in a church, or in a confessional telling a priest all my secrets in order for him to hear me. Back to Jesus being married, I believe he was, and I believe he had children. It was customary for that time period. If you follow the DaVinci Code, you'd be lead to believe that Mary Magdalene was his wife, and seeing as how she was a devout follower of his, it's quite likely. But as I said before, I question things, and nitpick them trying to find answers that satisfy my curiosity and make some sense. And honestly, I always found fault with the story of Creation, seeing as how I tend to lean more towards the theory of evolution. So God makes Adam, then he makes Lillith, but she's too uncontrollable, so he banishes her and creates Eve. Ok, and they have 2 sons, and those sons grow up and get married. Does no one else find it curious that in a time where they were the only 4 people on Earth, the sons got married? Where did the wives come from? And how could there possibly be documentation dating back that far? Isn't that pre-dating writing? See, there's my brain, nit picking things again, more and more questions all the time...

 

[fowltemptress]

Quote:
I was about to say, "And your in Texas?" but then I noticed it says "middle of nowhere, Texas," and I remember how that was.

Other people have asked me how I can handle being an atheist in Texas, and though there is a huge "mega-church" virtually every corner you turn, it's really not as bad as it could be. I think it helps that we are a border state, with different cultures moving in and settling across it. Bigger cities and towns have the same advantage. I honestly think that the inner states that are further away from such stuff, and the smaller towns that don't get the influx of new faces that cities do, are at a disadvantage. It forces you to come in contact with a more diverse population, and thus, a more diverse well of thoughts, ideas, and beliefs, which pretty much forces you to become more accepting without you even realizing it. It's easier to be xenophobic if you're never exposed to anything outside your comfort zone. It sucks for me, because I would love nothing more than to get as far away from any city as humanly possible, but I've tried that and found that the wide open spaces do not make up for having to hide my mind from everyone I come in contact with. The intolerance was suffocating. I've found my compromise, thankfully, but I do still look at those "middle of nowhere" areas wistfully.

 

[chicken_china_mom]

Quote:
I hate when other people try to force their religion on me, or their politics for that matter. I mentioned my guy friend in another post. He is a good guy, sweet, a good friend and we've been friends for about 18 year now, but I refuse to EVER engage him in religious debate. Something came up once a few years back in casual conversation, and he got hot under the collar. I did not. He asked me my point of view on something that I can't even recall today, and he had the audacity to tell me that I was STUPID for believing what I believed. I was stunned and hurt that he would insult me like that, but I tell you, I NEVER made the mistake of talking religion with him again. If he brings it up, which he does a lot, I simply change the subject, or I stay quiet. I will not give him reason to fight me over beliefs that I am entitled to have, and that he has no right to tell me are wrong. I have another friend who had lead a very rough life until she met her husband, but she had always been non religious and she and her husband had always been content. That's until about 4 years or so ago when she suddenly decided that God was missing from her life, so she and her entire family became Born Again Christians. Now, I've ALWAYS tried to keep God close to my heart and lead as moral a life as possible, though sure I've slipped more than once, but I am essentially good. She now thinks that she can dictate to me the error of my ways and why HER beliefs are right and mine are wrong. Why, because she suddenly "Found Jesus"? That's not right in my book. I still love her, she's a wonderful person, but again, I will not discuss religion with her. And I can't begin to describe all my friends that try to force their politics on me. I didn't realize until very recently just how many friends I have in opposing parties. I'm also the lone Cubs fan among all my Sox fan friends, lol. I guess I'm in a minority all the way around!

 

[SunnyDawn]

Quote:
This goes back to what I said before- the people who truly live their faith are typically a delight to be around because they are at peace; and they live by the concepts you mentioned. Others merely wear their faith as a shield, or sometimes a sword. I don't sense any peace at all in such individuals; what I sense is defensiveness; any difference of opinion is seen as a challenge to their beliefs and it seems to unnerve them. That is why it is so essential to them that you believe the same as they do.

That echoes my experience too, Redux. I have friends from several different faiths and have met and worked with many more. The ones that I have regarded as genuine in their beliefs appear no different from other decent people. I have rarely met red faced earnest bible thumpers and god botherers in England except for the occasional eccentric looking person or beaming born-again 20 something year old yelling in a shopping street and they don't trouble anyone. Is there a difference between the cultures of the UK and US that gives rise to the presence of these people in one place and the absence in the other?

I don't want to labour this issue but it seems to underlie quite a few posts and I find it quite disturbing. Would I be going to far if I compared these people with radical Islamists that we see on the television news? Perhaps it is they and their like who are damaging religion and putting off people who might otherwise be inclined to take an interest, despite the good ambassadorship of those who evangelise only by personal example.

No, unfortunately in some instances, it is not going too far. Just as there are many Islamists that believe in a peaceful approach with their religion and their lives, there are good christian folk that believe the same way. However, there are radical folks among them that draw a lot of attention due to their excessive behavior. Remember that the first white settlers here were the puritans who left England (mostly) because they thought the "Merry Old Englanders" were shockingly risque and "ungodly". They say they came here for religious freedom but anyone who did not believe as they did were ostrasized or worse! The history is shocking! What's more shocking is that even though we have passed laws saying that church and state must remain separate we still deal with references to God and the bible with our politicians and legal system all the time. Some of our children are forced to say the Pledge of Allegiance in school every day that includes "...One Nation Under God...", our money says "In God We Trust".
The news is full of accounts of violence (not legally tolerated as some of the Islamic countries radical behaviors are by their goverments but still a problem that hate is taught at all in some churches) against folks who do not believe the same way. For instance we had a rash of incidents involving abortion clinics being bombed and doctors that worked in these clinics being killed when in reality most of the services that were performed in these clinics were normal health care procedures. Not that there was any excuse for killing people even if all the clinics had done nothing but abortions.
Don't take this to mean these folks are the majority in any way! Redux is correct in saying that those who truly live the teachings are usually peaceful, kins and genuine folks. The problem groups are a small minority of (usually) radical fundametalists that do not represent any Christians here as a whole but the religious air of superiority of some churches and the feeling that they are not bound by "Man's laws but God's laws" (and they determine what God's laws are) gives rise to these unstable individuals taking matters into their own hands. So I do not think it is an overstatement for someone who lives smack in the middle of the "Bible Belt" to say they are afraid to speak to anyone about their religious beliefs! With some of the religious fanatics out there they are right to be afraid! At the very least they may be completely ostrasized by their entire community and life for their children who must (by law) attend school with these radical's children will be an absolute misery!
Of course once you are out of that geographical area things do get a little (or a lot) easier depending on where you settle. In the San Francisco Bay Area, where I come from the cities are full of worshipers from many, many religions, including a large Buddhist community that, last I heard, was growing faster than any other religion in that area. I have attended "church" with friends who are Buddhists but I found that the religious teachings, in that sect anyway, were very, very different from what Buddha himself originally taught. I still admire the teachings of Buddha very much though.

 

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
Yes, Buddhism has been hijacked too. New Agers have merged it with bits of paganism, tree hugging and many other things. It doesn't matter so long as the individuals are OK but if you want to find the original Theravada Buddhism you have to look elsewhere. It can't be easy to be a true Buddhist monk living on the minimum of vegetarian food, owning nothing, getting up at 3.30am and meditating for much of the day. However, it is possible to live a normal lifestyle within Buddhist teachings.

 

[kstaven]

Buddhism has some new age branches. That is all too true. But buddhism also branched hundred of years ago much like the christian sects did. Having said that I would think you have to admit that the "basic belief structures" across all religious branches are still very much in tact.