Anyone non-religious here? Please be nice!

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
I'm saying that we should question everything that is presented to us as an undeniable truth, religious or otherwise. We remain free to accept what we want and make our own decisions but we should always think first. You have summed it up very well - any argument can be made to sound valid. Who should you trust? Your own conscience, perhaps. I'm certainly not saying that one should dismiss something that feels right just because a scientist, politician or priest said it.

By all means live a 'green' life but not because of fear engendered by some alleged scientific fact. Man's contribution to any deterioration in the state of the earth is probably more to do with the growing population than the actions of any individual. There are probably too many of us even if we were to live closer to nature. If so, it may be too late.

Termites, by the way, are claimed to account for 80% of CO2 emissions! You can't get closer to nature than that. They eat my timber and then mess up my air and don't pay me a bean in rent!

 

[SunnyDawn]

Quote:
I completely agree that it is of no consequence what we believe. I believe as I do because it gives me peace of mind to think that way but the fact is none of us really knows! I really don't think it matters at all what you believe as long as you continue to grow as a person. Who cares what the real truth is or who's right and who's wrong. I don't think any of us has it completely right and I would be bored by the thought that we didn't need to wonder anymore. I, for one, enjoy wondering about most everything. Your Mom may be right on the money (many folks believe the same thing) but I don't see how that changes my life (or afterlife) one way or the other.

BTW does anybody on BYC sleep, ever? I'm pooped but you all are so interesting that I'm having a hard time tearing myself away. Could you all be a little more boring so I don't feel like I'm gonna miss something exciting?

 

[SunnyDawn]

Quote:
Haven't studied up on termites myself but this really struck my funny bone.

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Oh you are fine Steffanie! It is easy to go from one extreme to the other. This thread is all about the fact that none of us are perfect and we willingly, and gladly accept that. We are thrilled that you have heart felt opinions and feel comfortable enough to express them here with us when you avoided responding on other threads! No I think what was meant was that we can't avoid or control every issue and that we will drive ourselves crazy trying to. I do try to live as green as possible but I am not buying into every "green" item on the market just to alleviate my guilt. I do feel a responsibilty to future generations to try and take care of the planet and I am horrified at the idea of giving the oil and energy industries (etc) any more of my money than I have to. So, I will continue to drive my compact car on a limited basis and turn down my thermostat in the winter (probably more so than most folks because I'm cheap), as well as keeping all of my energy saving efforts in place including our energy efficient windows, hefty insulation, tankless water heater and energy star appliances (yes I saw the news report on the lack of actual efficiency in some of the energy star rated applances that are being sold, *sigh*). What else can we do but try to make a difference even if it is small and even if it doesn't stop the next ice-age.

OK. I'm going to follow OrpingtonManor's example and go to bed! Goodnight all!

 

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
There was nothing at all wrong with what you wrote but let me know if you want me to remove your quotation from my previous post.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Quote:
I'm saying that we should question everything that is presented to us as an undeniable truth, religious or otherwise. We remain free to accept what we want and make our own decisions but we should always think first. You have summed it up very well - any argument can be made to sound valid. Who should you trust? Your own conscience, perhaps. I'm certainly not saying that one should dismiss something that feels right just because a scientist, politician or priest said it.

By all means live a 'green' life but not because of fear engendered by some alleged scientific fact. Man's contribution to any deterioration in the state of the earth is probably more to do with the growing population than the actions of any individual. There are probably too many of us even if we were to live closer to nature. If so, it may be too late.

Termites, by the way, are claimed to account for 80% of CO2 emissions! You can't get closer to nature than that. They eat my timber and then mess up my air and don't pay me a bean in rent!

I was hoping to get some rest before I attempted to respond. However, here goes.

I firmly believe it is already too late. Too late for what? Too late to preserve the earth for all eternity for mankind to do what they will. Too late to change anything. So why bother? For the sanity inside of my head. For the love of my children, and their unborn children. I do believe that industrialized nations consume at a much higher rate than third world nations. I do believe that we impact the planet with much more severity. Therefore, as a resident of one of these industrialized nations, I can't help but try to mitigate this. It isn't about thinking I can "reverse global warming." I don't believe that. And it isn't because I don't believe in God that I want to fix the mess. It goes back to a set of household rules that I used to have posted when my children were growing up. They said something to the effect, "If you dirty it, you clean it. If you take it out, put it away. If it's hungry, feed it. If it cries, love it." There were many more, and I'm not remembering them well. But, it all came down to personal responsibility. Responsibility isn't about fault. It's about the ability to respond. Even if one individual's actions didn't really contribute to the problem, this doesn't relieve them of a certain amount of responsibility. It is too easy to say, but we can't do anything, so let's eat, drink, and be merry.\\

I'm not sure how we ended up so far off the original thought of belief in God. However, I do believe in termites. My DSO inspects for termites for a living. There are many of them doing an honest days' work chewing on logs in the forests, as well as the miscreants that eat your house. Whether they are emitting CO2 is not my responsibility, because I personally do not have the ability to respond. Call my DSO.

Seriously, it's time for bed.

Orp

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Quote:
There was nothing at all wrong with what you wrote but let me know if you want me to remove your quotation from my previous post.

I think it's too late. We've all already gone crazy.

See you in the morning.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Quote:
Haven't studied up on termites myself but this really struck my funny bone.

Quote:
Oh you are fine Steffanie! It is easy to go from one extreme to the other. This thread is all about the fact that none of us are perfect and we willingly, and gladly accept that. We are thrilled that you have heart felt opinions and feel comfortable enough to express them here with us when you avoided responding on other threads! No I think what was meant was that we can't avoid or control every issue and that we will drive ourselves crazy trying to. I do try to live as green as possible but I am not buying into every "green" item on the market just to alleviate my guilt. I do feel a responsibilty to future generations to try and take care of the planet and I am horrified at the idea of giving the oil and energy industries (etc) any more of my money than I have to. So, I will continue to drive my compact car on a limited basis and turn down my thermostat in the winter (probably more so than most folks because I'm cheap), as well as keeping all of my energy saving efforts in place including our energy efficient windows, hefty insulation, tankless water heater and energy star appliances (yes I saw the news report on the lack of actual efficiency in some of the energy star rated applances that are being sold, *sigh*). What else can we do but try to make a difference even if it is small and even if it doesn't stop the next ice-age.

OK. I'm going to follow OrpingtonManor's example and go to bed! Goodnight all!

 

[I have WHAT in my yard?]

Far too many of you burned the midnight oil!!!!!

But, I read it all and CONGRATS!! YOu all did a great job of tempering your passions and keeping it very civil. That is what intellectual discussion is all about and I, for one, am loving it!!

I also teach, and I also encourage students to correct me when I am wrong. I also encourage them to send me information that they think is meaningful to a topic we covered or contradicts the way we looked at a topic. They get excited and think about the issues more when they are doing what they do anyway - surfing the net - and they keep me updated in ways I could never manage on my own!!

I also teach comparative religion. Before each semester stats I give this long speech about how learning about all religions is not meant to challenge any one person's beliefs. I explain that comparative religion is not about my religion is bigger than yours or my religion got it right. Inevitably, at least one student leaves. I explain that true faith should not need religion to hold it up. Then we start discussing the differences between religion, faith, belief and spirituality.

Which goes right along with that whole dang book learning thing messing with your religion idea!

 

[mom'sfolly]

I'm back to the topic of what misconceptions/assumptions about not being religious do you get.

I've had all of the ones previously mentioned, but there is another no one mentioned. It is the assumption that my children are being harmed by my lack of belief. The misconception that because they have not be baptized, do not attend church and do not actively practice religion is that they will be horrible people, unable to show empathy, morality or compassion. The assumption is that I've condemned my children. I see myself raising moral children who can see the good in many religions and belief systems, but are not ruled by fear and superstition. Unlike me, they will never suffer from nightmares that the will be seperated from their loved ones by a god who condemns everyone who doesn't believe and worship in the approved fashion.

 

[Prettiest Frog]

mom'sfolly :

I've had all of the ones previously mentioned, but there is another no one mentioned. It is the assumption that my children are being harmed by my lack of belief.

This, combined with the statement of 'if you aren't religious you can't love your children' is the attitude most likely to enrage me. I've given 'family' the cut direct over this attitude. When this bile came out of my cousin's mouth I told her she had ten seconds to get off my property before I called the police and reported her for trespassing. And then actually called the police and had her escorted off my property when she wouldn't leave and kept lecturing me. At the point the cops arrived I was actually on the internet to see if the situation was covered by castle doctrine. You do not use this mama bear's cub in such a deplorable manner.

I'm a nice person. I have my limits. When my limit is reached, I start to get angry. When I start to get angry, you'd be better off taunting Bruce Banner.

I also teach comparative religion. Before each semester stats I give this long speech about how learning about all religions is not meant to challenge any one person's beliefs. I explain that comparative religion is not about my religion is bigger than yours or my religion got it right. Inevitably, at least one student leaves. I explain that true faith should not need religion to hold it up. Then we start discussing the differences between religion, faith, belief and spirituality.

The other assumption that bothers me is the belief that I am not religious because I am ignorant of religion. It's ironic, most of the folks who tell me I should just read the bible never have, whereas I've read it cover to cover three times now. I was raised Christian, and have actually studied both the bible and the history of the time period in which the bible was written. Apologetics don't work on me, I can demonstrate which of them are false, which are wishful thinking, and which are flat out lies.

When I was a kid I thought there was something wrong with me because everyone around me believed and I didn't. Came to find out most of them didn't really believe either, religion was just sort of habit and something they thought they were supposed to do. I'd wager, if people actually took a good look at what they do actually believe, about half the population is agnostic.

I remember in college having someone sit down next to me and tell me they were going to do their best to make me a believer because they liked me and wanted to save me. I asked her, honestly, if it was a risk she was willing to take. She asked me what I meant. And I told her flat out that if she wanted to truly debate religion and the bible with me, it was far more probable that it would end with her an agnostic at the very least rather than me a member of her faith. She's actually a full on atheist now.

Like I said earlier, I don't like certain foods. I can't even understand why someone would like particular foods. But if they do, what's it to me? And it's funny that the same mindset actually does effect food, I've had people lecture me on how wrong I am for eating meat and how misguided I am when my meal happened to be vegetarian. Who cares? If it makes you happy and doesn't hurt anyone else (at least, doesn't hurt anyone who doesn't consent to being hurt/the possibility of being hurt), who cares? I don't get how someone can destroy their body playing a sport as moronic in my eyes as football, but I've also seen the sheer joy in my uncle's eyes as he came limping off the football field after a game and I would never dream of taking that away from him. To each their own, and to me my own.​