Ascites?

[Wyorp Rock]

Hello everyone and thank you for taking the time to read this and offer advice.

I have a Cuckoo Marans pullet that I noticed was looking pretty bare on her backside, so I took a closer look. She is filled with fluid. Pretty sure that it's water belly. I did not take any pictures, but if needed I'll get some in the morning.
She hatched last Aug, so isn't very old. She has always been a very heavy lady. Just figured it was because of her breed. She is my only Cuckoo Marans. I am planning on putting her down. I am not equipped to drain her and I don't want to see her suffer. She is a well loved pet. I also would like to know why she got water belly. I thought only broilers and old hens get it? I mix a bag of 20% all flock with a 16% layer feed. I did that because I started having problems with soft shells in my flock. They do have os and toasted egg shells on the side but still had problems. Did I do wrong by mixing the feed?
Also, I'm thinking I would like to try to do a necropsy. Does anyone have any links to step by step instructions on how to do that?

Sorry for the long post but I appreciate the ones who took the time to read this.

I'm sorry to hear about your pullet.

I see you have already recieved good input/suggestions so far.
I think you may need to give a little more information.

Is she still laying eggs?
Can she eat/drink on her own?
Does she have a good quality of life right now?

You mention you don't want to see her suffer - so can we assume she is not feeling well? She's acting sick? What are her symptoms?

If she is not sick right now... then you may want to just monitor her. Draining is an option to look into. You can find syringes and needles at tractor supply if that's something you want to try first.

Not all hens/pullets can be saved, nor should they - each of us have to make a determination of the quality of life they have and the time/money or experience we have to offer. Ending suffering is always an option if this is what you feel needs to be done, it's the right thing to do.

You did nothing wrong
We can try to help you if you want to treat her. If you have made the decision to put her down and want to try necrospy, that's good too.
Have someone take photos and post them so we can help you with what you see, we all learn along with you.
I would look in the abdomen first. Working your way on into the organs. Liver and heart dysfunction can cause Ascites as well as reproductive problems.
The following link may be helpful to you. Also the necropsy thread here on BYC may be helpful, you can see what others have done and what they have found.
https://vet.uga.edu/oldvpp/programs/afvet/attachments/how_to_necropsy_a_bird.pdf
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...ning-contains-graphic-necropsy-photos.823961/

 

[Eggcessive]

Sorry about your pullet. So she is about 8 months old now, and is still laying eggs, but has an enlarged lower belly, correct? She has had access most of her life to a mix of layer mixed with flock raiser feed. She should have been on flock raiser or grower feed until she started laying, only because she didn’t need the extra calciumin layer. But she only got a little extra—2% versus 4% in layer. Grower or flock raiser has only 1% calcium.

I have raised quite a few Marans, and have had a few who developed enormous lower abdomens, compared to my other hens. They are the biggest eaters of the flock because they just shove everyone out of their way. I have one right now with internal laying, who still gets around okay, and passes some yellow cooked egg material in her droppings. Two have passed from reproductive disorders.

Hopefully, she is just fat, and doesn’t have ascites or internal laying. If you try to drain her belly, you might get yellow fluid out, which is a sign of ascites. If the fluid is clear and colorless, that is not ascites, but a persistant right oviduct. If you don’t get fluid, she may have a lot of fat or could be laying some internally. How often does she lay?

I would just keep observing her. I don’t think she seems to be suffering as long as she is eating, getting around, and since she is laying, she does not sound bad off at all. I would cut out any treats for her, and just see how it goes.

 

[Lady Lionheart]

Good morning everyone. I took some pictures of her the best I can. Also I felt around better and it's not in front of her legs. About baseball size under her vent. If it's not ascites, what could be causing this?
More info: She has always been the bottom of pecking order. I've noticed she has been getting chased around a lot more in the last few weeks. Even by my small runt pullet. They were always friends. And when she sings the egg song, she now has a weird gasp sound at the end of her "verses". And her feathers look bad. Like a "v" shape at the end of them. I'll attach pics of that to.

Also I'm not 100% sure she's a Cuckoo Marans. I thought she was my dark egg layer, but a while back I found out that that's my Welsummer. She lays a spotted slightly darker egg then my GLWS.
Also, her comb and face are not blue or purple. Bright red. I get an egg from her about 4 or 5 days out of the week.

 

[Lady Lionheart]

Can you tell us what you feed your flock including treats and anything they might have access to while free ranging? That might help narrow things down.

They get Purina all flock mixed with layer feed. A handful of scratch every day and every other day I soak some alfalfa cubes for them. I haven't been able to let them out because we are seeding the backyard.

 

[Lady Lionheart]

Sorry about your pullet. So she is about 8 months old now, and is still laying eggs, but has an enlarged lower belly, correct? She has had access most of her life to a mix of layer mixed with flock raiser feed. She should have been on flock raiser or grower feed until she started laying, only because she didn’t need the extra calciumin layer. But she only got a little extra—2% versus 4% in layer. Grower or flock raiser has only 1% calcium.

I have raised quite a few Marans, and have had a few who developed enormous lower abdomens, compared to my other hens. They are the biggest eaters of the flock because they just shove everyone out of their way. I have one right now with internal laying, who still gets around okay, and passes some yellow cooked egg material in her droppings. Two have passed from reproductive disorders.

Hopefully, she is just fat, and doesn’t have ascites or internal laying. If you try to drain her belly, you might get yellow fluid out, which is a sign of ascites. If the fluid is clear and colorless, that is not ascites, but a persistant right oviduct. If you don’t get fluid, she may have a lot of fat or could be laying some internally. How often does she lay?

I would just keep observing her. I don’t think she seems to be suffering as long as she is eating, getting around, and since she is laying, she does not sound bad off at all. I would cut out any treats for her, and just see how it goes.

Yes. I only started mixing in the layer last month. I hope she is just fat.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

About baseball size under her vent. If it's not ascites, what could be causing this?

She has always been the bottom of pecking order. I've noticed she has been getting chased around a lot more in the last few weeks. Even by my small runt pullet. They were always friends. And when she sings the egg song, she now has a weird gasp sound at the end of her "verses". And her feathers look bad. Like a "v" shape at the end of them. I'll attach pics of that to.

I get an egg from her about 4 or 5 days out of the week.

I hope she is just fat.

How many do you have? Do you have a rooster?
The feathers look to be nipped off - is she is being picked on, that could be the cause.
Try limiting your treats to around 5-10% of daily intake. I don't really see a problem of mixing layer with flock raiser, but you will be cutting the protein down a bit if you do that, add in something that's low in protein like scratch, you are diluting the nutritional/protein content even more.

You don't want her to be fat either - fat can make it hard to lay eggs, hens can prolapse and suffer from Fatty Liver Disease (Ascites is a symptom of that).

She is fullish looking in the abdomen to me - could be fat or fluid, hard to know.
Since she is laying eggs regularly, then if she were mine, I would monitor her. If she has fluid, difficulty walking or breathing, draining is something to consider to see if that gives some relief.

 

[Lady Lionheart]

I really would rather not put her down if she's not suffering. But I will not be able to spend much money on supportive care for her

How many do you have? Do you have a rooster?
The feathers look to be nipped off - is she is being picked on, that could be the cause.
Try limiting your treats to around 5-10% of daily intake. I don't really see a problem of mixing layer with flock raiser, but you will be cutting the protein down a bit if you do that, add in something that's low in protein like scratch, you are diluting the nutritional/protein content even more.

You don't want her to be fat either - fat can make it hard to lay eggs, hens can prolapse and suffer from Fatty Liver Disease (Ascites is a symptom of that).

She is fullish looking in the abdomen to me - could be fat or fluid, hard to know.
Since she is laying eggs regularly, then if she were mine, I would monitor her. If she has fluid, difficulty walking or breathing, draining is something to consider to see if that gives some relief.

I have twelve pullets. No roosters. I will cut the scratch out. Is alfalfa a treat too? Am I feeding too much of that?

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I would just limit the scratch - monitor how much you give. I don't know anything about Alfalfa or it's nutritional values, so can't say on that.
A general guideline is to make "treats" only 5-10% of daily intake if they are confined to a run.

As for her suffering...she is laying eggs - she's "productive" right now. I would just watch and observe her - if she gets to the point she is laying down a lot/sleeping during the day, has crop problems, difficulty breathing or walking, lethargy, etc. then re-visit what needs to be done - draining if you think it would help or putting her down.

 

[Lady Lionheart]

I would just limit the scratch - monitor how much you give. I don't know anything about Alfalfa or it's nutritional values, so can't say on that.
A general guideline is to make "treats" only 5-10% of daily intake if they are confined to a run.

As for her suffering...she is laying eggs - she's "productive" right now. I would just watch and observe her - if she gets to the point she is laying down a lot/sleeping during the day, has crop problems, difficulty breathing or walking, lethargy, etc. then re-visit what needs to be done - draining if you think it would help or putting her down.

Thank you

 

[azygous]

If she has white legs, she's a Marans. Hatchery Marans tend not to lay the chocolate brown eggs so touted of this breed. My Cuckoo Marans hen lays smooth reddish brown eggs without freckles, the only distinction from my Welsummers' eggs that are reddish with freckles. As they age, the color fades further.

The missing feathers on your hen's swollen rump indicate the swelling is causing the feathers to be farther apart. I would limit her carbs and see if you can get her to lose that fat. As long as she's laying and is behaving normally, it may not be disease.

However, the swelling can indicate a reproductive infection in the works. Her poop would reflect the infection by being yellowish with lots of mucous. As it progresses, it would show more solid bits of yellowish pus. If her poop is normal at this time, I would suspect she's just an overweight lass with an out-of-control appetite.

I have a Light Brahma with a huge appetite that is slightly on the "heavy" side. It hasn't seemed to affect her health, though. She will be twelve in another month. Her name is Lady Di, and she assures me she's a "plus-size" model.