B.Y.C. Dorking Club!

[Sydney Acres]

Hey guys so i guess this would be a good place to ask. I am trying to decide either to get a Black Jersey Giant Rooster or a Silver Gray Dorking Rooster. Which would protect the flock better?

Both would do well, if you got individual roosters with the right temperament. But neither would be my first choice if you don't have an interest in those breeds otherwise. Both Dorkings and Jersey Giants will likely have less speed at a run than a RIR or similar bird, because the Dorkings have such short legs, and the Jersey Giants are so large and bulky. Also, both of these breeds have roosters that get very large, so if you don't have large hens the roosters could injure the hens during breeding.

Realistically, the rooster protects the hens from raptors and dogs not by winning the fight, but by being alert enough to warn the hens of any threat early, and by being willing to sacrifice himself long enough for the hens to escape to safety. Size isn't nearly as important as attitude, because even a big rooster is unlikely to win a full-on battle against a dog or an eagle, and a small rooster that appears threatening can do just as well as the big boys at intimidation. And the small bird may not pack as hard a punch, but it can still do some damage and will likely be more agile.

Depending on your setup, you might also do well with two or more roosters working as a team, assuming you have enough hens, and enough room for adult males to coexist peacefully. I have 2 older Croad Langshan roosters that work beautifully together -- one always watches the sky while the other looks over the hens (I live north of Seattle, so there's lots of bald eagles, hawks, etc). When a raptor is spotted, one rooster escorts the hens to safety while the other one moves out to an open area so the predator focuses on the obvious prey. As soon as the hens are under cover, both roosters join them, one facing the obvious threat and one facing the opposite direction. They've learned from experience -- the bald eagles around here hunt as bonded pairs, so there's often a second hunter that sneaks in from the opposite direction. It's amazing to watch them work, and there have only been minor injuries from the raptors so far. I recently added a young Red Dorking rooster and 14 young hens to the flock, and the young rooster is learning his duties.

As far as protection from stray dogs, you're likely going to lose your rooster if the dog has any hunting skills at all. That might use up enough time to allow the hens to get to safety, assuming there is a safe place to go. But dogs are different than coyotes -- coyotes will kill and take away one bird to eat, whereas many dogs will kill an entire flock of birds for sport and leave them in place. A rooster can help, but the best defense against stray dogs is a good fence, preferably one that is dig-proof and climb-proof. A livestock protection dog (that is trained to protect poultry) will also help, but it can't adequately protect against dogs running in a pack.

 

[Sydney Acres]

I ordered 8 males and 8 straight run and ended up with 8 total, looks like 4 girls and 4 boys. They were the only breed that I had any deaths, I had read somewhere that dorking chicks were "delicate?" Can't remember where I read that. I called in with my dead count for the refund and asked them if they seem to have a lot of losses of dorking chicks and the lady told me that they don't, that they are typically pretty hardy chicks for them. Very disappointing, but glad I at least have a few of each sex... :/

I have also read that Dorking chicks are "delicate," but have not found that true in my birds. I had 13 Red Dorking chicks and 14 Barnevelder chicks shipped from Iowa (Sandhill) to Seattle last year. All looked great on arrival, but 2 of the Barnevelder chicks died several days later. All of the Dorkings survived, and seem incredibly hardy compared to other breeds that I've raised.

 

[Sydney Acres]

I also bit the bullet and ordered a few Red Dorkings from Sand Hill, since I was needing Delawares anyway, and I expect they received my order/payment early this week, maybe Tuesday? But I have yet to hear confirmation from them... I know their service is typically slower than a big hatchery, but I at least expected some sort of notice that I was on the books? I should call, but their hours are so restrictive, and I'm not easy to get in touch with for a call back. Just wondering what everyone else's experience was with them.

This time of year they're crazy busy, so it's probably going to take a while. I typically order from them in late October to early January for spring delivery, and I usually receive my confirmation 2-4 weeks later. I suspect it would be (a lot) longer this time of year. Also, Dorkings tend to be winter/spring layers, then go broody in the summer, so the line for Dorkings might be pretty long at this point, with very few eggs available. They operate on a first-come/first-paid-for/when-available basis, with very little customer communication otherwise. It's not a big hatchery with lots of customer service reps. It's a small family business with only so many hours in the day, and no time for non-essential steps. So you send in your order with payment, they send you a confirmation letter when they have time, then you wait in line until your chicks become available. When your chicks hatch, they ship on Tuesday(typically) and give you a call Tuesday p.m. to let you know they're on the way. If your chicks don't become available that year, then they send you a letter (or rarely an e-mail) asking if you want a refund or if you want to be placed in line for next year's chicks (this has happened to me twice). You can request that you only want chicks on certain dates, but that decreases your likelihood of receiving chicks. You can also request substitutions if your breed is not available, which will increase your likelihood of receiving chicks, especially if you want your chicks on a specific hatch date. You can let them choose the substitutions, or you can list acceptable substitutions.

This system can be fairly frustrating if your point of reference is the large hatchery. But they are not a large hatchery, which would typically offer fewer breeds, but have large numbers of hens for each breed they offer. They are a small family business that has small numbers of many rare breeds, some of which are very difficult to find elsewhere. Not everyone has the patience or tolerance of this business model, and those people probably shouldn't order from Sandhill. But I'm quite happy with my Red Dorkings -- for me, they were worth the wait.

 

[ki4got]

Any kind of predator really...but i think the biggest threat are hawks and our idiot dogs where we live.

sounds like you need to do some serious training on your dogs, and for hawks, it's rare for a roo to take one on, tho one of my dorking roos did. Junior: 1 Hawk: 0. but junior is now missing a lump of comb too.

 

[Sazbaby]

This time of year they're crazy busy, so it's probably going to take a while. I typically order from them in late October to early January for spring delivery, and I usually receive my confirmation 2-4 weeks later. I suspect it would be (a lot) longer this time of year. Also, Dorkings tend to be winter/spring layers, then go broody in the summer, so the line for Dorkings might be pretty long at this point, with very few eggs available. They operate on a first-come/first-paid-for/when-available basis, with very little customer communication otherwise. It's not a big hatchery with lots of customer service reps. It's a small family business with only so many hours in the day, and no time for non-essential steps. So you send in your order with payment, they send you a confirmation letter when they have time, then you wait in line until your chicks become available. When your chicks hatch, they ship on Tuesday(typically) and give you a call Tuesday p.m. to let you know they're on the way. If your chicks don't become available that year, then they send you a letter (or rarely an e-mail) asking if you want a refund or if you want to be placed in line for next year's chicks (this has happened to me twice). You can request that you only want chicks on certain dates, but that decreases your likelihood of receiving chicks. You can also request substitutions if your breed is not available, which will increase your likelihood of receiving chicks, especially if you want your chicks on a specific hatch date. You can let them choose the substitutions, or you can list acceptable substitutions.

This system can be fairly frustrating if your point of reference is the large hatchery. But they are not a large hatchery, which would typically offer fewer breeds, but have large numbers of hens for each breed they offer. They are a small family business that has small numbers of many rare breeds, some of which are very difficult to find elsewhere. Not everyone has the patience or tolerance of this business model, and those people probably shouldn't order from Sandhill. But I'm quite happy with my Red Dorkings -- for me, they were worth the wait.

I might try giving them a call at some point and see if they can give me any information. I'm not in a rush and I'm more interested in getting quality birds, but I'm mostly curious to know how up-to-date their website is. The 3 breeds that I was ordering all said they were sold out through 7/9/13 so I selected the next hatch date after that. I did put in some possible substitutions as well as allowing any available hatch date onward, and sent my payment in with the order form. I did see that their "assortment specials" had been updated something like 6/14, so I'm assuming that they would have updated their sold out hatches at that time too? Anyhow, it's not terribly important, I'm overrun with chicks this year anyhow, it was mostly the Delawares that were the most important acquisition for me, as they weren't available from the hatcheries I ordered from this year. I threw in some Dorkings and Orpingtons for some variety in my lines too, but they are flexible. Hoping they can make it work for this summer/fall and if not, guess I'll have to wait until next spring! Thanks for the information!!

 

[Sazbaby]

Any kind of predator really...but i think the biggest threat are hawks and our idiot dogs where we live.

Hawks I can understand, but chicken-killing dogs are one of my pet peeves. Where I live there's no leash law and many people just let their dogs run loose to poop and pee on everyone's land, and harass livestock at will. Animal control won't do anything about it- our only option here is to shoot the dog if it's chasing/killing any livestock. Know of one person who actually did it after a dog killed several chickens and then went after their goats. More people have come home to find dead chickens and not been able to do anything about it, and that's just unfair. I think dogs are great and all, but if you're going to have a pet, you should take responsibility for it and make sure you know what it's up to and keep it at home! We have a large number of young chickens that free range until they are old enough to introduce to our layer flock, they are 100% on our property and cause no issues for anyone, and I constantly worry about a dog coming and wreaking havoc. I dont' think a rooster would do much except make a lot of noise and alert the flock to the threat, of all my friends locally who have lost birds to dogs, none have lost a rooster, always hens. Sorry you (or anyone for that matter) has to deal with other people's misbehaving dogs!! (Rant over.... sorry!)

Of course my reply is assuming you're talking about someone else's idiot dogs... assuming they're not *your* idiot dogs?? lol If that's the case, then that's a different situation altogether!!!!!

 

[pysankigirl]

Honestly, if you are talking about land-based predators, an electric mesh fence (we got ours from premier) is the way to go IMHO. a rooster really cant protect against those,

where roosters do well is warning about sky faring predators.

 

[ronott1]

Honestly, if you are talking about land-based predators, an electric mesh fence (we got ours from premier) is the way to go IMHO. a rooster really cant protect against those,

where roosters do well is warning about sky faring predators.

Agreed!

Solar eyes can help a bunch too. What often happens is the Rooster sacrifices himself for the flock. Scratch one Rooster.....

 

[Sazbaby]

Honestly, if you are talking about land-based predators, an electric mesh fence (we got ours from premier) is the way to go IMHO. a rooster really cant protect against those,

where roosters do well is warning about sky faring predators.

Very true- Premier 1 fencing has the greatest electric mesh fencing for chickens, and it's tremendous overall. Biggest problem is keeping the grass/brush from growing up around the base of the fencing (easier said than done) and shorting it out. We have solar fence chargers and the portable mesh from them so we can move it around from place to place in the field, and the only issues other than keeping the grass/brush down is making sure your charger is working properly and dealing with tears/damage to the lines in the mesh. Supposedly it will even keep bears at bay when working properly! Only other downside to it is that chicks up to maybe 2 months old (or maybe even just a bit older?) can still get through the mesh, and I've never seen one chicken be affected by the electric shock. We have one LF hen who knows to walk the fence down (even though it's installed as tight as we can get it) and will squeeze right through one of the larger openings higher up in the fence, and our silkies are able to go right through with little effort. Luckily one of the silkies is content enough to stay put, the other one gets out every day and I put her back in every night... (ugh!) So it's indeed an WONDERFUL option, but only if your chickens tend to stay inside the netting, which the vast majority of them do! We have ours out in open pasture (we have very few trees on our property) so also keep in mind that you need to provide something for them to hide under if hawks/eagles/etc are the issue.

 

[pysankigirl]

We have goats and initially bought the wider opening mesh for them. then we got chickens and are banging out heads that we didn't splurge for the tighter openings to begin with, but honestly...if it gives the chickens a safe haven to go then it is doing a lot. we have the more open side facing our house with our dogs (who are very chicken friendly) and the chicken mesh sections are near the woods where predators would come from.

shrubberies make great places to hide, so if you can plant some you don't absolutely need trees. ours like to hide under shrubs that are about 6 feet tall and bushy, so something fast growing should afford them some aerial protection within a year,