Bad introduction!

[dodgewoman]

I'm beside myself right now. We tried to introduces the new chicks last night. They have been penned up during the day right next to the chickens run so they can see each other. They get largely ignored all day. So I decided to introduce them last night. We put them all in at night(around 10pm). They seemed to have made it through the night. This morning I go out to check on them and am only counting 8 chicks! I had 10. They were all huddled up in the corner of the coop. They were pretty much left alone if they stayed that way but they couldn't get to food or water. I looked around my run and under the ramp were my other two, bloodied and pretty much dead . I nearly cried. I quickly took the others out and put them in their run next to the big run. Where do I go from here? I'm now scared to even try again! Two of my most beautiful chicks are dead

 

[ChickenCanoe]

That's a shame. How old are the chicks and how old are the older birds?
It's best to introduce like numbers and like sizes.
When you do add birds you also have to add feeders and waterers widely separated.
They're considered outsiders, so they are considered a threat to the wellbeing of the flock by the older birds.
The size of the coop and run make a big difference too.

I seem to frequently be in the minority and my advice may not be practical for someone with a small flock and a single coop. Keeping birds of different ages separated can help control worms and diseases like cholera, ulcerative enteritis, tuberculosis, paratyphoid and some things caused by e-coli.
So for many reasons, it's best to wait till the young ones are the same size.
Regardless of the size of your setup, it is so helpful to have at least 2 places to keep chickens so that sick, injured, new arrivals and young birds can be separated.

 

[nbenevento]

How old are the chicks? I don't recommend combining birds until they are close to the same size as the adult chickens. I'm not sure but it seems like they are pretty young since you said they were huddled in the corner and not on a roost. There really is no way around it, you just can't combine chicks with adults in my opinion. Depending on their age, you may need another coop or find a way to separate them with a cage within your existing coop and run (assuming they don't free range.

 

[dodgewoman]

Yes, they are still young and not quite as big as the older birds. My olde birds are a a year this march. The reason I combined them was I had a friend who go chicks the same time I did and she got hers combined with no issues what so ever so I figured we'd be ok. The only difference in our flocks is have two roosters she does not. Maybe I have more of a dynamic than she does with the roosters.

My flock size is small. I have 7 hens and the two roosters. I have/ had 10 chicks. Which is now 8 we don't have a huge coop either and most of the time my heads don't even roost in it they just lay on the floor. I free range only in the evening to keep the neighbors happy.

I'm so upset b/c basically I sent my chicks to their death b/c I was to stupid to wait a few more weeks. They are outgrowing their box so I felt I had to move them. Dumb. My husband in the next few days can hopefully make their box into a small coop for them and we can put them next to the chickens.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Letting them see each other helps a little but eventually they'll still work out the pecking order once they can actually peck the others.
You said your coop isn't huge. What are the dimensions?
Even birds that grow up together should have about 4 square foot per bird in the coop to prevent fights and cannibalism unless they're let out at dawn.

 

[dodgewoman]

I'd have to ask my husband the dimensions. But when we built it it was for 15 chickens. We don't close the coop door at night so they can go right into the right when they get up. Does that help or did you mean free range?

 

[ChickensRDinos]

When they go out in the morning is it into an enclosed run? They should have 4 ft each inside the coop and 10 ft each inside the run. If they are crowded that can definitely add to bully and integration problems.

Make sure you have enough space and give them a little time to be more similar in size to your bigger birds. I generally keep any new birds in a pin inside the run for a full week (I think you already did this). I would add an extra feeder and waterer in the run as far away from your first one as possible because food bullying is usually bad when you are trying to add new birds. Also make sure to put something in the run the birds can hide behind -- some boards, anything you have laying around. I also feel like it goes a little smoother if they have an escape.

 

[cafarmgirl]

For this reason I don't attempt to integrate chicks with older birds, at all. It's just too risky for the little ones. I have an adjoining coop/run that I use for a grow out pen. It shares a fence line with the older birds run. My chicks move into their pen at 5 weeks old and stay there until they are about 15 weeks. So for 10 weeks they spend all day right next to the older birds. Sometimes there are even pecking order scuffles through the fence. By the time I let them all out to free range together pecking order issues are so minor as to be almost unnoticeable.

It's a really good idea for anyone who wants to occasionally add new birds to their flock (and who of us doesn't!

) to have a pen for chicks to move into from the brooder.

 

[SillyCityGirl]

Agreed with the other posters. They will get into more fights if they don't have enough space. The older established flock will pick on younger ones that you try to introduce especially when they still have "baby voices." I always wait until they are getting close to laying age or sometimes after before I let the younger ones in with my main flock and the main coop/run area. Until then they stay in the side acclimation pen. Unfortunately it is a hard lesson to learn. The only way now that I ever have little ones in my main flock is when they are hatched out there and even then there has to be plenty of space.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Seems like I am copying this from thread to thread, but I’ll do again. Hopefully something in this will help you be more successful next time. I think there are some things here that might be able to help you. Try to think of the differences in your how your friend handled it and your set-up other than roosters. It’s possible one of the roosters was a problem, but in my experience it is practically always a hen.

You still haven’t mentioned how old they are, but that’s pretty irrelevant. Obviously they are not old enough to do it the way you tried. The more age difference there is the greater the risk. I have no problems integrating 8 week olds with adults but for a lot of people that would be a recipe for disaster.

There could be different things at work here, like them getting to know each other better, but I think the biggest problem was they were unable to get away from the adults when they were attacked. Age was probably a big factor also, but your friend showed that was not a total stop.

Sometimes these things go so smoothly that we wonder what all the worry was about. Sometimes there are disasters. I’ve read about that adding them to the coop at night thing. Like Debid said, it doesn’t always work. In my opinion, the big advantage of the overnight thing is that when it works they settle their differences before the human is down there to interfere. When it doesn’t work, it is a disaster because the weaker cannot get away.

I wrote the stuff below for another question but I’m not typing all this again. I think this is generic enough to get my points across.

I’m going to give you a long answer because there is no short simple answer other than maybe. Hopefully some of this will help you make that transition easier. I don’t know the age difference in yours, but obviously it’s enough to cause problems. Even if they are the same age, you can have problems. Something else I’ll mention. Just because something can happen does not mean it will each and every time without fail. You are dealing with living animals. They don’t always act the same way.

One thing to look for is that it is possible for chickens to recognize which chickens belong in their flocks and which don’t. They might attack any strange chicken that does not belong to their flock. This doesn’t happen each and every time but it happens often enough to be a concern. A good way to help with this is to house the chickens side by side for a while where they can see each other but can’t attack each other. I suggest at least a week. By then they should recognize that each other have a right to be there.

Another thing is pecking order. They are social animals but to live together peacefully each chicken needs to know where it ranks in the flock. What generally happens when two chickens meet that haven’t worked this out is that one pecks or somehow tries to intimidate the other. If one runs away, it’s settled, though there may be a bit of chasing to drive the message home. If one does not run away, that’s a challenge and things can get violent. Usually one of them quickly realizes that they really should run away instead of fighting, so it gets settled. But sometimes they are evenly matched and it really gets violent. Death and destruction really doesn’t happen that often but there is one big key here. You have to have enough room for the loser to run away and get away. The tighter you have them packed in there the more dangerous this becomes. I don’t know how much space is enough space. That’s going to vary by each flock. Each flock has its own unique dynamics.

Another thing that will probably concern you. A more mature chicken will always outrank a less mature chicken and they can be pretty bad bullies about it. That’s probably some of what you saw. The more age difference the higher the risk. How they handle this is that the younger run away and very quickly learn to just stay out of the way of the older ones. They pretty much form a separate flock until they mature enough to force their way into the pecking order. Again the key is that they need enough room to run away and avoid.

A lot of us integrate chicks with the flock all the time and don’t lose any. Broody hens successfully do that all the time, often weaning their chicks and leaving them on their own with the flock at four weeks. I’m not a broody hen that takes a few weeks teaching the other hens to leave her chicks alone so I wait a few weeks longer, usually mixing them at 8 weeks. But I have a lot of space. If space is tight, it might be better to wait longer, maybe even until they are pretty much full grown. We all have different conditions.

There are some other things you can do that can help, other than providing as much space as you can. Unless yours free range all the time, put some things in the coop and/or run they can hide behind or under, some way to avoid the older ones or at least stay out of sight. And house them side by side for a while.

Provide feed and water in different areas. That way the young can eat and drink without challenging the older ones.

One of the places I see the worst brutality is on the roosts as they are settling in for the night. I suggest you provide extra roost space so they have room to get away, especially while some are too immature to force their way into the pecking order. I went so far as to provide a separate roost, lower than the main roosts and separated a little horizontally so they have a safe place to go that is not my nests.

As I said, many of us do this kind of stuff a lot. Sometimes it goes so smoothly you wonder what all the fuss and worry was about. Occasionally it gets pretty violent. Usually it is somewhere in between, with some pecking and chasing but no real harm done. I wish you luck with yours.