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Barred Rock/Buff Orpington Crosses

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by IAK, Oct 24, 2009.

  1. IAK

    IAK Out Of The Brooder

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    I have NHR's, BO's, and BR's. I would like to get started in breeding them just for fun.

    So far I know a NHR roo crossed with a BR hen will give me black sex links. I also just found out that a NHR X BO will give produce a reddish Orpington looking bird.

    However, I can't find any information on a cross between a BR roo and a BO hen. If anyone has any pics of such a cross that would be great.

    Looks are a secondary goal to me. I'm more looking into performance via hybrid vigor. Faster maturing, more/bigger eggs are my goal. If I don't obtain any of these goals that's fine too, like I said, it's more fun than anything. Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2009
  2. ...However, I can't find any information on a cross between a BR roo and a BO hen...

    Hi! I *think* all the chicks from that cross would have barring.
    If it was the other way (Buff Orp roo over Barred Rock hen), the male chicks would have barring and the female chicks would not be barred, I *think*.
    [​IMG]
    Lisa​
     
    1 person likes this.
  3. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Lisa you are correct and that would be a sex linked cross.

    The barred roo on orpington hen would produce black and barred birds. Barred rock I have worked with carry silver so you could get birds that leak silver in the hackles. You will have to wait and see what happens, if the rock carries gold then they will leak gold.

    Tim
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. TurtleFeathers

    TurtleFeathers Fear the Turtle!

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    I might be wrong, but I thought a barred roo would produce ALL barred offspring, whereas a barred hen would produce only barred males?
     
  5. speckledhen

    speckledhen Intentional Solitude Premium Member

    That is true, Turtlefeathers. Enough chicks have been hatched from my BR rooster over various hens to know that for sure! The barring amounts will vary, though. Tim, I've never seen a solid colored bird from a BR roo over anything. The barring on some will be very faint, but it's always been there, in my experience. Recently have done BR over BBS Ameraucana, but in the past many have had my BR/Buff Orp or BR/RIRs.
     
  6. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Speckled Hen,

    I do not disagree with your results.

    It depends on the barred rocks genotype (genes in the bird). If you use a barred rock male that is homozygous for extended black or has two extended black genes (E/E) then the offspring will be heterozygous (E/?) and will be barred black birds that leak color (as I stated). The amount the bird leaks depends on the number of melanizers that are carried by the barred rock and if the barred rock is columbian restricted. If the barred rock is columbian restricted and the other variety is columbian restricted then the offspring will show more red or silver (your birds are columbian restricted). You can tell for sure if you produced males that did not have a solid black breast. A solid black breast means the male birds are not columbian restricted.

    If the barred rock is heterozygous (E/?) and columbian restricted, then when crossed with a different variety or breed would produce a percentage ( about 1/2) of offspring that are red or silver with some black from melanotic or other melanizers.

    Since the offspring are heterozygous for melanotic- the black in the hackles and back etc. will get darker with age. As you stated the barring will hardly show on the females that are wheaten (your birds). Pullets will have a little black in their hackles but as they get older and molt in new feathers they will have almost black hackles, that has been my experience.

    The male barred rock and female barred rock I worked with were homozygous for extended black, carried silver with no columbian restriction- they produced black birds that leaked silver or gold depending on the cross. The females looked like black sex linked crosses (which some of them were).

    My work agrees with published research.

    Your work also agrees with published research.

    It really depends on the birds you are crossing. I did crossings using rhode island red and barred rock. I used both male and female barred rock and male and female rhode island red. I wish I had kept pictures of all the offspring.

    This is why it is difficult to make predictions with black or white birds. The black or white hides the expression of genes in the bird so other phenotypes (what the bird looks like) show up in the offspring.

    I try to give advise that takes the least amount of explanation ( with the lowest difficulty) and will be the normal results.

    Tim
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2009
  7. Chris09

    Chris09 Circle (M) Ranch

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    Some of the first White Plymouth Rocks were White sports of the Barred variety.

    Chris
     
  8. speckledhen

    speckledhen Intentional Solitude Premium Member

    Tim, I'm hopeless with the gene designations and I don't dispute what you're saying (you are the genetics guru!)but in my experience, I've never seen any bird with a BR sire come out with absolutely no barring of some type. The BBS Ameraucanas come out with ghosty hints of barring or lots of barring like this girl:

    [​IMG]

    And her sister, same parents:
    [​IMG]

    I've always been confused by some of this, but I guess you're saying that a purebred Barred Rock will carry different genes from another? Not sure why some are Columbian restricted and some aren't, but that's me, not your explanations. And most of the time, you won't know what a bird is carrying till you breed it, right?

    Sorry to the OP, don't want to take over your thread here at all!
    Cuban Longtails hatched quite a few birds from my flock a couple years ago, BR over Buff Orp and over RIR and BBS Ameraucana and all had lots of barring, though some looked silver and some looked goldish with the barring. Some of her birds are posted here if you want to look them up.
     
  9. Krys109uk

    Krys109uk Chillin' With My Peeps

    In m eperience black barred male over BO hens, presuming the male to be homozygous for barring (B/B) & extended black (E/E)(which they usually are) will give all black barred offspring with a lot of leakage & black restricted to some extent, usually to some extent on upper part of breast & shoulders.

    I've had two different types of effect from this kind of cross with buff Orps. One with mostly colour (in this case silver) & some black barring type marks in the hackles & front part of body; another is almost barred columbian like in appearance with melanised hackles.


    Speckledhen, I think the possibly more variation in results of BR males on various hens could be due to the variety of genes in the different breed females. Though, of course, as Tim said it's possible for the BR also to be carrying unexpected genes.
     
  10. speckledhen

    speckledhen Intentional Solitude Premium Member

    Thanks, Krys, it's those unexpected genes that always confound me!
     

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