Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[pinkchick]

Quote:
Did you have a dozen eggs under her?

I gave her 10 eggs that had been started in the incubator for 10 days that all looked good, only 3 chicks hatched.

 

[Illia]

Okay, this is pic heavy, so a little warning. . .

It's time for people to take a look at, think about, and critique my last two boys I'm down to.

I'm quite likely to keep both though. I started out with 7 cockerels, 3 different breedings, and am now down to these two. . .

First up, this is a cockerel from Cree Farms/Bev Davis lines. . . This is the head of Guittard. Now, his eyes appear more bay in color than the other, and he has less "eyeliner."

This again is Guittard. Side view. Now, I'll already say that I'm not the fondest of his tail, but it isn't squirrelled. . . It is probably around 50-70 degrees. The fact that his saddle doesn't slope into it doesn't help, but I don't mind so far.

Top view. Broadest at shoulders, and pretty decent. . . Except that tail, which is manageable. Long as it isn't squirreled.

This is a cockerel straight from Wynette, who I believe is Bev DavisXPresley/Jean. His name is Cacao. His eyes are lighter and much more striking, plus he has a lot of dark pigmentation around the face and that sort of "black eyeliner."

Him from the side.

Him more front on, although this is a couple months ago. He's filled out since then, but notice the excess coppering. The nice thing is that it is not golden in color, but instead red. I actually want this, because for one my girls need much more coloration.

His width. Very nice and broad, esp at the shoulders. Ignore the tiny little Araucana girl. . .

Width to look at again, this time in a more natural position.

Now, this is the two side by side. The cockerel from Wynette is indeed hunching himself, the cockerel from Cree is standing on one leg.

Now, this third one is not a cockerel who's alive, but he's from the same hatch that my "busty girls" are from. I'll be using Cacao to cover those girls. This guy here is just showing the male counterpart of the lines. . . And this is a 5 month old!! He was really nice and chesty and pretty heavy for such a young fellow, which I loved. He got culled though because he went after my ankles on occasion. If any of you remember, this is Maple - That young little guy who you thought had too girly of a name.

I'll be keeping both cockerels, but I'd love input on them. There are a lot of little bits I don't see.


Also as a note - The two cockerels I'll be crossing lines of. And Cacao will be covering the females from Maple, the last one pictured, as well. You know - THESE girls

 

[geebs]

Number three had my vote overall... but the flogging thing... gotta eat im...

Okay.. this is what I see... and only one person's opinion:

Cockerel one:

he is good overall...

eye color: good
ear coverts (feathers covering ears) optimal
horn color on beak: optimal
shape of bird: good
comb: less than desired
shape of head: good
wattles: optimal
Hackle feathers: optimal for standard (I would watch out for too much gold in a bird with a black breast)
chest: Less than desired red
width from aerial: good
tail: *improvement would be a more even marriage from back to tail and less of an angle. The tail coverts are a little long also but not unacceptable.
Shanks: Optimal
overall melaniser is fairly good though the flames in the chest will prevent this male uncorrected to creat a more suitable one.
Feet: good from what I can see
Feathering appears to be there, however, I see some white that I would watch.

The white on a feather can be caused by damage to the follicle also...

Okay moving on:

NUMBER 2:

eye color: less than desire but showing the lack of melaniser
ear coverts: need improvement
Horn: acceptable
wattles: good
Hackle color: good
shape of bird: Very good
shape of head... a little short.... would like a little more length in the skull (my opinion)
Comb: very good
neck: good
lenght of back: very good
Tail: optimal
leg feathering: good
tarsi and shank: optimal

My personal opinion is this... I like bird number two over bird number one due to several reasons: one the color balance on the bird is predicatable and is would be easier to anticipate the outcome. The bird with nothing to hide is showing all his assets. The bird number one may have a few genetic tricks up his sleeves due to the yellow in the hackle. This has been my experience. It is hard to set a good tail on a rooster and I have to appreciate the outline of number 2 first before number on because shape in my book comes before color balance.. The outcome of the number two bird when crossed on hens that are BC with very little to no black showing will likely produce nice offspring... both male and female. Please post picture of both the males and females and their offspring this fall and see if that is what happens.

Number one has good atributes as well... It cannot be overlooked that he is a very handsome fellow, with a great eye and fantastic look at me!! appearance. The shape of the head is beautiful to look at. I would reserve this one for too light long backed hens. I would likely not breed back his daughters to him as he looks to have a gene that produces another color besides BC.

P>S>.... Love the lowrider hen.. Sheesh what a looker... chunky munkey.

 

[NicoleRM]

I love this thread already. Learning a ton and REALLY need to get some pics of my birds to post!

 

[Wynette]

Illia, I like that hen as well - what is her breeding?

 

[greatergraceoffbg]

Illia I really like Guitard, he has good Type, good color, and actually really the right eye color which is red, He will throw a lot of good chicks.
The coloration of the the other is so thoroughly dispersed I almost think you may be looking at a Columbian gene in there, (anyone with knowledge of this trait feel free to criticize or correct me, I welcome any knowledge!) I saw this explanation of a Cock almost identical once a long time ago, I think it was in a Forum on BYC so I'll scout around and look for it. I understand the concept of breeding a Roo with red in the breast to hens lacking color, so you are following the accepted protocol exactly as I understand it. Well done!

 

[Wynette]

I can assure you, there is no Columbian in Illia's stock from me.

 

[RioLindoAz]

Does anyone know someone that breeds for egg production & egg color? Most of the people I see around mostly focus on the standard.

I'll be looking for chicks or hatching eggs in a few months...

Thanks

 

[Wynette]

Quote:
Ruth on here has very nice eggs, and I believe she has stated she's working on egg color mostly. I know she has entered her eggs into several egg shows and has done well!

 

[Stevo]

I bought a chick that was supposed to ba a BCM. Well it turned out to be a Sussex. lol. Thats what I get for not doing a little research first on breeder's. I don't have an incubator yet. If anyone knows of someone who would sell me some chicks please pm me.

Thanx Steve