Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[One Chick Two]

I have a little experience with breeding the heavy marked males to get a better colored female Hackle. Yes this will help with the female hackle but in my experience the Males from this will have too much Copper on the breast. Myself I would rather use a male that had just a few Copper feathers in the breast area.

We have Nine BC females from the experiment with buying eggs from ebay last year and they show no Copper at all. This egg experiment was a total disaster as for Color. These came from the supposed best breeders in the country. We culled all the males at an early age. I just do not believe in keeping anything if I do not have a purpose for it in the future. Don

Quote:
Agreed, Don. Last summer we too tried some eggs from Ebay, from similar sellers.

Out of 6 chicks hatched, two chicks threw missing toes. One chick threw "double" toes, plus yellow shanks.




One pullet stayed tiny before passing, never grew past a few months. One normal looking pullet now looks good- near show worthy (but, had strangely long tail feathers for a long time). Due to the yellow shanks, of course this whole group all had to go into the layers-only pen. The egg color from the pullets was nice though...better color than the eggs originally received. Serious squirrel tail on the rooster, plus shafting on his chest. Very dark eyes on some of the birds. But, basically, this was an expensive waste.

Recently, we purchased eggs from a different source. And while incubating, we then discovered that the seller was recently using laying pullets derived from Breeder 1 above (born within a month of my hatch.). Sure enough... one of the 5 chicks that hatched from this batch was again born missing toes, and a different chick looks to show odd recessives in her coloring. However, only a portion of these eggs sent, came from the Breeder 1's stock.

We have no way of knowing now which hens/pullets are the mothers of which chicks. Since I know there was yellow shanks (plus other serious issues) in the Breeder 1 line (Breeder 2 says they have not seen any of these issues- however, we did receive one with missing toes so there are issues...).

Should all of these chicks just be put in the layers-only pen since there is no no reliable test for yellow shanks (showing in young), or, a test for the missing toes gene? So... besides culling for obvious defects, and Wheaten testing, is there anything else that can be done? Or do I have another few years ahead of testing for this bunch?

In the future, when purchasing hatching eggs, I'm going to ask prospective sellers to number, or, name the hens that the egg came from- if possible. That way, say, if hen #3 throws a chick with serious genetic issues, all chicks from her can be marked/ put under evaluation, etc. Also, I could go back to the seller, and let them know that hen has a certain issue so they are at least aware of a potential problem.

Problem seems, is some sellers appear to care so little about cleaning house once they know there are problems.

 

[One Chick Two]

Hi all! We have two chicks from 5 eggs we purchased from a local hobby breeder. Four fertile, one stopped partway, one didn't pip. Based on wing tips at a day, we have a pullet and a roo. aka Daisy and Luke (Bo the blond, is an Ameracauna who hatched at the same time) ;-) Looking forward to reading through this forum...looks like a lot to learn about fbcm!

These chicks look nicely colored and well shaped, in my opinion. How is the shank feathering? I don't go by feather sexing either, but by looking at combs, top chick looks like a little pullet, and bottom a little cockerel- both very cute.

 

[johnderosa1]

Agreed, Don. Last summer we too tried some eggs from Ebay, from similar sellers. Out of 6 chicks hatched, two chicks threw missing toes. One chick threw "double" toes, plus yellow shanks. One pullet stayed tiny before passing, never grew past a few months. One normal looking pullet now looks good- near show worthy (but, had strangely long tail feathers for a long time). Due to the yellow shanks, of course this whole group all had to go into the layers-only pen. The egg color from the pullets was nice though...better color than the eggs originally received. Serious squirrel tail on the rooster, plus shafting on his chest. Very dark eyes on some of the birds. But, basically, this was an expensive waste. Recently, we purchased eggs from a different source. And while incubating, we then discovered that the seller was recently using laying pullets derived from Breeder 1 above (born within a month of my hatch.). Sure enough... one of the 5 chicks that hatched from this batch was again born missing toes, and a different chick looks to show odd recessives in her coloring. However, only a portion of these eggs sent, came from the Breeder 1's stock. We have no way of knowing now which hens/pullets are the mothers of which chicks. Since I know there was yellow shanks (plus other serious issues) in the Breeder 1 line (Breeder 2 says they have not seen any of these issues- however, we did receive one with missing toes so there are issues...). Should all of these chicks just be put in the layers-only pen since there is no no reliable test for yellow shanks (showing in young), or, a test for the missing toes gene? So... besides culling for obvious defects, and Wheaten testing, is there anything else that can be done? Or do I have another few years ahead of testing for this bunch? In the future, when purchasing hatching eggs, I'm going to ask prospective sellers to number, or, name the hens that the egg came from- if possible. That way, say, if hen #3 throws a chick with serious genetic issues, all chicks from her can be marked/ put under evaluation, etc. Also, I could go back to the seller, and let them know that hen has a certain issue so they are at least aware of a potential problem. Problem seems, is some sellers appear to care so little about cleaning house once they know there are problems.

So sad that this happens over and over . This is the only reason I started breeding chickens myself... To help people avoid some of this down the line. My only goal is to breed birds that reliably produce offspring that meet the SOPs and in this case (marans) produce an egg in the 6+ range. While its impossible to produce perfect specimens, providing people with decent starting stock should be the least we as breeders should strive for. I am in year 4 and have yet to come close to that goal... A testament to how many people sell eggs/birds that frankly, should not be sold. I have yet to sell an egg or chick because I couldn't do so in good conscience. There are reputable breeders out there, just not nearly enough .

 

[marchick]

What are your opinions on different lines of Black Coppers?

 

[One Chick Two]

So sad that this happens over and over . This is the only reason I started breeding chickens myself... To help people avoid some of this down the line. My only goal is to breed birds that reliably produce offspring that meet the SOPs and in this case (marans) produce an egg in the 6+ range. While its impossible to produce perfect specimens, providing people with decent starting stock should be the least we as breeders should strive for. I am in year 4 and have yet to come close to that goal... A testament to how many people sell eggs/birds that frankly, should not be sold. I have yet to sell an egg or chick because I couldn't do so in good conscience. There are reputable breeders out there, just not nearly enough.

Our goal is the same as yours. We have been trying to get a well-hackled female without sprigs who lays darker than a 5 egg, but have had a poor run of luck. Worst part- ask all careful questions... and still sprigs, Coronation comb, lines split with Wheaten, RW, heavy over melanization, etc.

This has occurred with well experienced breeders as well as some newer breeders. Mistakes can certainly happen, but, can't tell you how many times we've heard,"...We didn't know we had_____ in our flock..." And yet, still see recent hatching egg ads that do not acknowledge issue(s). What can you do?

There are many quality breeders in this thread. Not always possible to always purchase their eggs, however. If your flock shares the same faults, you don't want to double up.

 

[johnderosa1]

Our goal is the same as yours. We have been trying to get a well-hackled female without sprigs who lays darker than a 5 egg, but have had a poor run of luck. Worst part- ask all careful questions... and still sprigs, Coronation comb, lines split with Wheaten, RW, heavy over melanization, etc. This has occurred with well experienced breeders as well as some newer breeders. Mistakes can certainly happen, but, can't tell you how many times we've heard,"...We didn't know we had_____ in our flock..." And yet, still see recent hatching egg ads that do not acknowledge issue(s). What can you do?

There are many quality breeders in this thread. Not always possible to always purchase their eggs, however. If your flock shares the same faults, you don't want to double up.

Yes, There are some dedicated breeders on this thread that I would trust... Some advice to anyone looking for eggs or birds.... Dont rush in, read this thread for a while and ask lots of questions before moving ahead. There is no quick way forward with this breed but there are some excellent resources to draw from here. Build some relationships and you will get help.

 

[desertmarcy]

In the future, when purchasing hatching eggs, I'm going to ask prospective sellers to number, or, name the hens that the egg came from- if possible. That way, say, if hen #3 throws a chick with serious genetic issues, all chicks from her can be marked/ put under evaluation, etc. Also, I could go back to the seller, and let them know that hen has a certain issue so they are at least aware of a potential problem.

Problem seems, is some sellers appear to care so little about cleaning house once they know there are problems.

Good luck with that

Most people selling hatching eggs are not single mating, they are flock mating, and probably have no idea which hens the eggs came from.

 

[desertmarcy]

OK... I now have a complex.


My Marans rooster.... for no visible reason, was found dead this morning.

The Marans rooster I had before (totally unrelated) also was found dead one morning.

I have never had any other breed of rooster just up and die on me for no reason whatsoever.

Me......sad.

So sorry. I had this happen with a Barred Plymouth Rock male. Healthy, running around one day, found dead the next. I assume heart attack. I also had that happen to me with the first Bourbon Red turkey tom I had. It is for this reason I always keep back up males in both chickens and turkeys. It is expensive to feed and house spares but IMO necessary for a viable breeding program. Stuff happens. I had a friend visiting a while back. She lives in AZ also, but at higher elevation, so not as hot in summer where she is. She suggested to me I didn't need to keep this that or the other bird. I said, yes I do, because one of them could drop dead of the heat here. Had it happen. But not with Marans, they tolerate the heat well.

 

[Localheronow]

Good call I to go by the combs I can tell very early by the combs.

 

[Localheronow]

These chicks look nicely colored and well shaped, in my opinion. How is the shank feathering? I don't go by feather sexing either, but by looking at combs, top chick looks like a little pullet, and bottom a little cockerel- both very cute.

Good call I to go by the combs I can tell very early by the combs