Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Robert Blosl]

I just posted some pictures on a Plymouth Rock tread to look at the progress of the Canadian trio we got in and got into Scotts hands. I will post the other pictures which are some of these. To me a stunning color pattern, got lots of vigor, lay well for a Standard Breed Chicken but remember we are not counting eggs like the feed store kind that's not fair. They lay much more but are not the true breed we are trying to help out.

I don't know how the Delaware's got so much hype. Its in the words but is it in the bird?

If they where so great over the years why did they fall out of popularity to a hand full of chickens in the usa. They where a meat bird to start with and a darn good one in the 1950s and 60s.

Difficult to keep their color going and never did anything in the show room. However, Miss Kathy of Mo bird are worth working with but need her to coach you on the color.

This is a tough breed to get right but she has the skills and the receipt to do it.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/273471/plymouth-rock-thread/4640#post_11943654

here are my pictures minus one or two. bob

 

[Extra Java]

I definitely need a really big chest freezer. I have 25 HUGE BBB turkeys I want to process to make way for "real" chickens, and I'm having trouble drumming up enthusiasm for the turkeys in the "off season" even though people were begging me for more after Thanksgiving last year. I posted a lot of info about how much I enjoyed the one I just cooked, how easy it was, how many different things I made from him, and still zipo interest. Sigh. Maybe now that school is started and moms are packing lunches ... I think people are put off by the price of real food, and the turkeys have eaten a lot up to this point, and the special turkey starter is particularly expensive. And every single day they eat more ... and get bigger.

You are torturing me with the egg color thing.

Where is your turkey post? I would like to read it.

 

[3riverschick]

Many beginners again pick a breed like Delaware's that are being reinvented by Kathy of Mo and her few new people who have her line. Its in its infancy to rebuild. The ones that many people have are not much improved than feed store Delaware's but a few strains are not bad. Tough breed to try to improve for beginners. Take New Hampshire's man they are easy to get and raise they do it all. Many of the other breeds that are in need of help like the buff rocks should not be that hard or the Columbian Rocks ect.

However, it seems the novelty or the fad of the breed or the pretty panting of the breed gets them hooked then when they ask us to locate them the stock its near impossible to locate what they want do to the lack of breeders. Plenty of them in the Hatchers but that's not what they will want after they get them raised up and look at them.

How about Light Sussex? Since they are eWh based, they don't need the under-fluff color balancing seen in eb based breeds like Columbian Rocks and Delawares, There are several show quality strains I know of in North America which are accessible to folk in the US. Emily Robertson in British Columbia (TruNorth Heritage Poultry http://truenorthfarm.ca/ ); Walt Boese in Deer Lodge Montana ( http://www.manta.com/c/mm3lw81/walt-s-black-powder-shooting &see my avatar), Waltz's Ark in Colorado ( http://www.naturalark.com/sussex.html ), Sandra Ross in Ontario, Canada. I am sure there are more if you look around, including a farm in Ohio ( http://sunsetmeadowfarm.com/chickens_and_eggs.html ) Look at the breed type on their show winner "Hottie" ! Wow!
Best,
Karen

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Where is your turkey post? I would like to read it.

Oops, sorry for the confusion. That's on Facebook. I searched the Internet to learn how to peel the feet ... surprising lack of informative posts on that subject, which makes it a worthy topic for YouTube or here ... I tossed the feet in the bone broth. Today's Turkey Adventure is Turkey Pot Pie. I am not good with pie crust, so I have resisted that too long.

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Hi Leslie,
Wow, what a novella! I really enjoyed it, thanks for sharing.
Definitely getting an ovation for this work!
Uh, I forgot the Delaware questions, could you repost them?
Thanks,
Karen

Thanks for asking, Karen!

I tried to repost my previous posts via Multi-Quote and then edit out all the text for a shorter post that would link you back to the originals, but it wouldn't work.


Here was my first post:

I posted this on another thread and someone suggested I post it here. I'm really looking forward to doing my best at this, so am excited about any and all suggestions.

...

So ... I'm thinking of getting some "real" birds of a "real" breed from a "real" breeder so I can reorganize my flock. I'm curious about what I should do to find out if my current birds/set-up is going to be a "safe" place to bring in birds that I'm going to be more serious about. Is there any testing I should do? How should I handle the quarantine? Should I plan to keep the new birds entirely separate from the old birds? Or can I mingle the serious birds with the hatchery birds once the quarantine period is over?

Of course I'd like to use my existing coop/pastures for the more serious birds, and I would probably like to keep my Easter Eggers and a few other "pet" or "interesting" chickens from my existing flock even after the transition (egg variety). Is this an okay plan, or should I plan to just have the one breed?

I have egg customers, so am hoping to keep egg production up until the new birds are laying well. And it will certainly take me time to get the numbers of the new birds up so they can supply all the eggs the customers expect.

Background: What I have now is over 100 hatchery birds, various hatchery breeds, chickens, ducks, and turkeys, the oldest of which were bought in April of 2012. We've added a few more batches of chicks, poults and ducklings since last April, and have also hatched out some mutts here. We've gotten rid of a number of roosters and a few hens, a batch of meat birds, and last year's turkeys.

We did get one older chicken, a rehomed rooster who free-ranges with a few escapee hens around the pasture/coop where we keep the rest of the chickens, but we don't practice bio-security with him. And we got two re-homed adult ducks, same setup. Otherwise, it has all been hatchery chicks bought from the local feed store.

I really don't think we've had any serious health issues with our flock ... very few deaths, predator or otherwise.

So ... how should I prepare for the "serious" birds?

All opinions welcome!


Then someone asked for more details about the predator attacks and any deaths and diseases, so I posted this:


I don't really know what's worth mentioning and what is not, so I'll put down anything/everything I can think of.

I'll start with what worries me most: Illness:
Occasionally we've had an adult bird that will "cough" or "honk" for a day, and then they are fine. They don't look to be ill in any way ... no different from any of the other birds. Eating, drinking, scratching. No nasal discharge, no funky smell, no puffed up feathers, no huddling in a corner. No subsequent death. We have not culled or segregated any bird who has had this ... I can count exactly 2 birds (one hen, one rooster) that I know have done this. If there is a nasty bird virus percolating in my flock this the only sign of it, but I don't know if there is any way to test for it, or fit that is necessary.


I've seen a couple cases of vent issues that I've treated with warm soakings and "fixing" a prolapse and treating with athlete's foot cream if it seems to be a stinky situation. These tend to resolve very quickly.

Predator Problems:
Two young ducks (out of four) decapitated by predators ... we think it was an owl and seem to have solved the problem. That's it. Most of our birds are in fenced runs during the day and coops at night. No break-ins so far. I consider we've been lucky on this. It is a rural area with woods and open fields. (Edited: One hen refused to come down off the roof of the coop two nights ago at lock-up. She was beheaded by morning. So that makes 3 total birds lost to predators.)

Deaths:
One of our first batch of BBB turkeys (5 total) expired very shortly before Thanksgiving last year. He was huge. We ate him anyway as we were right there when he went down so processed him immediately.

This year's BBB turkeys we've already lost 4 (out of 25). No signs of previous problems. We called the extension service and vets and they say "it happens", especially with a larger flock, especially with "meat bird" breeds. Not to worry (I do worry). Sometimes they die, sometimes they cull each other (did I mention I still worry?). It didn't seem to be blackhead, though they didn't recommend investigating, etc. I still worry. But our turkeys are not mixed in with our chickens, and we don't intend to keep them.

We had one chicken hen mated by a drake and die. She was one of 4 free-ranging hens, the drake was also free-ranging. I think that situation explains itself ... we have/had a duck habitat built especially to keep this from happening, but for some reason my partners wouldn't agree to use it until the "murder" and subsequent extreme fit I pitched about it.

We had one hen die of complications from bumblefoot. Again, I think that explains itself. It was our first case of bumblefoot, and we didn't get on it fast enough. I think.

Last summer we had one hen dead in the coop, no warning. It was our first adult death, and I was freaked out and called the extension service, and they said they would not investigate a single death in a large flock (over 100 birds) unless there were other signs of illness in the flock (there were not). There WAS a brick laying next to her ... a brick which had been used to weight down something on top of a cage inside the coop ... a brick I had suggested was a "bad idea" as I imagined it could be knocked off the top of the cage and fall on a bird and ... We now have a policy against precarious bricks in the coop.

When the first batch of birds was in the brooder stage ... 60/70 birds or so ... we lost maybe 2 or 3 chicks before they went out into the coop. Ones that just didn't seem to thrive and didn't make it. We were pretty good about moving chicks to a hospital area if we noticed an issue.

Besides that, we did have some evil white leghorn chicks from that first batch of chicks that attacked anything and everything and they did murder at least one chick. We put those birds in "jail" hoping they'd learn their lesson. They did not. They were repeat offenders. We sent those evil birds away.

Last summer we had one rooster isolated in a separate pen ... he had never had contact with many of the other birds as he was purchased with a batch of roosters we brooded together and then isolated in individual cages when they got older, but of course the humans involved had contact with all birds without practicing bio security. This guy got a bump on his face, near his eye. He did not appear to have any kind of sinus trouble, no discharge, no bad smell, no coughing or sneezing, and after much research it seemed likely the problem was a bacterial infection birds can get from rubbing agains metal wire -- but that's just a guess. We culled him. No other birds have had this issue.

We've lost a couple fresh home-hatched mutt chicks and one duckling that hatched but didn't survive long. It seems that if they hatch at an appropriate time (not too early) and survive until they get up and out of the nest, and start scratching around with momma, they are good to go. Again, this hasn't been many. A couple early hatches, partial hatches, weaklings, and one or two that were probably stepped on. Probably less than 10 total out of probably 15-20 broods ... ?

We lost a handful of ducklings about at about a week old ... our first experience brooding ducklings ... and checked with the feed store we got them from and the other ducklings from the shipment were all thriving ... I think what was happening is they were choking ... they were very good at spilling all their water as they got bigger ... so we adjusted the water situation to assure they had constant access to water deep enough to get their heads in ... and no more duckling deaths. We currently have 25 or so adult ducks that seem healthy.

The percentage of losses here has been very low, I think.

I could be "missing" some health issues due to lack of experience, but deaths do get my attention and there haven't been many of those even though this list looks LONG all typed up!

So, so sorry for the huge post, and thank you for the offer to read my "question."

 

[Pathfinders]

I didn't even know Delawares were a fad. And I'm pretty much done with feed-store hatchery birds ... unless I can't survive the initiation phase of breaking into the Real Breeders Club.

I asked a couple of places what breed would be good for "real" bread Dual Purpose ...On the first hand I already sell eggs and feel responsible to my customers to keep providing eggs, and on the second hand some of those customers also want meat and though I've done a small batch of Cornish Cross (10 birds, which were super easy to raise and efficient and TOTALLY delicious! but SAD), I don't really feel good about contributing to the big-business factory-farming frankenchicken aspect of those, but on the third hand I really do want meat for my own freezer and on the fourth hand if I'm going to have a self-sustaining laying flock I'm going to have cockerels to get rid of and they might as well be meaty -- we have a farm, and the cockerels in the grow-out coop sure get a lot of attention from the crew, but the crew seems insulted by the scrawny ones!

I have been hoping to be able to eventually contribute to the conservation/restoration/preservation of a breed of chicken, and when recently I was pondering how to make better use of my broodies and pass useful stuff into all my various hands I thought "maybe now is the time to start looking at heritage breeds" so I asked around and was told Delawares is a breed in need of help that might be able to help me in my egg/meat goals along the way. That was a few weeks ago.

During my subsequent research I found a local person listed at the Delaware Breeders website, and checking her own website I see she is running a farm/business very much like I had imagined I might do, eggs and meat from the same self-sustaining flock, and she lives very near me -- she has pullets for sale right now, and I'm considering if I want to get some to mix in with my flock even though they probably wouldn't be part of the breeding project as she seems to be breeding more for production than breed advancement -- the fact that she's making that work is very encouraging. She processes her cockerels at about 16 weeks, which isn't a bad time investment for the male culls.

Someone a little further away has some of Kathy's birds, which are considered to be more improved, and is very serious about improving the breed further and excited that I might be willing to work with her so is hoping to be able to share a trio with me this fall.

I really just fell into the idea of Delawares ...

Is there a "better" choice?

Everyone knows I'm going to say BUCKEYES! Heh heh. Best dual purpose bird there is, IMO, and the pea comb means no frostbite issues (and no supplimental heat needed in the winter.) 150 to 200 large brown eggs, males that have broad breasts and dress out beautifully with very tasty meat.

I'm the resident Buckeye cheerleader.

 

[Robert Blosl]

I agree to all above breeds . Love the buckeyes for how they have improved in ten years. The Sussex are stunning we have a lady who has them down here in Pensacola Fla. She also has Scotts Colombians black and white heaven I bet when you see her set up.

Most important make a list of five breeds then narrow them down to two. Then try to get them this spring. Get on the lists of owners willing to share their stock. All three who posted are outstanding stewards of their breed so don't be afraid to order from them and they are great mentors.

 

[Lacy Blues]

LeslieD

You can help me out......I raise LF Plymouth Rocks in the Columbian pattern.....similar to the Delaware in coloring, without the barring on the males

VERY rare variety in the states and in need of MUCH help in the US with breeders from west coast to east coast

Here are a couple pix

Scott, no fair, no fair, NO FAIR!

If I had room and more money to invest in a breed to raise to the SOP, I'm thinking these would be it! I just LOVE what you've done with them!

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Everyone knows I'm going to say BUCKEYES!  Heh heh. Best dual purpose bird there is, IMO, and the pea comb means no frostbite issues (and no supplimental heat needed in the winter.) 150 to 200 large brown eggs, males that have broad breasts and dress out beautifully with very tasty meat. 


I'm the resident Buckeye cheerleader.  :yiipchick

Wikipedia says Buckeyes get bigger that Delawares. Do they grow as fast?

I LOVE that Buckeyes are credited to a woman.

Comb doesn't matter as much in western Oregon. We don't get too much super cold weather here. Usually.

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

How about Light Sussex?

I got some Speckled Sussex at the feed store -- don't know how they would compare to the Light Sussex. The feed-store SS were SO adorable in the brooder, almost as friendly and entertaining as turkeys. And the inevitable oopsie cockerel is a good size, too. Based only on hatchery experience, this would be one of two breeds I'd keep (besides colorful egg layers) because the birds are good sized and nice in the flock.