Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[catdaddyfro]

Uh ... sorry Bob

Okay I'll follow my dog post with a chicken post in a desperate attempt to appease the Heritage Large Fowl Gods:

The scenario is, you have purchased 10 day old chicks knowing you plan on keeping a maximum of 6 (2 cockerels, 4 pullets) to breed to SOP. I know breeds mature at different rates so assume for argument's sake you have purchased Partridge Rocks. At what age (chick age, not your age) are you reasonably confident you can select the keepers? Is there any such cutoff or is it largely dependent on the lines, brood, or other elements that might contribute to the maturity rate?

BUMP so this don't get tangled up in the dogs leashes

a legit. ? here

jeff

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

Uh ... sorry Bob

Okay I'll follow my dog post with a chicken post in a desperate attempt to appease the Heritage Large Fowl Gods:

The scenario is, you have purchased 10 day old chicks knowing you plan on keeping a maximum of 6 (2 cockerels, 4 pullets) to breed to SOP. I know breeds mature at different rates so assume for argument's sake you have purchased Partridge Rocks. At what age (chick age, not your age) are you reasonably confident you can select the keepers? Is there any such cutoff or is it largely dependent on the lines, brood, or other elements that might contribute to the maturity rate?

I'll attempt this for what my opinion is worth. I raise LF Columbian Rocks and will use 3 breeding seasons of experience to answer your question. First, my birds mature VERY slowly!! I can be relatively confident in my keeper pullets by the age of 6-7 months. However, some of them will not be laying at this point. My males are a totally different story!! In this season, I determined that I had been culling cockerels WAY TOO SOON. The tails on my males seem not to fully develop until after the 10 month mark....I had sorted out 3 "non keepers" some time back as their tails were too flat, and had sorted 3 "keepers" into another pen. Since my work schedule hadn't allowed me to get rid of my culls they were still here as I started setting up breeding pens. The cockerels I had culled with tails "too low" were suddenly developing VERY nice, lifted tails. The ones I had selected as "keepers" suddenly had tails that were TOO HIGH. In my opinion LF are hard to completely judge as keepers until they are a year or better in age.

Also, PLEASE keep in mind that in order to make improvements toward the SOP on an annual basis, you will need to raise a LOT of chicks every year, especially on a breed/variety that needs significant work. Rule of thumb is that 1 in 10 may be a keeper. I raised 140 Columbian Rock chicks last season and at this time I have 3 cockerels and 10 pullets that I've kept. I am also holding over 3 hens that I bred to last yr.

These are only opinions on my part and I am certainly no master breeder. Hope this helps you somewhat

 

[poularde]

Speaking of breeding decisions. i have a few Good Shepard Barred Rock cockerels growing up. They have quite a while until I make my choice. I am trying to downsize for winter and I am wondering about this guy. I assume his color is so bad that he is a cull. Should I continue to let him grow or for sure he is not worth waiting on? He looks nothing like his siblings. Opinions please.

 

[kathyinmo]

Speaking of breeding decisions. i have a few Good Shepard Barred Rock cockerels growing up. They have quite a while until I make my choice. I am trying to downsize for winter and I am wondering about this guy. I assume his color is so bad that he is a cull. Should I continue to let him grow or for sure he is not worth waiting on? He looks nothing like his siblings. Opinions please.

I would say he is not full Barred Rock. He looks like my F1 crosses (Barred Rock x New Hamp)

 

[poularde]

Hello Kathy!

I was going to PM you about him.

 

[docdandc]

I'll attempt this for what my opinion is worth. I raise LF Columbian Rocks and will use 3 breeding seasons of experience to answer your question. First, my birds mature VERY slowly!! I can be relatively confident in my keeper pullets by the age of 6-7 months. However, some of them will not be laying at this point. My males are a totally different story!! In this season, I determined that I had been culling cockerels WAY TOO SOON. The tails on my males seem not to fully develop until after the 10 month mark....I had sorted out 3 "non keepers" some time back as their tails were too flat, and had sorted 3 "keepers" into another pen. Since my work schedule hadn't allowed me to get rid of my culls they were still here as I started setting up breeding pens. The cockerels I had culled with tails "too low" were suddenly developing VERY nice, lifted tails. The ones I had selected as "keepers" suddenly had tails that were TOO HIGH. In my opinion LF are hard to completely judge as keepers until they are a year or better in age.

Also, PLEASE keep in mind that in order to make improvements toward the SOP on an annual basis, you will need to raise a LOT of chicks every year, especially on a breed/variety that needs significant work. Rule of thumb is that 1 in 10 may be a keeper. I raised 140 Columbian Rock chicks last season and at this time I have 3 cockerels and 10 pullets that I've kept. I am also holding over 3 hens that I bred to last yr.

These are only opinions on my part and I am certainly no master breeder. Hope this helps you somewhat

What do you expect your ratio of keepers will be the following season? Maybe a better question to ask is; How many seasons should it take until they are so close to the SOP that you get all super show quality birds? Starting with the best stock available is the best way to shorten the wait thru multiple small step breeding seasons, surely.

With raising 140 chicks, I am sure you have been able to make huge steps towards your SOP goals.

 

[Pozees]

I'll attempt this for what my opinion is worth. I raise LF Columbian Rocks and will use 3 breeding seasons of experience to answer your question. First, my birds mature VERY slowly!! I can be relatively confident in my keeper pullets by the age of 6-7 months. However, some of them will not be laying at this point. My males are a totally different story!! In this season, I determined that I had been culling cockerels WAY TOO SOON. The tails on my males seem not to fully develop until after the 10 month mark....I had sorted out 3 "non keepers" some time back as their tails were too flat, and had sorted 3 "keepers" into another pen. Since my work schedule hadn't allowed me to get rid of my culls they were still here as I started setting up breeding pens. The cockerels I had culled with tails "too low" were suddenly developing VERY nice, lifted tails. The ones I had selected as "keepers" suddenly had tails that were TOO HIGH. In my opinion LF are hard to completely judge as keepers until they are a year or better in age.

Also, PLEASE keep in mind that in order to make improvements toward the SOP on an annual basis, you will need to raise a LOT of chicks every year, especially on a breed/variety that needs significant work. Rule of thumb is that 1 in 10 may be a keeper. I raised 140 Columbian Rock chicks last season and at this time I have 3 cockerels and 10 pullets that I've kept. I am also holding over 3 hens that I bred to last yr.

These are only opinions on my part and I am certainly no master breeder. Hope this helps you somewhat

This is very helpful - and I had forgotten the discussion about the tails on your males, really good information. Thank you!

 

[Robert Blosl]

Any one getting Plymouth Rocks this coming year?

 

[Chris Herzog]

I already have some Barred Rocks but I'm thinking that I'm going to get me some White Rocks for next year or at the show in FL in December if I see some for sale that I like. I really liked the ones Jeremy Whipple had posted a couple weeks back.

Chris

 

[3riverschick]

Have you ever read Alfred Payson Terhune's books about his Sunnybank Collies? Great books. Gave me my great love of the breed.

Yeah, read just about every one, smile. Just loved them when I as a teenager. In fact, they were the excuse for my 1st collie. I worked for 2 months helping around the house when I was 14 to earn $50. I told my Mom I wanted to buy the complete works of Terhune. Anyway, I figured a real collie was the personification of his works so it wasn't too bad a lie

.
That day, I got a new basket for the front of my bicycle and pedaled several miles to a local collie kennel which had advertised puppies. Picked out a nice tricolor rough and headed home. Mom was watching out the window as I slowly pedaled up the hill on which our house sat. She looked once, "What has she got?? "....Looked once again, "What is that?"...and the third time, " Oh she's got a puppy!!!!". Hee, hee, Mom is a softie for pets in our houses when we were growing up, so after some eager explanations and promises on my part, Prince got to stay. I had him all trained for his first offical AKC obedience trial when he started losing me on the heel off-leash. Took him to the vet. Going blind from PRA. He didn't adjust and was frightened, so I put my buddy down at 3 1/2.

24 years later, I entered the breed again, determined to do a better job and produce better dogs than Prince. And I did.
Best,
Karen