Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Robert Blosl]

I think of the four females I had one or two had less fluff in the rear ends. So their daughters and sons had less fluff the next generation then each year I kept putting what Ralph Sturgeon called BREEDING PRESSURE on this section. Hatch ability increased each year and then by five years the incubator was loaded with chicks. Now 25 years latter I can put five eggs in and 21 days latter four chicks. By reducing the fluff in the rear end I increased the feather quality. The standard calls for a good Webb in the feather but we as show people don't pay any attention to it. We breed what the fad is for that time period. Today its worse than ever. If you don't have a huge big white rock fluff balls in a cage you cant win. The males needs double cages as they cant get around in the standard size show coop there so big. If you weigh your birds and they are about one pound over standard weight you are in the ball park. If your females lay 180 to 200 eggs per year, mature fast,, lay early go through a molt fast and start laying quickly after their molt you got a dream strain of White Plymouth Rocks. Heck I have had females laying well up to 7 years of age and still have their pullet shape one hen won champion American at a show at five years of age. The did not be leave she was that old. The egg count is a estimate no trap nesting done but I saw improvements each year in the laying.

If you read any of the old poultry books by Dryden or Hogan they talk about picking the fast layers, heck I was taught this in 4 H poultry judging as a kid. That's how poutlrymen cull and pick white leghorn layers for egg laying farms.

Poor feather quality is getting worse in our show chickens. We see one strain of rhode island red large fowl with humps in the middle of their backs. One expert feels its due to just poor feather quality. It can be corrected but it takes dedication and time.

bob

 

[Run A Fowl Farm]

I want to thank you all for having such great information on this thread! I have spent over a week reading the whole thing & my husband keeps teasing me about my "sewing" whenever he sees me on the computer now. He says this thread is so long I should have a king sized quilt made by now. I have filled over 80 pages in my word document with information from this thread and have a long reading list of books to get from the library if I can't find them as ebooks.

I've been working on a breeding project of Dominiques with a friend of mine and making progress - generation four is in the bator. Since we don't have any APA shows here in Oregon, we have been going to shows in Northern CA and in Washington State. I love my APA Standard as well as the flash cards the APA has for training youth (has been great for my 4Her's).

After reading this thread, I would like to get rid of my Marans & Ameraucana projects and work on RI Whites if I can find some that I can afford. Is there anyone other than Mr. Urch that have any of decent quality to start with?

Thank you again for all the great posts!
Rhonda

 

[Robert Blosl]

There was a lady in Washington working on them Near Aberdeen area. She use to post on here in the early days. There is no R I whites worth a hoot. Never was really. You might be better to crossing a Rose Comb White Wyandotte onto a good strain of White Plymouth Rocks and start your own. I had a friend who crossed one of my white rock large fowl on his hatchery white wyandottes and had a female that was a killer R I White. Brick shaped and looked like my old rhode island reds.

Urch may sell you some eggs and you could see what he has and start from there. I dont know if my friend has any of these old birds. Be leave it or not he has some of my old White Rock large fowl from five years ago. I did not know any where around anymore. I am going to cross a hen onto my ckl in a few weeks for fresh blood. bob

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Yeah! I'll try to do a link to google books: http://books.google.com/


Go here and search for the various titles of out of print booksmost of which you'll find in toto and for free! Any book written by John Henry Robinson is well worth reading. Might I suggest starting with The Principles and Practice of Poultry Culture. This is the first Robinson book that Bob recommended, and it is superlative. Once you've read that, Robinson has several other titles to enjoy.

 

[CharlieVoda]

After reading this thread, I would like to get rid of my Marans & Ameraucana projects and work on RI Whites if I can find some that I can afford. Is there anyone other than Mr. Urch that have any of decent quality to start with?

Thank you again for all the great posts!
Rhonda

Here are what Duane Urch Rose Comb RI Whites look like. The males are the same size as his RC RIR the hens are a tad smaller.

Here is a link to more pics including RC RIR.
http://www.heritagebreedpoultry.com/charlie_voda
Good luck with the birds
Charlie

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Hmmmm...On the one hand, it could be said that there are unknown genetics lying beneath. On the other hand, there is much to improve with that male: type in all regards needs strengthening, and his head appears, for what a photo can show, to indicate via eye and color a lack of vigor. Fixing it would be one heck of a breeding program, but, if one is going to get involved with a breed as desperately rare as RI Whites nothing less should be expected.

Kelley Klober is very fond of the SC RI Whites offered by Ideal hatchery. I've never seen them, but he seems convinced that they are of excellent vigor with strong laying capacities. My first thoughts are that, were I hoping to redeem the RI White, I would get 100-200 straight run RI Whites from Ideal. And I'd cull for the very best type and vigor possible. I'd also get as many RC Ri Whites from Urch as possible. At the end of the season I would cull down to a minimum of four pairs or trios each with one gender represented by an Urch bird while the other gender would be an Ideal bird. i.e. Urch cockerel on Ideal pullets or vice versa. I'd use these matings to begin matrilinear clan breeding in order to insure that I never dead-lock my genetics because there's nowhere to go to get more stock without having to start over which would be devastating.

The following season, I'd hatch heavily. I'd cull any chick at the hatcher door that were not rose combed, lest I use up my brooder space with birds that have no chance of ever being breeders. Being a white bird that would be enjoying a certain level of heterosis, i.e. hybrid vigor, I'd bet you'd see birds meeting the overall Standard requirements in five years. This would depend above all on an unwaveringly strong commitment to culling and on an absolute respect for the need to maintain the four families.

It would be awesome to see, for I doubt these birds have been available in high quality for multiple decades. A l'attaque!

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Thought you might be interested in seeing a photo of one of our Dorkings dressed. I'd say our roasters average 4- 4 1/2/lbs dressed at 6months of age. Each year there is a general increase. This year we're beginning the season with a majority of breeders that meet or excel the Standard requirements for weight. I think we'll see continued progress this year. The trick seems to be that the birds need to match the Standard both to the eye and in the hand:

 

[NYREDS]

Hmmmm...On the one hand, it could be said that there are unknown genetics lying beneath. On the other hand, there is much to improve with that male: type in all regards needs strengthening, and his head appears, for what a photo can show, to indicate via eye and color a lack of vigor. Fixing it would be one heck of a breeding program, but, if one is going to get involved with a breed as desperately rare as RI Whites nothing less should be expected.

Kelley Klober is very fond of the SC RI Whites offered by Ideal hatchery. I've never seen them, but he seems convinced that they are of excellent vigor with strong laying capacities. My first thoughts are that, were I hoping to redeem the RI White, I would get 100-200 straight run RI Whites from Ideal. And I'd cull for the very best type and vigor possible. I'd also get as many RC Ri Whites from Urch as possible. At the end of the season I would cull down to a minimum of four pairs or trios each with one gender represented by an Urch bird while the other gender would be an Ideal bird. i.e. Urch cockerel on Ideal pullets or vice versa. I'd use these matings to begin matrilinear clan breeding in order to insure that I never dead-lock my genetics because there's nowhere to go to get more stock without having to start over which would be devastating.

The following season, I'd hatch heavily. I'd cull any chick at the hatcher door that were not rose combed, lest I use up my brooder space with birds that have no chance of ever being breeders. Being a white bird that would be enjoying a certain level of heterosis, i.e. hybrid vigor, I'd bet you'd see birds meeting the overall Standard requirements in five years. This would depend above all on an unwaveringly strong commitment to culling and on an absolute respect for the need to maintain the four families.

It would be awesome to see, for I doubt these birds have been available in high quality for multiple decades. A l'attaque!

Here we go again. You do realize that whatever Ideal is selling they aren't Rhode Island Whites? Rhode Island Whites are recognized in rose combed only. There was never a standardized single combed variety.

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

Has anyone actually seen what Ideal's Rhode Island Whites look like. Do they have rose or single combs? Though the Diane Jackey print shows a single comb. This could be a simple mistake by an artist.


Quote:

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Here we go again. You do realize that whatever Ideal is selling they aren't Rhode Island Whites? Rhode Island Whites are recognized in rose combed only. There was never a standardized single combed variety.

Yes, you are correct, but that's not at all the point. They are needed for heterosis. They are white and yellow skinned, and probably approximate RI type more than would SQ White Rocks or Wyandottes. Proper culling would eliminate the SC rather quickly.