Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Chris09]

Originally Posted by Robert Blosl

My hope by starting this thread is pick ten breeds of rare chickens study them and put them in order of importance of value worth fooling with. Then if you find three breeds worth working with try to find the best line of that breed you can locate and hope you can hook up with that breeder for guidance.

Having a breed and hatching them each year ,but not improving them wont help the breed.

Just for the fun of it, what breeds have you been thinking about to help and rebuild?????????????????????

Just my thoughts. Bob
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Hi Bob,
I'm a real historical purist. First in collies, now in Poultry. I wanted to raise up the Golden Salmon Marans (wildtype) here in the US but that didn't happen. So after searching around for another breed, I've decided I want to breed Sussex the English way. Have settled on Light Sussex, forgoing any Aussie influence. I know Greenfire didn't mean to cause problems in the variety but things are kinda messy right now with the breed type differences between US and Aussie lines. Esp. with folk thinking "bigger is better" and not understanding the difference between close-feathered and soft-feathered fowl. I think Light Sussex in the US could really profit from a good dose of Sussex bred the historic English way.
Best,
Karen in western PA, USA

Do you mean Hard and Soft feathered fowl? A soft feathered fowl can also be close feathered.
All close feathering means is that the fowl holds it feathering close to the body, Hard and Soft describes the "structure" of the feather. For the most part Hard feathered fowl are game type fowl.
A Sussex would be a Soft Feathered fowl that hold it's feathers close to the body.

Chris

 

[Robert Blosl]

Rhode Island Red
Barred Rock
Euskal Oilia (Basque)
Houdan
Delaware
Brabanter
Orloff


Some of these breeds I have never heard of befor Houdans yes they would be a choice for me Delawares I would wait two to three years and get some from Kathy. Barred Rocks there are three good strains out there need help in the tails bad on some strains. Rhode Island Reds the Mohawks my old line and the New York Reds large fowl I would get in a heart beat.

So many old APA breeds need help so bad. Buff Rock large fowl , Silver Penciled Rocks, Partridge Rocks, Rose Comb Rhode Island Reds,
Sussex, Buff Orpingtons the APA kind not the fluffy ones with out feathers on thier feet.

No one even talks about Brown Leghorns, they are so pretty lay good and are very rare. bob Keep them coming please. bob

http://www.ezfshn.com/Tides/USA/Alabama

 

[HaikuHeritageFarm]

No one even talks about Brown Leghorns, they are so pretty lay good and are very rare. bob Keep them coming please. bob

http://www.ezfshn.com/Tides/USA/Alabama

I'm glad you reminded me of them. From a very young age I thought the classic brown leghorn rooster was what all chickens were supposed to look like. (I think they must have featured prominently in various Little Golden Books.)

Are there good strains available out there? I'd be interested in talking to folks with either single or rose comb strains and learning more about what challenges one might face with them.

 

[heritagehabitatfarms]

one of my dreams has been to work with the RC brown leghorn LF ever since McMurry sent a male as the surprise chick in with my moms order buff Orp's when i was about 10... i would love to get the light and dark brown's...

I'm glad you reminded me of them. From a very young age I thought the classic brown leghorn rooster was what all chickens were supposed to look like. (I think they must have featured prominently in various Little Golden Books.)

Are there good strains available out there? I'd be interested in talking to folks with either single or rose comb strains and learning more about what challenges one might face with them.

 

[OSUman]

I was at a show today and there were some really nice black Leghorns, it won Ch Med. and possibly ch LF (not positive about that one though)

Rhode Island Red
Barred Rock
Euskal Oilia (Basque)
Houdan
Delaware
Brabanter
Orloff


Some of these breeds I have never heard of befor Houdans yes they would be a choice for me Delawares I would wait two to three years and get some from Kathy. Barred Rocks there are three good strains out there need help in the tails bad on some strains. Rhode Island Reds the Mohawks my old line and the New York Reds large fowl I would get in a heart beat.

So many old APA breeds need help so bad. Buff Rock large fowl , Silver Penciled Rocks, Partridge Rocks, Rose Comb Rhode Island Reds,
Sussex, Buff Orpingtons the APA kind not the fluffy ones with out feathers on thier feet.

No one even talks about Brown Leghorns, they are so pretty lay good and are very rare. bob Keep them coming please. bob

http://www.ezfshn.com/Tides/USA/Alabama

 

[3riverschick]

Do you mean Hard and Soft feathered fowl? A soft feathered fowl can also be close feathered.
All close feathering means is that the fowl holds it feathering close to the body, Hard and Soft describes the "structure" of the feather. For the most part Hard feathered fowl are game type fowl.
A Sussex would be a Soft Feathered fowl that hold it's feathers close to the body.

Chris

My point exactly, Chris. "A Sussex would be a Soft Feathered fowl that hold it's feathers close to the body."
Judge Broomhead in his brilliant exposition on the Light Sussex in 1921
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003137332 , Page 6, 3rd paragraph.
states that close feathering in the Sussex means, "It can best be described as feathering that will not be
blown out of position by every puff of wind coming from behind. ". Broomhead also discusses the structure
of the feather stating, "The plumage or feather-- which, as has been mentioned , is included in
capability--should have a natural gloss and be closely "knitted" as it were, indicating robust constitution.".
Yet, we see many new Sussex breeders
going after an Orpington-type of feathering. I've spent a lot of time looking at this quirk. The Standard in both
sides of the pond is explicit. Have come to conclude there is a basic misunderstanding regarding soft feathered,
loose feathered and close feathered. And possibly, hard feathered. Misconceptions at this point of understanding
breed type can cause wrong parameters which effect all decisions after that point.
for instance:
1. The Sussex is soft feathered,... soft is fluffy, ...fluffy is caused by loose feathering. so the Sussex is a
soft feathered, loose feathered bird. ( having never bothered to define the troublesome term "close feathered"
which doesn't seem to fit the visual anyway.).
2. The Sussex is "Close feathered"? Sounds like a version of hard feathering to me. Defnitely, *not* soft feathered.
How can it be soft feathered and a version of hard feathered at the same time? Guess the soft feathered part of the
definition must be more important. Ok, soft feathered..soft is fluffy... ok soft feathered and loose feathered.

Sound ridiculous?, not really when we see so many new folk breeding for the Orpington-type in Sussex.
Something is causing well-meaning new breeders to choose wrong breed type when it comes to these four terms.
From where I sit, it seems misunderstanding resulting in wrong evaluation parameters is the best answer.
I think the term close feathered gets way too little play-time when we are taking breed type. Yet, its presence is critical
to breed type. In Sussex, breed type is inseparatable from breed function.
I wish we could see articles about what these four "feathered" terms mean in Poultry Press or something.
Best,
Karen in western PA, USA

 

[Robert Blosl]

There is a Sussex Breeder in Ohio I think, may be a retired Minister and Poultry Judge. This fellow knows this breed he has the Speckled I think. New York Reds or Walt may know who he is. He will tell you what they should be. I hope you wont confuse or cloudy the issue of feather quality with what goes on in England or here in the USA. When we try to preserve the old breeds in the USA and Canada we are breeding this way. Take the English standard and put in in the fire place. It has no place in breeding old Heritage Fowl in the USA in my view.

If you want to go that route that is fine, but we will not send future breeders to your door step for stock.

One way to get a good grade of feather or a Sussex or Orpington is push for high egg production. This is a lost art but so easy to learn and do. If you do it right you wont have to pull the feathers from the vents of your breeders like so many have to do to get chicks to hatch. Feather quality in a large fowl is Paramount and today we dont see breeders or chicken collectors working on this trait. They are happy with a big large fluffy bird and they think bigger is better. Heck they dont even weigh their birds anymore and I would love to know when is the last time you so a digital scale at a poultry show. I have never seen one and if you brought one you may not get out alive. bob

 

[flitter]

Quote: Okay...time to show my stupidity... but how do you push for high egg production? Keep records and breed high producing birds and cull the rest? Is there more? I have Doms and Redcaps... not Orps... but in Dom hens, especially, the fluffy butt will creep in. This time of year I get an egg a day. In the winter 4-5 eggs/week/hen.

 

[Chris09]

3riverschick,

From what I saw on the Sussex Club of Australia and the 2008 National Sussex Show photos they have posted there, the Sussex breed in Australia is a big, soft feathered fowl that has a pinched tail and a lot of fluff between the tail and legs.

I agree with Bob ditch the UK standard its not going to help you here in the states.


Chris

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Okay...time to show my stupidity... but how do you push for high egg production? Keep records and breed high producing birds and cull the rest? Is there more? I have Doms and Redcaps... not Orps... but in Dom hens, especially, the fluffy butt will creep in. This time of year I get an egg a day. In the winter 4-5 eggs/week/hen.

Nice to read that you're working with redcaps. Check out the ALBC. Their educational materials are quite good. Consider reading Hogan's The Call of the Hen. Both the redcaps and the Dominique should be sound layers.