Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Shaffer]

Exhibition White Orps are nearly extinct in the USA. Under 10 serious Exhibition White Orp breeders I know of are even trying to breed and show them.
One of the our BYC better White Orp breeders in the country let me have this pullet's daddy. I am using him with a Buff Sport Orp and a Single Comb White Wyandotte pullets.
This is one of the older chicks. Near or abouts 4 month old.
Haroldine

Bill, glad you shared some pictures of this years potential show birds. I had loaned some of my birds this year with several breeders but one has to be careful who one trust. So there should be close to 100 extra birds floating around the area this year from these fellows. I do not sell birds just cull them and occassionally give a few away to trustworthy people.

 

[lildinkem]

Harry we all need to thank you for your ability to put together great birds in all breeds and varieties. I would not have anything White if not for you.
As you all can see I honor Harry by naming my birds with him in mind.
Like Harcourt my 3 month ole. Who looks like he has some potential to be a White Orp producer someday.
Thanks Harry!!!

 

[fowlman01]

Need help?

Yes me.

I saw last night one of the nicest Rhode Island Red 18 month old hens I have seen in a while. In fact I use to have many like this hen about ten to five teen years ago. What I liked about her was her tail section with the classic Tee Pee spread, the nice long back and her classic brick shape. Her color came back even from her molt and I just think she would be a bird I would like to rebuild my old line back with that I gave up ten years ago. However she has a fault and one that I have not seen in my old strain of Rhode Island Red large fowl.

She is nock kneed.

So how to I go about breeding her to breed out this fault out of this line and get this great trait she has with her top section and tail in all of her future off spring.???

I have access to four half and half cockerels and I am sure one or two of them will be full of vigor and have big boned strong legs to help over come this dilemma. What I mean half Illinois and half Flordia strains that we have done here.

Next what causes such a good looking female to be nock kneed? In breeding is my guess as its been 14 years since the breeder got his start form me and the strain was closed or no out side blood then and today since 1912.

The half and half chicks look like they are on upper pills this is the cross I have been wanting to see for ten years.

Walt, New York Reds what do you think?

I agree with Lucy Blue on this part. If it were my bird, I would just make sure that the female/females I crossed him with had the proper length shank or even a little long. If he's the first like that in the line he's from, it might not present too much of a problem. You can always cull the birds that show up with short shanks.

As far as the knock knees........Is it just knock knees or are the legs too close together....or both. If it has knock knees and close legs, I would be reluctant to breed from it as it has two faults, not just one. Legs too close together are an indication of an unthrify bird .....a bird that has no capacity for organs. If the legs were only slightly knocked, but still had good width between the legs it could be something you might be able to deal with and would be worth the effort to try as long as you kept good track of the offspring....... which I know that you do Bob.

Walt

 

[fowlman01]

Walt, i had no idea you showed or even owned that many..wish you would grace us with some pics of im sure are splended examples...17 time australion national champion australorp breeder said nothing works like greens ( stuff growing around your yard ) to shine up a bird..i feed what romig recomended that he uses on all of his, thou it isnt really special..same stuff just a little greens added.. they really beef up on it..or it enhances what momma nature gave ya...really helps the molter throu a rough time..mostly thou its just same mix..my cheap camera doesnt even capture the high glass shine on the dressage horses..those horses look like showroom vehicle shine..my camera makes them look like jalopees..an old timer told me that waaay back in the day they used to shine up feathers with a silk rag , they swore by it.

I have shown at Phoenix AZ and Eureka CA on the same weekend with the exact same entry of 50 birds in each place, if that gives you an idea that we might be into showing. That was a while back, but if you have an APA yearbook you can check the show record under Jones and Leonard. We show a lot.

I have 500+ birds on the ground here now and have had as many as 1500 here. I'm kind of into showing.

Walt

 

[cherylcohen]

I've seen Walt's birds, they are amazing!

 

[Lacy Blues]

I agree with Lucy Blue on this part. If it were my bird, I would just make sure that the female/females I crossed him with had the proper length shank or even a little long. If he's the first like that in the line he's from, it might not present too much of a problem. You can always cull the birds that show up with short shanks.

As far as the knock knees........Is it just knock knees or are the legs too close together....or both. If it has knock knees and close legs, I would be reluctant to breed from it as it has two faults, not just one. Legs too close together are an indication of an unthrify bird .....a bird that has no capacity for organs. If the legs were only slightly knocked, but still had good width between the legs it could be something you might be able to deal with and would be worth the effort to try as long as you kept good track of the offspring....... which I know that you do Bob.

Walt

Sorry for the confusion Walt, but I was responding to "Catdaddy" (Jeff) regarding his German bloodline of New Hampshires. He has a great cockerel with short shanks. Bob's bird is knock kneed.

Maybe for Bob's hen, I would make super sure that the male I use her with is nice and wide and that he came from a hen (and the entire family line) who was nice and wide too and who also had great laying/abdominal capacity! Several people have told me that the male will pass his traits to his daughters and that the female will pass to the sons so if I use a female with a fault or disqualification, to just cull all of her sons. I haven't seen this to be an absolute rule. They seem to me to be just about equal. I have a nice large rooster with great abdominal capacity (rare in an Andalusian - in mine anyway) who when he was very young had one point on his comb that was a split point... at least it looked like one to me. I kept him because of his depth and as he matured, the split point deepened and at adulthood, looks almost like two normal points. You'd have to know it was there to notice it at all. Anyway, mating him to a female who's family had no such point issues to try and keep it from passing on, gave me some very nice chicks. The oldest male of the chicks, and the only one of them all, has a split point, like his daddy did. So, it isn't black and white as to who passes to whom.

 

[ashandvine]

im thinking about using my old food dehydrator and collect up some of the plants in the yard that these chickens love, crumble them up in a big jar for next early breeding season..there is one plant i dont know the name of it, but they gobble it right up..the local native americans told me use it to tame bee stings and it really works..we call it chicken lettuce ..that and a few others they cant seem to get enough of.. one has a tiny white flower , they eat those right to the ground..they leave the things they dont like so i wont be picking those..

If you send pics I could probably id your plants. Sounds like common plantain for your bee sting- also great on bug bites if made into a poultice and put on-- the sooner the better. Send a pic and I'll try to id. Ever try dock seeds? We will this year. I also let the Lambs Quarters and wild Amaranth go in the garden this year. I'll feed the seeds but I'm not sure how much and of the birds will respond to tried leaves. I considered rehydrating them. Ideas here?

And thank you all for the responses re: the Safflower. I was guessing large birds like the heritage buffs needed the protein and using Saaflower oil for its 'vitamin E' values I guessed maybe feather quality. But I hate guessing.

 

[thedragonlady]

im thinking about using my old food dehydrator and collect up some of the plants in the yard that these chickens love, crumble them up in a big jar for next early breeding season..there is one plant i dont know the name of it, but they gobble it right up..the local native americans told me use it to tame bee stings and it really works..we call it chicken lettuce ..that and a few others they cant seem to get enough of.. one has a tiny white flower , they eat those right to the ground..they leave the things they dont like so i wont be picking those..
i have the horse so we always have hay around..i noticed years ago that in coldest weather i would bed them down in soft hay pretty deep..it would start dissappearing..couldnt figure out where it was going..until i saw a hen with a stem of hay out her beak like a farmer..and the yolks are really beautiful color..i was kind of worried about them getting clogged crops , we always keep piles of sand gravel around and so far hasnt been a problem..but it would probably be better on them if i crumble it up like a jar of basil. some of that hay was stalky. there was an article published recently about using alfalfa for poultry.

When I had my farm in Ga. years ago, I used to buy irrigation grown alfalfa from New Mexico. This hay had no stems bigger than a toothpick,you could barely shake the leaf off the stems, and was the most beautiful, sweet smelling, green stuff.My picky Nubians would eat anything that they pulled out of the hay feeders, but would not eat the leaves and small stem ends on the shelf. My birds got the leaf, and the horses and cows got the stems. I was feeding for very high milk production in the goats, and for show condition. I had the first 2 GCH Nubians in Ga. To make a long story short, I used to take the whole herd out for walks in the woods. They would eat the darndest stuff. One day I decided to take a handful of everything they ate, and send it off to the state feed lab for comparisom to the very expensive feed that I was trucking in.Guess what...the" junk "weeds that the goats were eating were much higher in TDN and minerals than my feed!

The green stuff with the little white flowers is "Chick Weed". It creeps along the ground in the spring in all my flower beds, and is lots of trouble to eradicate. I take the chicklets out for a picnic! I also like to keep 2 tubs of green stuff growing with 3 inches of space between the roots and the hardware mesh top. The birds shear it off in Jan. Feb. and early March before there is much new growth outside...about the time that horses start to chew bark.They know what they need.

 

[catdaddyfro]

Sorry for the confusion Walt, but I was responding to "Catdaddy" (Jeff) regarding his German bloodline of New Hampshires. He has a great cockerel with short shanks. Bob's bird is knock kneed.

Maybe for Bob's hen, I would make super sure that the male I use her with is nice and wide and that he came from a hen (and the entire family line) who was nice and wide too and who also had great laying/abdominal capacity! Several people have told me that the male will pass his traits to his daughters and that the female will pass to the sons so if I use a female with a fault or disqualification, to just cull all of her sons. I haven't seen this to be an absolute rule. They seem to me to be just about equal. I have a nice large rooster with great abdominal capacity (rare in an Andalusian - in mine anyway) who when he was very young had one point on his comb that was a split point... at least it looked like one to me. I kept him because of his depth and as he matured, the split point deepened and at adulthood, looks almost like two normal points. You'd have to know it was there to notice it at all. Anyway, mating him to a female who's family had no such point issues to try and keep it from passing on, gave me some very nice chicks. The oldest male of the chicks, and the only one of them all, has a split point, like his daddy did. So, it isn't black and white as to who passes to whom.

The male passing to the female offspring and vice versa quote: this only works on sex-linkable trait/genes, all things else are or should be evenly distributed 50/50 is my take on that.
Thanks for your response too, we'll see what others have to say on it too, but I will have evidence as of next spring because I'm gonna use him he's too good(color wise) not to try. LOL

Jeff

 

[aveca]

I have shown at Phoenix AZ and Eureka CA on the same weekend with the exact same entry of 50 birds in each place, if that gives you an idea that we might be into showing. That was a while back, but if you have an APA yearbook you can check the show record under Jones and Leonard. We show a lot.

I have 500+ birds on the ground here now and have had as many as 1500 here. I'm kind of into showing.

Walt

I had absolutly no idea you had that many..In my mind I thought you were taking it a little easy..with all of the traveling and all to judge..love to see some of these marvelous birds..your too modest..let us go ooooo, ahhhhh over them.tour de Walts and wear the red hat..

Lord look at us Walt ., we throw our faults around like nothing..from wrong colors to this and that flaw, plymoth rock masqurading as white orps and i had blk orp hens with spurs, we let it all hang out in here..

we need to see the top show birdys so we can see what were shooting for..most of us are smart enough to not assume too much Mine arnt going to compare to yours... Im so into showing too..and I dont care what happens It only ramps me up to do better, and more and more..I dont have any illusions either, i know exactly what I have and it has changed little by little over the years, .like the spurred blk hens I had long time ago..very coarse birds..correct but coarse...used them to extent.because there were some really good things in there. but freedome from coarseness means just that..they went long time ago.. i know that I need some advise on this and that..got an earful about things from a show person about a week ago, dont do this, dont do that, do this..it was very interesting and I listened to this old timer whos been around the block more than a few times..took it in like a sponge...he was talking about my aussies, he said dont be messing around with these color aussies. get out, stay out, you'll never beat a really good black with those color birds, one off feather throw you out..love that guy..and it costs as much to feed a good bird as it does to feed a bad one ect.. ect..have to say these blk orps stopped him in his tracks..he said no way around it, they are good birds...he checked them out for a long time.. we need more of these old timers out there like him....loose the ego and help the kids and newbies..or some of these will be extinct..

insecurity causes people to assume they have better than they do..i dont have any insecurities, just brutal realistic pictures of where I am and where Im going..insecure people need to hash it over all the time..i try it, if it works , keep that info..if it doesnt, toss it..

By the way , You like the orp hock showing so I did a this hocks for you pic somewhere in here..sometimes I say things leads you to assume I dont have that sort of thong going on, but I do..told ya I listen..

here it is