Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Lacy Blues]

I'm sorry Lacy Blues, I think I missed the slamming or I've just learned to look past harsh words.

Blue is a darned hard color. I don't care who says it isn't. A good Andalusian is something to behold. Perhaps not a Langshan, but still gorgeous. Everyone has to start somewhere. Some would prefer to start at a hatchery, others want to begin where someone else left off. You have your own breeding design and shouldn't feel as though you are being attacked for your own breeding practices. It may have been easier (and cheaper) to begin with a program that was already established, but when you reach or are close to reaching your goal, you will feel as though you have beaten the world.

Keep up the faith. 8 years is more than many people stick with it. Time flies faster than you think and soon you'll have been doing it for 20 years, then 40 like the "old-timers."

Blue IS a hard color. You have a young Langshan don't you that is blue that you have posted? I think he is REALLY REALLY nice!

I started with birds from Sandhill Preservation because I was advised that they probably had the best of the rare breeds available. This person didn't know who had Andalusians at the time because you just don't see them in the Poultry Press. Out of the 8 birds I received, there was ONE that had a WOW factor about her. She died right about the time she was due to start laying. I think she was eggbound, though I never suspected that such a thing could happen. I was definitely a beginner back then. But, 5 years ago I hatched several really nice girls that I took to the fall Ventura, CA show. I actually got Best Mediterranean, beating a well known judge who showed black Minorcas. THAT was really exciting! Of course, at the next show, in Bakersfield, he beat me. Same birds on both sides.

Anyway... a year or two after that, I showed at the spring show in Bakersfield. I won not only Best Mediterranean but BEST LARGE FOWL! In the fall show that same year, I won reserve large fowl. Of course, a famous breeder of Australorps on the west coast, beat me for large fowl. No shame in losing to him!

My point, I guess, is I've done my best and I've improved my birds from what I got from Sandhill. So, it's working.

Thank you for your encouragement.

Oops, not your blue cockerel. Someone else's. I'd like to see how that one grows out, so I'll be watching him.

 

[NYREDS]

Ok, I got back on here because I am somewhat ashamed of myself for flying off the handle like that. I'm sorry Bob.

Sometimes you speak in such generalities it's hard to discern who you're talking to/about.

Blue rocks? I'm sorry but that's almost as bad as a blue leghorn. Yellow legs, beak and skin on a blue bird? Why they were accepted in the first place is beyond me... maybe just covering all the bases? It would have been nice if they had included black and splash andalusians in recognized varieties. I'm of the opinion that many people DON'T raise them because you need these other two varieties to get the right shade of blue but you can't show them. Well, you CAN show them but they'll never get better than best variety. So, why would I stress my bird for that?

I do show my birds when finances allow. I feel like such a fool when I go to a show, cuz I'm smiling like there is no tomorrow and I can't help it. I really like the shows.

Write down the secret? Oh my! I wish I could get John Hayes to write it down. He's had them for like 40 years and getting information from him has been difficult to say the least. I wish I could take a trip to New York and visit with him for about a week, and take a tape recorder. My memory leaves a lot to be desired. I've searched high and low for information on breeding the Andalusian and there isn't much out there. So, I just keep trying... trial and error.

Again, I'm sorry. I know I can get a little snippy at times but everyone, please know this is not my intent.

Funny, I haven't found getting information from John difficult at all. We've had many discussions about breeding in general [when he was an active "Stringman" he bred 100 different breeds/varieties] & Andalusians in specific. We've traded birds back & forth for years now. I regreatably sold all my Andalusians to Superior several years ago but recently got some back from John. I think I'll try to keep them for awhile at least. They are a beautiful breed when well bred & have gotten very rare. There are a couple of young people in this area that have gotten birds from John & hopefully they'll stick with it. Never know, it becomes a lifelong activity for some people but for most it get left for other interests.
BTW he's actually bred Andalusians for over 50 years, those & Partridge Wyandotte Bantams.

 

[Lacy Blues]

Funny, I haven't found getting information from John difficult at all. We've had many discussions about breeding in general [when he was an active "Stringman" he bred 100 different breeds/varieties] & Andalusians in specific. We've traded birds back & forth for years now. I regreatably sold all my Andalusians to Superior several years ago but recently got some back from John. I think I'll try to keep them for awhile at least. They are a beautiful breed when well bred & have gotten very rare. There are a couple of young people in this area that have gotten birds from John & hopefully they'll stick with it. Never know, it becomes a lifelong activity for some people but for most it get left for other interests.
BTW he's actually bred Andalusians for over 50 years, those & Partridge Wyandotte Bantams.

I don't mean to make it sound like he was unwilling to help me. Maybe he does better in person than on the phone or in letters. If you've known him for years, maybe he's more comfortable with you than some nobody who called him out of the blue one day? I know some people like that - myself included. I think that first phone call, he had just gotten up from a nap, if I remember correctly. I'm pretty sure he would probably share all of his knowledge with me if I could just get there and have several days to be around him. I think I talked to him on the phone either once or twice and we exchanged a few letters too. We're on opposite sides of the country so long distance was a little pricey.

Maybe one of these days I can try contacting him again. I'll have to dig out his letters and my booklet with his phone number so I can find his contact info. Do you know if John has email?

 

[Narragansett]

Cornish breeders do not usually sell hatching eggs. I would do some extra checking on anyone saying they have good Cornish and are selling hatching eggs. Cornish are not what I would consider a beginners breed and Cornish eggs don't hatch all that well even when they are not shipped.

Cornish Breeders want to look at their birds as they mature so that they keep the ones they need to use in breeding next season, so they are not going to sell eggs. They are going to hatch them themselves. Most if not all of the Cornish eggs you will find for sale online are not going to be as good as a hatchery bird. The breed is difficult, so the true breeders need to hatch everything they get. They will sell started birds though.

Walt

This could be generalized to include almost all serious, knowledgeable exhibition breeders of any breed. Rarely an experienced breeder will try some eggs or chicks from another, for new blood, to try a new variety or for several other reasons, but they know going into it how few and far between a good show or breeder bird is, even from top stock. There are a few exceptions, mostly in whites of several popular breeds, or a few other lines which have been bred well for decades, showing a lot of consistency, but by and large it takes dozens if not hundreds of chicks to choose a few good show and breeder birds. It's just amazing at how many people can't understand this simple concept, who expect to begin a good exhibition line with a dozen or two shipped eggs. It is practically impossible. I don't get how people don't understand that they can save themselves decades of work by simply starting out with mature breeding stock, the quality of which is evident. Often it it simply a matter of being unrealistic. They want the cheap way out, hoping to begin by spending a few dollars instead of a few hundred. If they'd bother to calculate out the costs of raising all of the birds that they need to from their eggs or chicks, over the years needed to develop a good line from them, they'd still be ahead financially with buying the best breeding stock that they could find. Like everything today, people want the cheap, easy way out, but that's always unrealistic.

 

[fowlman01]

This could be generalized to include almost all serious, knowledgeable exhibition breeders of any breed. Rarely an experienced breeder will try some eggs or chicks from another, for new blood, to try a new variety or for several other reasons, but they know going into it how few and far between a good show or breeder bird is, even from top stock. There are a few exceptions, mostly in whites of several popular breeds, or a few other lines which have been bred well for decades, showing a lot of consistency, but by and large it takes dozens if not hundreds of chicks to choose a few good show and breeder birds. It's just amazing at how many people can't understand this simple concept, who expect to begin a good exhibition line with a dozen or two shipped eggs. It is practically impossible. I don't get how people don't understand that they can save themselves decades of work by simply starting out with mature breeding stock, the quality of which is evident. Often it it simply a matter of being unrealistic. They want the cheap way out, hoping to begin by spending a few dollars instead of a few hundred. If they'd bother to calculate out the costs of raising all of the birds that they need to from their eggs or chicks, over the years needed to develop a good line from them, they'd still be ahead financially with buying the best breeding stock that they could find. Like everything today, people want the cheap, easy way out, but that's always unrealistic.

Exactly. Even if you pay what you think is a lot of money for mature birds, you will be far better off than taking your chances with eggs. It is much cheaper in the long run to buy started birds.

Walt

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

Eggs can be a "cheap" and easy way to get new stock. However, the USPS can be very rough on eggs. I have received boxes of scrambled eggs. With eggs, you can not tell if its a cull or a show winner. At least with buying started stock or mature birds, you can see the bird.

Some breeders have stated if you sell eggs you just sold your best birds. I agree. look at Vickie's Buff Orpington pullets she hatched from my flock. But if we hang on to our stock and only sell a few birds at fall shows, how do these newbies get any good quality birds? Most are not going to pay $100 plus for a bird. Of course, when all is added up, they may be paying $200 plus for each bird hatched from shipped eggs.

To be honest, some of us are selling hatching eggs to help pay the feed bill. If Publishers Clearing House came today, would I still sell hatching eggs tomorrow? Can't say. I know I have quality birds. I am just building on someone else's hard work. It does make me feel good to know I have helped someone else get started in this Fancy.

We must help the newbies understand what the Fancy is.

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

What is the Fancy?

Welcome to the World of Fancy Poultry

An Exciting Live Hobby

http://www.amerpoultryassn.com/poultryfancy.htm

​

If you like beautiful, responsive, living things , then the world of FANCY POULTRY may be what you have been looking for. The many sizes, shapes, colors and personalities represented in the nearly 400 breeds and varieties of ornamental poultry offers something for almost everybody.

The term poultry includes chickens and miniature counterparts, the bantams, as well as ducks, geese and turkeys. These domestic fowl are an important part of the world's commerce and industry and form a considerable portion of the diet for many of the world's people. They also exist in so many diverse forms and colors that they catch the vocational interest of an increasing number of persons. This latter interest has been served for over one hundred years by the American Poultry Association. The appreciation of excellence and the systematic classification of the many breeds and varieties of poultry are highlights of the association's program. The gaining of greater appreciation for and the enjoyment from keeping and exhibiting of fancy poultry is a worthwhile social goal.

If you are attracted to graceful forms and exquisite colors in lively, moving packages, investigate the world of fancy poultry. The best way to understand this intriguing hobby is to visit some of the more than 1000 shows held annually across the United States and Canada. See the birds, meet the people and follow up with visits to their places. You'll see some attractive birds and see some interesting equipment. You can build and enjoy the company of fascinating people. From these people you'll get valuable ideas and suggestions of where to go to see and learn more.

Membership in the American Poultry Association is a way to keep abreast of what's happening. Later, after you have settled on a breed, you may want to join the club promoting that particular breed. Through newsletters and meetings these organizations add uniformity and cohesion as well as general information you can use in the day-to-day pursuit of your hobby. You'll also learn of shows, swap meets
and other events you'll want to attend. All of these activities encourage total family participation and many design features especially for the younger members of the family.

For some people owning and reproducing some of these elegant creatures is enough reward. But for others the showroom is the focal point--the true measure of the hobby's rewards. The thrill of a win and the recognition of the effort by friends is a gratifying experience. It recalls all of the events from mating of the parents, the setting of the egg and the new baby chick. You watch it grow. Each day is a new experience. Finally the competition of the showroom, whether it is a "youngster" in the 4-H competition or an "oldster" in retirement (and all those in-between), raising ornamental poultry is a relaxing hobby that is within the economic limits of most of us. It offers the challenge of improving a breed, the companionship of living things and the pride of ownership that can be matched by few other things.

The APA stands ready to make your experience with the fancy an enjoyable one!​

 

[flitter]

Exactly. Even if you pay what you think is a lot of money for mature birds, you will be far better off than taking your chances with eggs. It is much cheaper in the long run to buy started birds.

Walt

Agreed! But... Sometimes it is awfully difficult to locate good breeders that want to sell good stock. And... good breeders often don't want to let good stock go to a beginner or an unknown? As my MIL would say "I don't mean that meanfully".

 

[gjensen]

I always notice the remarks on the purchase price of birds. The cost of getting started. When it is all said and done, the cheapest part of keeping them is buying them. If you can't afford to spend a few dollars on some good birds, you can't afford keeping them.
After figuring the cost of their housing, feed, equipment, fencing, misc. etc., the purchase price of the original birds is put in perspective. Even if you paid a pretty good some initially. This is the same for all animals.

 

[catdaddyfro]

I always notice the remarks on the purchase price of birds. The cost of getting started. When it is all said and done, the cheapest part of keeping them is buying them. If you can't afford to spend a few dollars on some good birds, you can't afford keeping them.
After figuring the cost of their housing, feed, equipment, fencing, misc. etc., the purchase price of the original birds is put in perspective. Even if you paid a pretty good some initially. This is the same for all animals.

^
Truer words haven't been spoken here yet!


I guarontee you if you buy all this stuff needed to get into the business or even if you already have most of it and set up already, then you have to figure in the long term effects, the big picture (TIME). Yeah, a pair or trio of breeders for say $100-200 bucks is "chicken feed"< and this old adage is getting harder to use for this situation anymore nowadays, LOL

Jeff