BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[gjensen]

I do agree fundamentally. Though Lately it would be up for debate. We didn't know we needed an Iphone until it was released. I don't think that we knew we needed a cornish cross until we had it. Reading the history of chickens, lots of people were trying to create a better chicken. But it seemed that the chickens were just fine for most people.

Many texts point to heritage birds being king, and dieing out or being severely neglected after the cornish cross. Big time super markets cam about at the same time, and they needed meat for the store. The demographics and culture changed big time around WW2 in all aspects.

It is called progress. Or what we call progress.

People were moving to the city at an alarming rate. Industrialization was in full swing. Mechanization of agriculture to feed the people in the city was at a fever pitch. Supermarkets were only an improved way to market, promote, and offer the commodities to an ever selective (and demanding) public.

With the mechanization of grain production, and a large percentage of the population that did not raise their own food, chicken became a more and more lucrative market. Because of their growth rate, and the scale they could be reproduced, an emphasis on the production of poultry grew.

Quickly the old breeds were left behind for the more modern breeds, because economically they made more sense. The concerns were practical. They did not have the luxury of a love affair with nostalgia like we do today. These were not emotional decisions. The city folk did not care what breed produced those eggs or carcass. It was about a product, cost, and profit.

The breed that you have is a very commercial breed. It was in it's time, and usurped the competitors that came before it. For a time if it was not a NH, it was crossed with it. It was a quickly changing and evolving time. The breed came on fast, took over fast, and were left behind just as fast.

We do better to understand this time period concerning our hobby when we leave our emotions out of it. We tend to want to insert more than what was there. The majority of people then only cared about product and profit. If it was better, it was. If it was not, then it was not. The people then embraced progress. Progress put food on the table. Literally. Only today with our bellies full are we as inclined to get emotional about our food.

I am a bit nostalgic myself. I am not enthralled by this progress either. It does not care whether or not I am though. It will continue, and at some point there will be a correction. There is always a correction. The best that I can do is carve my little humble existence out as I am, until I am not.

 

[hellbender]

It is called progress. Or what we call progress.

People were moving to the city at an alarming rate. Industrialization was in full swing. Mechanization of agriculture to feed the people in the city was at a fever pitch. Supermarkets were only an improved way to market, promote, and offer the commodities to an ever selective (and demanding) public.

With the mechanization of grain production, and a large percentage of the population that did not raise their own food, chicken became a more and more lucrative market. Because of their growth rate, and the scale they could be reproduced, an emphasis on the production of poultry grew.

Quickly the old breeds were left behind for the more modern breeds, because economically they made more sense. The concerns were practical. They did not have the luxury of a love affair with nostalgia like we do today. These were not emotional decisions. The city folk did not care what breed produced those eggs or carcass. It was about a product, cost, and profit.

The breed that you have is a very commercial breed. It was in it's time, and usurped the competitors that came before it. For a time if it was not a NH, it was crossed with it. It was a quickly changing and evolving time. The breed came on fast, took over fast, and were left behind just as fast.

We do better to understand this time period concerning our hobby when we leave our emotions out of it. We tend to want to insert more than what was there. The majority of people then only cared about product and profit. If it was better, it was. If it was not, then it was not. The people then embraced progress. Progress put food on the table. Literally. Only today with our bellies full are we as inclined to get emotional about our food.

I am a bit nostalgic myself. I am not enthralled by this progress either. It does not care whether or not I am though. It will continue, and at some point there will be a correction. There is always a correction. The best that I can do is carve my little humble existence out as I am, until I am not.

I totally agree with each and every point....but If I ever took more than a cursory glance at the bills associated with this HOBBY, I might palm a box of CCI's and take a stroll amongst the flocks.

Just kidding. I get a great deal of pleasure from these birds and that pales to what I receive when I watch my family enjoying themselves.

Right now, they feel certain they are going to make a profit (at some point) from the capon project. If I had to depend upon that 'profit', I would have very little joy and Id be tightening the purse strings in a most dramatic way.

 

[JRNash]

Hellbender,I have to agree. For me its mentally therapeutic

 

[gjensen]

I totally agree with each and every point....but If I ever took more than a cursory glance at the bills associated with this HOBBY, I might palm a box of CCI's and take a stroll amongst the flocks.

Just kidding. I get a great deal of pleasure from these birds and that pales to what I receive when I watch my family enjoying themselves.

Right now, they feel certain they are going to make a profit (at some point) from the capon project. If I had to depend upon that 'profit', I would have very little joy and Id be tightening the purse strings in a most dramatic way.

I agree. I am not interested in the commercial meat strains etc. You know that I am a defender of the pure breeds. To a fault. I only try to separate myself from my view of the big picture. My wishes, wants, and emotions tend to cloud my view. I want it to be one way, and reality is another.

None of this is to say that they do not have a role today. They can, but we will have to carve a place out for them, and mold them in a way that they can fit into that "model". It is as much about changing our methods and mindset as it is about changing them. Both are important.

 

[Our Roost]

The grocery store chicken well known as the Cornish x has a very declining history of late. The FDA is really questioning what we as consumers are eating and this birds longevity is in serious trouble. It is undoubtedly the worlds largest marketed bird for human consumption. The true problem being that they have nothing to replace it currently. A lot of pressure is being placed on producers to find resolve but I have read nothing more at this point in time.
To me, the race is on in my own backyard to feed my family with something better than what the grocery store is serving up. Whether you so choose a Dorking or another breed makes no difference. Its all time consuming and if you enjoy the hobby and pleasure in it, that's all that matters. I am currently working with and own some Belgian Malines. Although they are slow to mature, they supply a more than ample amount of tasty meat. Not great egg layers either but better than large in size. Much like the Dorking more productive Cornish hens took over the supply and demand market.
Some one out there with a creative mind will eventually hit a home run and a new meat and egg breed will evolve. You can bet on it! Stay thirsty my friends.

 

[hellbender]

I agree. I am not interested in the commercial meat strains etc. You know that I am a defender of the pure breeds. To a fault. I only try to separate myself from my view of the big picture. My wishes, wants, and emotions tend to cloud my view. I want it to be one way, and reality is another.

None of this is to say that they do not have a role today. They can, but we will have to carve a place out for them, and mold them in a way that they can fit into that "model". It is as much about changing our methods and mindset as it is about changing them. Both are important.

Of course you know we cross-breed to make what we think are better birds for our purposes but we also maintain healthy flocks of purebred birds, without which the projects would soon peter out.

 

[DesertChic]

This has probably been addressed in this thread but I'm not going to read the whole thing to find it....so forgive my laziness.

Experience with - and opinion of - Dorkings. Like/don't like? Good for meat or not? Eggs?

The Dorkings, specifically the Silver Grey Dorkings, were the first breed I feel in love with and desperately wanted, but I couldn't find any quality birds for sale anywhere...so I switched to other breeds. Then I found hatching eggs for sale and thought I'd finally lucked out. I was wrong. The first batch of hatching eggs turned to be mixed Dorkings....not a single "pure" Silver Grey, Colored, or Red in the group, but an amalgamation of them all. Instead of the sweet, friendly personalities I've read so much about these birds turned out to be horribly flighty with tendencies toward panic and feather picking. They're 8 weeks old now and a few of them have become friendlier and more docile, but they're the hardest chickens for me to work with of all the breeds I've had experience with....and there are a lot of defects that need to be worked on well before I even address feather colors. That said, they're growing out to be nice, meaty birds and I'm looking forward to tasting my first one...a particularly annoying little cockerel I named Bam Bam. I may cross a few of them with my NN Turkens for the sake of creating my own meat bird and keep one cockerel and a female or two to breed...but right now I know that I'll need to wait until next year to seek out some better quality birds to start working with. I reluctantly had to pass up an opportunity this year to possibly acquire some hatching eggs from a breeder in CA, but work and health issues prevented me from making the long commute there and back to obtain them.

The second batch of Dorking eggs I purchased from someone listing here on the BYC turned out to be a real disaster. The eggs were packaged so poorly that 1/4 of them had broken and oozed out over the rest, several were stuck directly to packing tape they were wrapped in....and the only one that made it all the way to hatch most definitely is NOT a Dorking despite having five toes. It's a lovely bird with the most adorable little crest...very sweet...but I've no idea what kind of bird it is.

So....my suggestion if you want to work with the Dorking...something I'm still determined to do in the future...is to be patient and diligent in finding as good quality birds as you can from breeders. If by chance you live close enough to one to see the birds before buying I would strongly recommend it.

Just for grins, here's a photo of my sole not-Dorking chick. It's cute, but that's about it. I named it "Q" for "question" since that's what it left me with. It's only 2 weeks old in this photo and the head tuft isn't as prominent in the photo as it is now, but you can still make out the start of it.

 

[JRNash]

Our Roost, Malines are most assuredly on my to do list.

 

[hellbender]

The Dorkings, specifically the Silver Grey Dorkings, were the first breed I feel in love with and desperately wanted, but I couldn't find any quality birds for sale anywhere...so I switched to other breeds. Then I found hatching eggs for sale and thought I'd finally lucked out. I was wrong. The first batch of hatching eggs turned to be mixed Dorkings....not a single "pure" Silver Grey, Colored, or Red in the group, but an amalgamation of them all. Instead of the sweet, friendly personalities I've read so much about these birds turned out to be horribly flighty with tendencies toward panic and feather picking. They're 8 weeks old now and a few of them have become friendlier and more docile, but they're the hardest chickens for me to work with of all the breeds I've had experience with....and there are a lot of defects that need to be worked on well before I even address feather colors. That said, they're growing out to be nice, meaty birds and I'm looking forward to tasting my first one...a particularly annoying little cockerel I named Bam Bam. I may cross a few of them with my NN Turkens for the sake of creating my own meat bird and keep one cockerel and a female or two to breed...but right now I know that I'll need to wait until next year to seek out some better quality birds to start working with. I reluctantly had to pass up an opportunity this year to possibly acquire some hatching eggs from a breeder in CA, but work and health issues prevented me from making the long commute there and back to obtain them.

The second batch of Dorking eggs I purchased from someone listing here on the BYC turned out to be a real disaster. The eggs were packaged so poorly that 1/4 of them had broken and oozed out over the rest, several were stuck directly to packing tape they were wrapped in....and the only one that made it all the way to hatch most definitely is NOT a Dorking despite having five toes. It's a lovely bird with the most adorable little crest...very sweet...but I've no idea what kind of bird it is.

So....my suggestion if you want to work with the Dorking...something I'm still determined to do in the future...is to be patient and diligent in finding as good quality birds as you can from breeders. If by chance you live close enough to one to see the birds before buying I would strongly recommend it.

Just for grins, here's a photo of my sole not-Dorking chick. It's cute, but that's about it. I named it "Q" for "question" since that's what it left me with. It's only 2 weeks old in this photo and the head tuft isn't as prominent in the photo as it is now, but you can still make out the start of it.

When you are ready for QUALITY Dorkings...here's the place to get them...Contact Joe.

http://www.yellowhousefarmnh.com/white-dorkings-chickens

 

[JRNash]

I looked at the site Hellbender recommended. This year is the last one they will be handling their white dorkings.