BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[ronott1]

Hi,
I was discussing with another lister recently. And found this article to share during the discussion:
http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1516-635x2010000300001
"Meeting embryonic requirements of broilers throughout incubation : a review"
This is a fabulous review of all the topics I have been studying these past months. I couldn't have said it any better myself. The title topic is a many faceted gem . Figuring out the proper proportions and how they go together will be such a boon to the broiler industry. And the layer industry too.
The most important parts of the article are the sections on :
Abstract
Incubation CO2 Concentration
New Insights Into the Incubation Process
Conclusions
Karen

Thanks Karen!

It is a good article--and they stressed temperature as the most important factor. Adequate turning, temperature plus or minus .5F from 99.5 and humidity in the 25 to 50% range with fertile eggs will get a hatch rate over 80%. Other things like the CO2, cooling cycle and misting will eek out a couple of percentage points above what the top three things will do.

Most people that hatch on a small scale cannot keep the temps, humidity and turning up let alone work on injecting CO2. That would be for large scale hatcheries.

My advice is to work on the basics and get them optimized and then go for the last couple of percentages in hatch rates.

 

[3riverschick]

Hello,

I am new to this site. I am also new to chickens and how any of it works. If this is posted in the wrong place I apologize. I was not sure where to start. This thread was what caught my eye as I have been reading and reading trying to find information and people with the same mindset....production birds for eggs and meat. I have 5 copper merganzers (sorry if I spelled it wrong) who are now 3 months old. I have no idea if hens or cocks. I do have one that crows or is trying to crow. I have a question for you guys. What I am trying to do is find the best breed or breeds of chickens to cross. What my plan is is to have 6 hens and 2 roosters. I want a fast growing breed that will produce a lot of eggs. Any info would be great. My greatest frusteration is that there are a lot of breeds. There is a lot of information but hardly any information on how many weeks before we can butcher. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks guys.

Rhode Island Red cock over a Light Sussex hen, is a classic cross for eggs and meat.
Best,
Karen

 

[3riverschick]

So I'm interested in trying out silver grey dorking, and perhaps crossing them with the american bresse I currently have. My goal being a duel purpose, very flavorful, realitivly fast growing bird. Does anyone have any insight into where to find good quality dorking stock?
I know others have tried this cross before and rave about the meat, but I was also wondering if anyone has ever kept the hens around as layers and if so what was their production like?

Why? Both breeds are rare and need conservators. Why not just pick one or the other and make it even better? Why do folk always want to cross breeds? A Dorking is a slow growing breed. The Bresse pullets are processed at 4 months, the hens at 5 months, and the capons at 8 months. Doesn't sound like you will be creating a fast growing breed from them soon.
Sigh,
Rant,
Karen

 

[3riverschick]

I regret posting my research here. It was a mistake. This list is the equivalent of a BARF feeding forum in the dog world. And I am advocating regular dry commercial feed with supplements. I am going to take it and move it somewhere else where it can be appreciated and viewed on its own merits without the distractions of wet feeders. I know we all have our own choices to feed as we wish. And that's fine. I just wish to have a less distracting forum in which to present it.
Best,
Karen

 

[Fluffyserama]

[COLOR=0000CD]W[/COLOR][COLOR=006400]h[/COLOR][COLOR=EE82EE]y[/COLOR][COLOR=FF0000]?[/COLOR] Both breeds are rare and need conservators. Why not just pick one or the other and make it even better? Why do folk always want to cross breeds? A Dorking is a slow growing breed. The Bresse pullets are processed at 4 months, the hens at 5 months, and the capons at 8 months. Doesn't sound like you will be creating a fast growing breed from them soon.
 Sigh,
 Rant,
 Karen

Big *sigh*
I'm just a back yard hobiest. I don't have many individuals in my flock and I don't ever plan to sell chicks or eggs. I doubt the birds I hatch will ever impact their breeds as a whole, but 'IF' I ever did things on a larger scale I would would want to have pure pens. Right now all I'm shooting for is a great tasting bird for home consumption. The cross I'm thinking of seems to create something that can take the best out of both. I don't know if the cross will happen in my coop, just researching at the moment.

Yes the time to processing for these breeds is longer than for a lot of production meat birds, but all things are relative. For a super flavorful, tender, duel purpose bird 4 months to processing age sounds good to me.

I like lurking in this forum and learning, But my goals are different than yours.

I also feed fermented grain

 

[3riverschick]

Well Rhode Island Red over Light Sussex hen is still a great classic for what you want. Or you could try Dorking over Sussex hen. The Sussex rose from the Dorking but is faster growing and (do believe lays more eggs?) That way you would be linebreeding on the Dorkings base. Plus adding in faster growing and more eggs.
The Bresse needs to raised for meat a special way You could try Bresse/Sussex hen cross. That could prove interesting.
Or, here's a thought. Both are French breeds and renowned for their meat. How about a Wheaten Marans and Bresse cross? Stay away from the blue gene. It just makes too many color variables when you are trying to breed for type. Note how many breeders who wanted utility birds chose simple colors. Is the Bresse a silver or a white bird and which allele is it based on? Hopefully it is eWh based. That would jive well with a Wheaten Marans. You would have pretty brown and white birds Nice dark tan eggs, the Marans is faster growing and excellent meat birds.. And I think the Marans lay larger eggs than the Bresse. The best Marans for the purpose would be pure Little Peddler strain. Yes, they are Black Copper and...they are pure French and high quality.
Several people have them in a pure state, uncrossed with other strains od Marans.
So much to think on.
Best,
Karen

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

I love my red stars. They are great layers. I have heard black austrolopes are great for egg production and hope to add a few to my flock this coming spring.

You certainly can't beat the hybrids for egg laying ability. Australorps can be very good too! You'll have a pretty flock.

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

I regret posting my research here. It was a mistake. This list is the equivalent of a BARF feeding forum in the dog world. And I am advocating regular dry commercial feed with supplements. I am going to take it and move it somewhere else where it can be appreciated and viewed on its own merits without the distractions of wet feeders. I know we all have our own choices to feed as we wish. And that's fine. I just wish to have a less distracting forum in which to present it.
Best,
Karen

Please don't move it, just duplicate the information. It's useful to have good information on both feeding methods. That way everyone can make their own choice regarding which feeding method works best for them.

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

Big *sigh*
I'm just a back yard hobiest. I don't have many individuals in my flock and I don't ever plan to sell chicks or eggs. I doubt the birds I hatch will ever impact their breeds as a whole, but 'IF' I ever did things on a larger scale I would would want to have pure pens. Right now all I'm shooting for is a great tasting bird for home consumption. The cross I'm thinking of seems to create something that can take the best out of both. I don't know if the cross will happen in my coop, just researching at the moment.

Yes the time to processing for these breeds is longer than for a lot of production meat birds, but all things are relative. For a super flavorful, tender, duel purpose bird 4 months to processing age sounds good to me.

I like lurking in this forum and learning, But my goals are different than yours.

I also feed fermented grain

One thing to consider when making crosses,if you will be keeping the parent stock as breeding birds, you will need to maintain (in addition to the crossed chicks) at least 2 flocks of pure bred birds, (roosters, hens, chicks,growing birds) which will need careful selection to maintain them without inbreeding. That takes up a lot of time and resources and space, which is of course fine if that's part of your goal.


Another way to do this is source fresh breeding stock of your breeds from others. Doing the research, selecting parent stock to produce your own hybrid is fun! But it can easily get out of control, you know that chicken math......

 

[Beer can]

@Fluffyserama Delaware over New Hampshire is also a good cross, was a popular one before the cornishX came onto the scene, broiler farms bred thousands of them. Eight Acres Farm in Gainesville Florida has both and I hear very good representatives of the original breeds, big and fast growing.
Right now I prefer pure breeds with crosses as side projects, food. It would be great if you could afford both, pure lines to improve and crosses, I can't either.
I'm content with these naked necks at the moment, still not at point of lay, but the extra cockerels made fine carcasses.
I will be crossing some with cornishX (if the pullets live to POL) and see what hatches out in the spring.