Broken egg

[hotmessJess]

I took my girl to the emergency vet yesterday after finding her attacked by (possibly) a hawk. Her wounds weren't threatening, but I wanted her liked at to make sure there wasn't more injury I wasn't seeing.

After being treated poorly by a tech for suggesting birds don't respond to pain like people, and $398 worth of exam and one small suture, we were sent on or marry way with antibiotics and nsaids.

I just went to feed her and she was panting, I noticed egg yolk in her pen. I went to get her some food and a glove to check her, by the time I got back, she had collapsed.

She passed an egg and two gelatinous starter eggs last night from the stress. How did they miss this? Where did this egg come from? Did they miss her being egg bound? She wasn't behaving differently before the attack.

This is the 2nd time they've given a cappy exam to one of my birds with a bad diagnosis. (But they are my only option in an emergency)

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I took my girl to the emergency vet yesterday after finding her attacked by (possibly) a hawk. Her wounds weren't threatening, but I wanted her liked at to make sure there wasn't more injury I wasn't seeing.

After being treated poorly by a tech for suggesting birds don't respond to pain like people, and $398 worth of exam and one small suture, we were sent on or marry way with antibiotics and nsaids.

I just went to feed her and she was panting, I noticed egg yolk in her pen. I went to get her some food and a glove to check her, by the time I got back, she had collapsed.

She passed an egg and two gelatinous starter eggs last night from the stress. How did they miss this? Where did this egg come from? Did they miss her being egg bound? She wasn't behaving differently before the attack.

This is the 2nd time they've given a cappy exam to one of my birds with a bad diagnosis. (But they are my only option in an emergency)

I'm sorry you are having trouble.

Most likely the stress from being attacked caused her to expel the eggs.

If you haven't done so, separate her and place in her in a quiet, calm area, if you can partially darken it that may help as well.
Give her a soak in an epsom salt bath and provide her with some extra calcium (you can crush a tums and feed it to her).
After she has soak and is relaxed a bit, lubricate and check inside the vent (about an inch) to see if you feel any egg shell, etc. If you feel egg shell, then you will need to very gently try to remove that. (@TwoCrows article below explains the process)

If you have them offer poultry vitamins in the water or if you have Poultry Nutri-Drench you can direct dose her. Feed her normal feed, you can wet it or offer some egg, tuna or meat.

Hopefully she will lay a "normal" egg next go round. It's possible she may have dropped a few internally, meaning the egg traveled back up the oviduct and they dropped into the abdominal cavity. Sometimes the body will reabsorb the dropped egg matter, but it could cause infection. Time will tell. Your main objective right now is to get her calm and as comfortable as you can so she isn't so stressed and will hopefully pass her next egg o.k.

TwoCrows article:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/egg-binding-symptoms-treatment-and-prevention

More information on giving comfort:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/egg-binding-symptoms-treatment-and-prevention
http://www.fresheggsdaily.com/2012/06/egg-bound-hens-how-to-recognize-treat.html
http://www.the-chicken-chick.com/2012/07/chicken-egg-binding-causes-symptoms.html

 

[hotmessJess]

I should have been more clear. She had passed at the time of my post. She was expelling egg matter. The vet didn't think it was strange that she had passed TWO formed eggs and two ova, worth checking the cavity.

I just want to know, is it not important to check the vent when strange things happen like multiple eggs and ova?

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I should have been more clear. She had passed at the time of my post. She was expelling egg matter. The vet didn't think it was strange that she had passed TWO formed eggs and two ova, worth checking the cavity.

I just want to know, is it not important to check the vent when strange things happen like multiple eggs and ova?

Ok. I just want to make sure what you are saying(?) she has died?

 

[hotmessJess]

Yes. She died when she collapsed. She had egg matter coming out of her. I imagine that was what was causing her stress.

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[Wyorp Rock]

Yes. She died when she collapsed. She had egg matter coming out of her. I imagine that was what was causing her stress.

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I am so sorry Jess

I completely misunderstood. I'm sorry for your loss.

Yes, I would think that it would have been important for them to check her when that happened.
I hate to hear that you went through all that. I would suspect that she may have had some internal damage since she was releasing all the egg matter. The only way you would know for sure is by necropsy. It's unfortunate that you have had a bad experience with your vet. I'm sure there are many good ones who care and try to do the best they can, but from what I read, not many are experienced in the care of chickens, so they may have not even realized it was abnormal(?)

Again, I am so sorry.

 

[TwoCrows]

I am so sorry about your baby.

It is possible she was egg bound and the egg broke inside her and had some backed up eggs, stress can cause them to release egg yolks or possibly she was developing some issue with her laying gear and she kept releasing too many yolks.

Unfortunately, many vets are clueless about birds period. After they go through the vet schooling and are ready to move on to practicing, they are offered another year or two to learn about the Avians. Most of them are eager to get into practice and skip the bird knowledge. And while many attributes of most animals can be applied in some areas of birds, much of it can't. So in the long run, many of us need to learn things on our own since we don't have a vet we can turn to.

However this is probably not her first rodeo with a broken egg inside her or egg binding. A broken egg can cause internal infection, but would take many days to a week even to effect her. Some birds have laying issues to which we can't fix.

The first thing I do to ANY sick hen is do an egg check. It is easy to do and you can rule out egg binding or broken eggs between the Uterus and the vent. (this is where all egg binding and egg breaking occur) Put on a disposable latex or other such glove, a bit of vaseline or KY-Jelly on the index finger and gently go straight back into the vent. If an egg is traveling from the Uterus to the vent to be laid, the Cloaca will have closed off the intestines and you will be in the Oviduct. You will be able to fee an egg as far back as the Uterus, and for a standard breed sized hen, this is about 2 inches back. If the egg is at an inch, (and she is in distress) she is considered egg bound.

If the bird has become dehydrated from too much high heat or is being bullied away from the water or simply the flock has run out of water, the Oviduct dries out quick. An egg will stick and the bird becomes egg bound. If the bird continues to push and push, she will either break the egg or she will prolapse.( the Uterus and Oviduct come out the vent)

Anyway, as for your hen here, I have a feeling she has been having issues with her laying machine in the past and she may have died from systemic infection because of it, or even something completely different. She could have had something completely wrong with her in another department and happen to be laying at the time and it all fell apart. Unless you had a necropsy done on her at the time of her death, you can never be sure.

In a perfect world, vets are there for our poultry. But usually they are not. I try to learn as MUCH about my flock so I can treat them myself. Keep your birds wormed on a regular basis, on a good diet, clean clear water at all times, clean facilities and if someone turns up sick, I give them the run down, shake down if you will and try to determine what the issue might be. Bacterial infections, fungal infections, internal laying, reproductive cancers, worms and other parasites are common. We can treat most of these, others not.

Again, I am so sorry about your girl.

I hope your heavy heart heals soon.

 

[hotmessJess]

Thank you. They charged me as if they knew what they were doing. I took her in to RULE OUT any missed damage. But u am taking her to the diagnostics lab now. If nothing else, they will learn from her the importance of being thorough.

Their suture job cost an arm and a leg and my 12 year old has done better field sutures (you know how over zealous roos can hurt a hen...)

This is my exorbitant bill.

 

[TwoCrows]

Thank you. They charged me as if they knew what they were doing. I took her in to RULE OUT any missed damage. But u am taking her to the diagnostics lab now. If nothing else, they will learn from her the importance of being thorough.

Their suture job cost an arm and a leg and my 12 year old has done better field sutures (you know how over zealous roos can hurt a hen...)





This is my exorbitant bill.

The attack was probably too much for her, she went into shock and passed. However having so many eggs passed is suspicious in itself. I am guessing she had something else going on inside of her.

Yes, roosters can damage and kill hens with their spurs. I think a necropsy is the best thing right now so you know for sure exactly why she passed whether from a hawk attack, rooster damage or some sort of internal infection.

 

[hotmessJess]

I am so sorry about your baby.    It is possible she was egg bound and the egg broke inside her and had some backed up eggs, stress can cause them to release egg yolks or possibly she was developing some issue with her laying gear and she kept releasing too many yolks.

Unfortunately, many vets are clueless about birds period. After they go through the vet schooling and are ready to move on to practicing, they are offered another year or two to learn about the Avians. Most of them are eager to get into practice and skip the bird knowledge. And while many attributes of most animals can be applied in some areas of birds, much of it can't. So in the long run, many of us need to learn things on our own since we don't have a vet we can turn to. 

However this is probably not her first rodeo with a broken egg inside her or egg binding. A broken egg can cause internal infection, but would take many days to a week even to effect her. Some birds have laying issues to which we can't fix. 

The first thing I do to ANY sick hen is do an egg check. It is easy to do and you can rule out egg binding or broken eggs between the Uterus and the vent. (this is where all egg binding and egg breaking occur) Put on a disposable latex or other such glove, a bit of vaseline or KY-Jelly on the index finger and gently go straight back into the vent. If an egg is traveling from the Uterus to the vent to be laid, the Cloaca will have closed off the intestines and you will be in the Oviduct. You will be able to fee an egg as far back as the Uterus, and for a standard breed sized hen, this is about 2 inches back. If the egg is at an inch, (and she is in distress) she is considered egg bound.

If the bird has become dehydrated from too much high heat or is being bullied away from the water or simply the flock has run out of water, the Oviduct dries out quick. An egg will stick and the bird becomes egg bound. If the bird continues to push and push, she will either break the egg or she will prolapse.( the Uterus and Oviduct come out the vent)

Anyway, as for your hen here, I have a feeling she has been having issues with her laying machine in the past and she may have died from systemic infection because of it, or even something completely different. She could have had something completely wrong with her in another department and happen to be laying at the time and it all fell apart. Unless you had a necropsy done on her at the time of her death, you can never be sure. 

In a perfect world, vets are there for our poultry. But usually they are not. I try to learn as MUCH about my flock so I can treat them myself. Keep your birds wormed on a regular basis, on a good diet, clean clear water at all times, clean facilities and if someone turns up sick, I give them the run down, shake down if you will and try to determine what the issue might be. Bacterial infections, fungal infections, internal laying, reproductive cancers, worms and other parasites are common. We can treat most of these, others not. 

Again, I am so sorry about your girl.    I hope your heavy heart heals soon. 

I've never had an issue with her laying, yet. She would take a few days off in extreme temps, but she's otherwise been a machine since 24 weeks of age. She's never even layed so much as a shelless egg in heat. I think that's why I was so peeved that the vet didn't think her passing so many was an issue.

They also had her from 11 am to 8pm and didn't give her subcutaneous fluids. She was so thirsty when she got home.

I have a hard time accepting shock because she perked up last night, colour returned to most of her comb, and she was eating. She didn't die until almost 9 this morning after she started passing that egg matter.

Hopefully the necropsy will give answers.