Brooder Build Sanity Check

[JeffandLori]

I've had laying hens for about three years now. We've always bought them locally at about the 18 week mark. I'm now thinking to add meat birds and since I was ordering chicks, I ordered four more hens because....why not?

Right now I have a decent sized coop that will accommodate 12 fine, but have it surrounded by 164' of poultry netting so they have a very large, fenced run, half of which is under an oak tree.

This will be my first attempt at raising from chicks. I ordered 15 Rudd Rangers and 5 Jersey Giants. My questions revolve around brooder, etc. I'm in S. Fl and expect the night time temperatures to not fall below about 45 with most of the nights not below 55. The brooder will be on the back screened in patio until they are ready to be promoted to the yard. What I'm thinking for these 20 is:

• I have a ton of scrap 3/4" plywood. I was going to build the brooder 3'w x 6'l x 2'h. Solid sides and bottom. Frame out a top with 1/4" hardware cloth. Half fixed, half on hinges for access to food/water.
• I can put a heat lamp above it just fine and the hardware cloth will keep it from falling in. I can easily rig up something to control the height. I'm thinking to put a cheap thermometer inside.
• At some point- I'm guessing around 5-7 weeks? when they are feathered or won't fit in the brooder, the five get promoted to an old 4x8 tractor I have that will go inside the run. That will let the current hens get used to them for a couple of months.
  The 15 meat birds will go in a new tractor- likely 8x8x2 that I'll have to build and move around the yard twice a day. Free ranging birds do not do well in this neighborhood. Cars, hawks, coyotes.

Having never gone from chick to essentially full grown- will the above plan work or do I need an intermediate step between the brooder and the tractors? I have enough wood and space I could easily make the brooder 6x6 is that would make it easier, but even at that, I'm questioning poop output of 20 adolescent? chickens in a 36 sqft confined space.

So, questions would be:

• At what age can you safely put them in a tractor with no heat source in temperature swings from potentially 40-80?
• Can we go from brooder to tractor?

thx

 

[NatJ]

Ideal temp for the brooder is around 70 with area for them to be under the lamp or away from it if possible, correct?

Ideal temperature under the heat lamp is about 90 degrees (Fahrenheit) in the first days, possibly a little higher or lower than that. It might need to be as hot as 100F when the chicks first arrive after being shipped, depending on how chilled they are.

The warm area needs to be big enough for all the chicks to sleep comfortably at once. I would make this spot be near one corner of the brooder, not in the middle.

Ideal temperature for the rest of the brooder is as cool as possible, although it is convenient to have it stay above freezing (so their water doesn't freeze.)

The chicks will run back and forth, playing in the cool area and warming up or sleeping in the warm area. For the first days, put the feed and water close to the warm area. After you see the chicks spend plenty of time away from the heat, move the feeder and waterer a bit further away (maybe another foot or two away from the heat.)

Since you will be dealing with temperature swings, you should plan on having one area always warm enough, even in the coldest weather. That means it will sometimes be too hot, and the chicks will naturally move away at those times. And plan on having a large area that is always cool enough (ambient temperature). As the chicks grow, they will spend more and more time in the cool area, gradually getting themselves used to it.

Some people raise the heat lamp each week, to make the "warm" area cooler.
But raising it will make it heat a larger area (bigger puddle of warm light, but not as hot.) I prefer to leave it alone, because I don't want the "warm" area getting any bigger. As long as there is plenty of cool space, and the heat lamp is not starting an actual fire, "too hot" is not a big deal-- the chicks just move away until they find a comfortable spot.

 

[JeffandLori]

Better to not have it in corner as they tend to huddle, and some can get trapped in corner and can suffocate with that many chicks. Best to keep it in middle of one end just not right at end in a bit to give them room to scatter around and not huddle as much in one spot. Other than that, you have been given good info. Good luck.

Ah, fair point. 50% chance I'd have figured that out and ended up pointing it at the middle of one side, 50% chance I'd have it aimed straight at a corner. Thx.

I have three weekends to dig the lumber out, cut it and screw it together. Ultimately, it's just a five sided box. I'll probably spend more time trying to find sticks to screw together to make little "Jungle Gyms" for them.

 

[JeffandLori]

Thx for the suggestion about walling it off. Add "They could get lost in a box" to the list of things that would NEVER have occurred to me.

 

[rosemarythyme]

Thx for the suggestion about walling it off. Add "They could get lost in a box" to the list of things that would NEVER have occurred to me.

You will find you don't need it for long, hence using something that can easily be removed. Even very little chicks with mama hens can get lost sometimes.

By 2 weeks I expect my chicks to be able to find their way back to their brooder if given access to the whole chicken enclosure (525 sq ft), so their navigation ability progresses fast.

 

[Ridgerunner]

You might want to ask these questions in the meat bird section of this forum. Rangers and CX are different from other chicks. I have not raised Rangers myself but plenty of people over there have.

I've had laying hens for about three years now. We've always bought them locally at about the 18 week mark. I'm now thinking to add meat birds and since I was ordering chicks, I ordered four more hens because....why not?

Right now I have a decent sized coop that will accommodate 12 fine, but have it surrounded by 164' of poultry netting so they have a very large, fenced run, half of which is under an oak tree.

I have a ton of scrap 3/4" plywood. I was going to build the brooder 3'w x 6'l x 2'h. Solid sides and bottom. Frame out a top with 1/4" hardware cloth. Half fixed, half on hinges for access to food/water.

I've kept 28 chicks in a 3' x 5' brooder in my coop until they were 5 weeks old. But Rangers are not dual purpose chicks. They grow a lot faster so I'd also suggest the 6' x 6' brooder just on growth alone. To grow fast they need to eat a lot. If they eat a lot they will poop a lot. One of your issues will be poop management. A larger brooder might mean you can go longer between cleanouts but in your design think about how easy it will be to clean out. Will 2' high be high enough for easy cleanout?

• I can put a heat lamp above it just fine and the hardware cloth will keep it from falling in. I can easily rig up something to control the height. I'm thinking to put a cheap thermometer inside.

Falling in maybe but how about falling off, maybe the wind, maybe something knocks it. I use a heat lamp so I'm not against them but I'd want it really secured, preferably with wire or chain. My 3' x 6' brooder is 2' high. I wire the heat lamp inside the brooder at the top. And I have a solid top on that end. which will help hold heat in. On the far end I have ventilation up high so it can cool off. One end stays toasty warm in the coldest weather but the far end may have ice in it some mornings. But when the temperature swings and the warm end gets hot they move to the cooler end. Your temperatures are not expected to fall below freezing so you can put the water anywhere.

• At some point- I'm guessing around 5-7 weeks? when they are feathered or won't fit in the brooder, the five get promoted to an old 4x8 tractor I have that will go inside the run. That will let the current hens get used to them for a couple of months.
  The 15 meat birds will go in a new tractor- likely 8x8x2 that I'll have to build and move around the yard twice a day. Free ranging birds do not do well in this neighborhood. Cars, hawks, coyotes.

I've had 5-1/2 week old DP chicks go through nights in the mid 20's Fahrenheit with no supplemental heat. By keeping one end of your brooder warm and letting the far end cool of as it will your chicks will grow up acclimated to colder temperatures. The five JG's can probably go into the tractor by 5 weeks.

Now this is why I thought of you posting on the meat bird forum. There has been recent discussion on there about the Cornish X chicks being little ovens. They can be off of heat much earlier than dual purpose chicks. The Rangers don't grow that fast but it's still a lot faster than DP birds. There should be people over there that can help you get those Rangers out of the brooder and into the tractor earlier than you plan. If poop management is moving a tractor instead of shoveling or raking out a brooder, well I'd like that.

Having never gone from chick to essentially full grown- will the above plan work or do I need an intermediate step between the brooder and the tractors?

No intermediate steps needed.

I don't wall mine off to keep them near the heat, I find they are really good at managing the heat even straight from the incubator. My main concern with that wall idea is that they can jump really well. If you build a wall make sure they cannot get under, through or over it and block themselves from being able to get back to the heat when they need it.

 

[NatJ]

I ordered 15 Rudd Rangers and 5 Jersey Giants.

So that makes 20 chicks.

I was going to build the brooder 3'w x 6'l x 2'h...I have enough wood and space I could easily make the brooder 6x6 is that would make it easier, but even at that, I'm questioning poop output of 20 adolescent? chickens in a 36 sqft confined space.

I would definitely go 6x6 rather than 6x3.

A general rule of thumb says 2 square feet per chicken from 4 to 8 weeks of age, and 4 square feet per chicken after that (i.e. the same as for adult chickens.)

So, questions would be:

• At what age can you safely put them in a tractor with no heat source in temperature swings from potentially 40-80?

Probably somewhere between 4 and 8 weeks, depending on their feathering and the specific weather that week. The 80 degree days won't be a problem, and having an entire group to huddle together will let them tolerate slightly cooler conditions than they otherwise would. If you watch the weather forecast, you can probably move them out when their first night or two will be "warm" (relative to other nights around that time), so they adjust a little more before it gets colder again.

• Can we go from brooder to tractor?

do I need an intermediate step between the brooder and the tractors?

You probably do not need an intermediate step between brooder and tractor.

The brooder will be on the back screened in patio until they are ready to be promoted to the yard.

As the chicks grow, maybe sometime between week 2 and 4, you can start turning off the heat lamp during warm days, then turn it back on for nights and cooler days. As they get older and more used to cool temperatures, you can leave the heat lamp off all the time. After a few days or a week of living in the brooder with no heat lamp, they will probably be ready to move to the tractor, as long as you don't have a forecast of extra-cold weather again.

Depending on how you set up your tractor, you might cover one or two sides with solid material (like tarp or even cardboard) to block wind & drafts when you put the chicks out, then uncover them a week or two later. Of course you still need to leave enough uncovered sides for ventilation and light.

You don't have to move both groups out at the same time, either. Depending on which chicks feather at what speed, and how sheltered each tractor is, you might move one group out while leaving the other group in the brooder for another week or two.

 

[NatJ]

Very good to know not to worry about it being too hot.

That is specific to situations like yours: large brooder with plenty of cool space.

It's one reason a LARGE brooder is so much easier than a small one, even for small numbers of chicks. Chicks are quite good at moving to a comfortable temperature, as long as there is one available.

When people raise chicks in a plastic bin inside their house, overheating is a real concern and can be deadly to the chicks. That is because it's almost impossible to have any part of the plastic bin stay cool when using a heat lamp. (Brooder plates work better in those situations, because they put out so much less heat, so part of the space can still be cool.)

 

[rosemarythyme]

Also if you decide to opt for a much bigger brooder (6x6 vs 6x3 for example), for the first few days to a week or so, you might want to add an option for a temporary "wall" to reduce the size of the brooder by half, to prevent chicks from wandering off too far from heat, food and water. Something as simple as cardboard securely taped in place would do. It's unlikely that they can't manage to find their way around 36' sq ft, but newly hatched/veyr young chicks are more susceptible to getting chilled/lost/etc.

 

[3KillerBs]

This is my outdoor brooder: https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/run-to-outdoor-brooder-conversion.76634/

for the first few days to a week or so, you might want to add an option for a temporary "wall" to reduce the size of the brooder by half, to prevent chicks from wandering off too far from heat, food and water.

I do this in my brooder so they don't get lost away from the food and water.