BYC Bible Study Club!

[fowlsessed]

EPHESIANS 1:

I did a bit of almost ‘translating’ the verses into my own words to try 'n share what I’m getting from it.

Verse 3: First part: Paul gives a blessing to God, not because He benefits from it, but because Paul benefits from it, worship is good for the soul - and out of a reverence and acknowledgment of the Divine. Second part: (God) blessed us with every spiritual blessing possible, even from the Heavenly places, through giving us Christ.

Verse 4: Going along with that He chose us, you & me; even before the foundations of the world were in place….to be Holy and without blame in His sight, in love.

Verse 5: It was predestined that we should be adopted unto Him, through the ministry of Jesus Christ, as is in line with God's will.

A wonderful plan was set up for us and all humanity. A wonderful destiny awaits all who will accept. These are very special verses because they almost let us into God's mind, His plans and desires for us. Focusing in on Vs. 5: We must have belonged to someone else if He 'adopted' us. That was sin, satan. When our first parents sinned and took their own course of action at the prompting of the evil one, they put themselves and all consecutive generations under the dominion of satan and sin. But God had a plan for us since the beginning, and has been, and is now fulfilling it. Bringing all who will respond back to Himself for a better life, and freedom. A cleansing, a transformation away from the disfiguring force of evil.

 

[Beaky Buzzard]

I studied the bible in a 3 year theology course. Once you start to study it and actually understand what it is saying you will realise its crazy to actually believe any of it. There are no original texts to translate...... The oldest manuscripts we have were written down HUNDREDS of years after the last apostle died. There are over 8,000 of these old manuscripts with no 2 alike. When you read the bible and what the god is telling the people to do it makes you see god is acting cruel, evil and jealous.......or could it be its just made up by men to control people and use it an excuse for war and cruelty to others?

Brent, I know you don't want arguing.. but I feel this must be said...... To who m it may concern: You say the Bible does not have any proof... you say it's all man made.... how do the prophesies alway come true?some on the day it was prophesied to happen... Let's say your right, let's say it's all nonsense made up by old Jews who want to rule the world, then I will die everything will go black,it's over... I was wrong, but what does that matter ,I feel no pain no suffering I'm dead.... now let's say I'm right ,the Bible is true. There is a literal heaven literal he'll and literal judgement. I die trusting in Christ as my saviour enter heaven and live eternally. You will die and wake up in flames screaming and worms eating your flesh... I'm not trying to sound hateful,you know the Bible you've read the verses.... so if I'm a fool and die ,whatever I was a fool. But you if you make the fatal decision of rejecting Christ, and the Bible is true, God help your soul..... sorry if I sound mean, I don't mean to, I don't hate you I'm just concerned for you.

 

[fowlsessed]

The following thoughts on what hell maybe really is…..from the Bible. That’s the only way we can come to proper truth, what the bible says, the word of God, properly applied through the help of the Holy Spirit.
I pray we’ll see how the words that people interpret as being ‘proof’ for eternal burning in hell are miss-applied. The aim is to see that hell is a burning up, consuming of the contents. Not perpetual torture. Though we may think that many deserved that, the Bible speaks differently.

Matthew 25:41 "Then shall He say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" Here we see (in context of Jesus speaking to the disciples of His second coming) the term ‘everlasting fire’ used in reference with hell. First, that has nothing to do with the people burning everlastingly. But, let’s look at the other texts.

Jude 1:7 "Even as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire." Sodom isn’t burning now, is it? The fire used is simply unquenchable, as we’ll better see. (In fact, 2 Peter 2:6 tells us just that "And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;" Sodom was left in ashes)

The same thing is going to happen to those in hell, Malachi 4:1 "For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch." That’s pretty clear, huh? They will be left stubble, burned up. Nothing will remain.

But there’s more…….Here’s another one of the verses used FOR everlasting hell: Matthew 25:46 "And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (This is in the context of Jesus speaking of the end of time and His second coming.) It doesn’t say what you think, look at the term “everlasting punish-ment- not punish-ing-. The effects of the punishment are final and everlasting, but not the punishing itself. That’s pretty clear, too.

Romans 6:23 says: "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." So the penalty of sin is death…..not perpetual burning.

Some say that the word ‘unquenchable’ in some verses indicates burning forever. But…….. "But if ye will not hearken unto me………..then will I kindle a fire in the gates thereof, and it shall devour the palaces of Jerusalem, and it shall not be quenched." Jeremiah 17:27. Well……….. "And they burnt the house of God, and brake down the wall of Jerusalem, and burnt all the palaces thereof with fire, and destroyed all the goodly vessels thereof, to fulfill the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah." 2 Chronicles 36:19-21
The people of Jerusalem continued to live against the law and the judgment promised did indeed come. (Here we see prophecy fulfilled, awesome!) But, Jerusalem isn’t still burning today, unquenchable means you and me, or whoever, can’t extinguish it. The fire that the enemies kindled burned up Jerusalem.

Isaiah 47:14 says "Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it." Again, they will be left stubble.

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;" 2 Thessalonians 1:9 They are everlastingly destroyed. The first death is looked upon as a sleep, in the Bible, because they will awake again. But this final death is everlasting.

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." Matthew 10:28

"Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:4 sin with no repentance and forgiveness = death

"But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away." Psalms 37:20

There’s more if anyone wants to see them, but it’s pretty redundant. For some reason, perhaps a glitch in translation, ‘forever’ often refers to a specific time period. If you have a verse to share that I could consider, perhaps PM, so this doesn’t get in the way of the current Ephesians read.
There are also four root words that are translated “hell” in the Bible, so just hell doesn’t mean hell! I forget them now, but some mean like ‘pit’ etc.
I just wanted to offer an alternative to the current, prevalent teaching of ‘everlasting punishing.’ Just sharing through Bible study. No offending, getting offended, arguing, whatever.

 

[Zinnia-Hen]

Quote: Sure! It's a very beautiful religion, despite what people like to tell others, that focuses a lot on gaining knowledge, helping others, reflection, thankfulness, humbleness, steering away from greediness/excess, etc. It's actually not all that different from the two other Abrahamic religions.

 

[Zinnia-Hen]

I studied the bible in a 3 year theology course. Once you start to study it and actually understand what it is saying you will realise its crazy to actually believe any of it.

There are no original texts to translate......
The oldest manuscripts we have were written down HUNDREDS of years after the last apostle died.
There are over 8,000 of these old manuscripts with no 2 alike.

When you read the bible and what the god is telling the people to do it makes you see god is acting cruel, evil and jealous.......or could it be its just made up by men to control people and use it an excuse for war and cruelty to others?

To each his own, I say. I don't follow the Bible, but one should at least respect another person's beliefs no matter what they may be.

 

[member 142084]

Quote: Sure! It's a very beautiful religion, despite what people like to tell others, that focuses a lot on gaining knowledge, helping others, reflection, thankfulness, humbleness, steering away from greediness/excess, etc. It's actually not all that different from the two other Abrahamic religions.
Sounds a lot like Christianity.. an no worries each religion has its good and bad apples to make things look good or bad But there are major differences when it comes to the Deity.

Zinnia...... *hug * lol

 

[Zinnia-Hen]

Quote: Sure! It's a very beautiful religion, despite what people like to tell others, that focuses a lot on gaining knowledge, helping others, reflection, thankfulness, humbleness, steering away from greediness/excess, etc. It's actually not all that different from the two other Abrahamic religions.
Sounds a lot like Christianity.. an no worries each religion has its good and bad apples to make things look good or bad But there are major differences when it comes to the Deity.

Zinnia...... *hug * lol
Sort of major, I suppose. The God isn't everywhere at once unlike the Christian one, and He has no image therefore He did not create people in His image. He isn't even a He or a She. Just one all-forgiving God.

 

[member 142084]

Quote: Sure! It's a very beautiful religion, despite what people like to tell others, that focuses a lot on gaining knowledge, helping others, reflection, thankfulness, humbleness, steering away from greediness/excess, etc. It's actually not all that different from the two other Abrahamic religions.
Sounds a lot like Christianity.. an no worries each religion has its good and bad apples to make things look good or bad But there are major differences when it comes to the Deity.

Zinnia...... *hug * lol
Sort of major, I suppose. The God isn't everywhere at once unlike the Christian one, and He has no image therefore He did not create people in His image. He isn't even a He or a She. Just one all-forgiving God.

Alah also can lie but chooses not to. And Jehovah cannot lie because he cannot sin. Sin is everything that is not off Him/ His ways. So they are not the same God as some claim.

(how r ya?)

 

[jak2002003]

Sort of major, I suppose. The God isn't everywhere at once unlike the Christian one, and He has no image therefore He did not create people in His image. He isn't even a He or a She. Just one all-forgiving God.

Why do you think its one 'all forgiving god'?

Did that god forgive the entire population of the planet when he killed them all in the flood? Why does he command the death of all the first born sons... how can babies be evil against god? Why does he condone slavery and rape of women, and genocide?

Did he not say anyone who does not worship him will burn for all eternity in hell suffering and tortured forever?

It says in the bible that god is a jealous god so people can not worship other gods. But then it goes on to say jealousy is a SIN. So is got sinning when he is jealous?

Also why choose to worship the christian god? Maybe that is the wrong one/ Each religion has its own god or gods and each one says they are the one and only true religion. Then they fight and kill each other because they believe they are doing their gods good work.

Also if the bible is gods word why does in contradict itself over and over again. Just read the 4 gospels. Each one is the account of Jesus life, but if you read them together each one tells the story differently, even saying Jesus said and did different things and was in different places at different times.

Finally you can not 'take bible verses out of context'. They are there. How is the word of god not clear enough. Christians live their lives from the teachings of the bible. So how do people feel about theses.......

Psalms 137:9
How blessed will be the one who grabs your babies and smashes them on a rock!

The following passage describes the sickening practice of sex slavery. How can anyone think it is moral to sell your own daughter as a sex slave?

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

The examples are endless. Just a few more.. Read them in you own bible......look at the context there. Tell me how they can be OK in that context....

Deuteronomy 22:20-1​

If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the girl’s virginity can be found, she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house.​

Exodus 35:2​

For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day shall be your holy day, a Sabbath of rest to the LORD. Whoever does any work on it must be put to death.

Leviticus 20:9​

If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death.

20:10​

If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death.​

 

[member 142084]

Well don't sleep around or commit adultery........... rape is also punishable by death to bad we just let them out of jail to do it again.......... If sin if fake then why do we feel it wrong to murder...? and a lawless world.. I would hope to seek death soon, what a mess. :/


Yet the grace of Christ is about forgiveness. God cannot be in the presence of sin death is separation from Him. He wanted to be close to us, but we could not conform to his way. We kept falling, so Christ came to help.. did he cast the stone at the harlot? Did he listen to the pharisees when he healed on the Sabbath?

By the way the verses are in Ephesians for this bible study. Feel free to prove your point in your own thread thank you. And make sure you do it in Random Ramblings. Have a nice day