Chantecler Thread!

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hellbender said:
I know, I was not well enough to argue then and I'm not going to argue now either, just make my point.

I don't care what arbitrary nonsense APA writes down, it doesn't make the colored birds with rose combs (that many partridge birds sport) anything but Albertans...at best and mutts at worst.

These partridge birds would be more accurately called Canadian Buckeyes, considering what is known to be in their genetic makeup and what likely has been slipped in.

I have made my peace with the fact that for now, the breeds are lumped as one and I am not the one to push for any real change. If anything, those who actually breed true Albertans should be up in arms but I guess they are happy to follow along as the 'Red Headed Step-children'.

Please don't misunderstand me. I think the partridge birds are beautiful and I suspect that some will arrive at my farm, sooner than later and be used in my crossbreeding program for capons. The difference in what I'm doing is the F-1 generation are the birds that I will use as capons and poulardes....no crossing them back and calling them part of another breed. I will keep my pure flocks, continue to keep them pure as I can with the stock I have or can get and carry on from there.

Have a good one!
Click to expand...

HellBender,

Again, I think you need may need to get educated before you post out of turn. The Buckeye comb genetics (pea, not rose) and color genetics are completely different than the Partridge Chantecler, so I have no idea where you could be coming from here and totally different breeds were used to create it. The Albertans created by Dr Wilkinson did not have rose combs, they had cushion combs and they were, admittedly, called mutts when created (as per a 1935 article in Canadian Poultryman) - as are any composite breed bred for a specific purpose. In fact, one could technically call most breeds "mutts" with the exception of a few foundation breeds.

I am not sure that anyone raises "true Albertans" as I was unsuccessful in finding any foundation stock that traces back purely to Dr Wilkinson's flock as pure (if someone knows of some for sure, I would love to know about it), but there are many of us out here who raise Partridge Chantecler and do not mix other foundation or composite breeds into our stock to obtain breeding goals - we use selection and line breeding to refine the birds we have. I know some show breeders have added other breeds in - mostly Partridge Rock, but if you look back to the foundations of the Partridge Rock (another composite breed) you will find some similarities in the breeds used to create it.

So, do we Partridge people have some work cut out for us? Sure we do. We have a difficult color to breed and a breed that did not have the benefit of the founder living long after they were accepted into the APA along with a war that devastated much of the pure bred poultry industry. Did the white Chantecler have a benefit in that time? Yes, it was somewhat protected from the war effort and the founder lived on.

So, once again, I suggest you get off your high horse and get educated about poultry "breeds" and their history. There are very few breeds at all that could even be considered "pure" like the Dorking, La Fleche, Houdan, Crevecoeur, Old English Game, Redcap, White-faced Black Spanish, Ancona, Sicilian Buttercup, Brahma, Cochin, Hamburg, and, perhaps, the Dominique. You may be able to find "pure" birds in those breeds, but to use your strict standard, all other breeds are "mutts", lol. http://yellowhousefarmnh.com/understanding-heritage-poultry
 
Cockatrice6420 said:
The history I have found suggests this breed was originally snow white and are from canada. Shortly after having significant population decrease,during warmer months, the partridge variation was introduced for camouflage purposes.
Click to expand...

Actually, both colors were created about the same time for the same purpose - to avoid the devastation that the cold weather was wreaking on the poultry industry in the winter from frozen combs and wattles, according to my extensive research into the Partridge. Brother Wilfred created the White or Oka Chantecler in the east and Dr Wilkinson worked on creating the Partridge Chantecler or "Albertan" as he called it in the west.

The white Chantecler was accepted by the APA first.

Also, Dr Wilkinson created many other colors but only the Partridge was accepted. He was more focused on utilitarian features (egg production and carcass) and did not originally set out to have them accepted by the APA as a breed.
 
Shello said:
HellBender,

Again, I think you need may need to get educated before you post out of turn. The Buckeye comb genetics (pea, not rose) and color genetics are completely different than the Partridge Chantecler, so I have no idea where you could be coming from here and totally different breeds were used to create it. The Albertans created by Dr Wilkinson did not have rose combs, they had cushion combs and they were, admittedly, called mutts when created (as per a 1935 article in Canadian Poultryman) - as are any composite breed bred for a specific purpose. In fact, one could technically call most breeds "mutts" with the exception of a few foundation breeds.

I am not sure that anyone raises "true Albertans" as I was unsuccessful in finding any foundation stock that traces back purely to Dr Wilkinson's flock as pure (if someone knows of some for sure, I would love to know about it), but there are many of us out here who raise Partridge Chantecler and do not mix other foundation or composite breeds into our stock to obtain breeding goals - we use selection and line breeding to refine the birds we have. I know some show breeders have added other breeds in - mostly Partridge Rock, but if you look back to the foundations of the Partridge Rock (another composite breed) you will find some similarities in the breeds used to create it.

So, do we Partridge people have some work cut out for us? Sure we do. We have a difficult color to breed and a breed that did not have the benefit of the founder living long after they were accepted into the APA along with a war that devastated much of the pure bred poultry industry. Did the white Chantecler have a benefit in that time? Yes, it was somewhat protected from the war effort and the founder lived on.

So, once again, I suggest you get off your high horse and get educated about poultry "breeds" and their history. There are very few breeds at all that could even be considered "pure" like the Dorking, La Fleche, Houdan, Crevecoeur, Old English Game, Redcap, White-faced Black Spanish, Ancona, Sicilian Buttercup, Brahma, Cochin, Hamburg, and, perhaps, the Dominique. You may be able to find "pure" birds in those breeds, but to use your strict standard, all other breeds are "mutts", lol. http://yellowhousefarmnh.com/understanding-heritage-poultry
Click to expand...

Sorry, you are correct...I did use the wrong name for the comb...I know it's pea comb...just an honest error. I'm gonna stand by everything I wrote. I know Joe by the way...great guy.

Would you please be kind enough to post a couple pics of your birds? I'd love to see them.
 
hellbender said:
Sorry, you are correct...I did use the wrong name for the comb...I know it's pea comb...just an honest error. I'm gonna stand by everything I wrote. I know Joe by the way...great guy.

Would you please be kind enough to post a couple pics of your birds? I'd love to see them.
Click to expand...

Well, I stand by my "get educated" as you have alot to learn about the Chantecler, lol.

I suck at photography and setting up a website, but you can find a couple pictures here: www.OldTime.Farm

They are a work in progress but I am satisfied on where they are heading.

Shel

PS ... glad you are feeling well enough to try to rile people up again!
 
BTW, the 1935 article in Canadian Poultryman by Dr Wilkinson (the founder of the Partridge Chantecler) is posted on the PC page on my website.
Shello said:
Well, I stand by my "get educated" as you have alot to learn about the Chantecler, lol.

I suck at photography and setting up a website, but you can find a couple pictures here: www.OldTime.Farm

They are a work in progress but I am satisfied on where they are heading.

Shel

PS ... glad you are feeling well enough to try to rile people up again!
Click to expand...
 
Has anyone read "the book of the dun cow?" Our hero is Chantecleer
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