Chick starter protein

[Wildflower_VA]

After my six chicks were a week old and doing well with no eating and drinking issues, I started giving one hard boiled egg with some greens/veggies and grain/seeds I mentioned above every day in addition to 20% chick starter. My chicks didn't like the veggies cooked, so it was a few days before they ate much of it. Divided between six chicks, they still didn't get enough to keep them from eating a lot of the chick feed. Most of the nutrition needs to come from a balanced starter feed, with the treats as a supplement. Many people feed bread and white flour treats like cooked spaghetti noodles. I never did that because white flour products are nearly void of nutrition and are very filling. If you do feed noodles, do it just for the entertainment value of chick keep-away, and don't feed it to them often at all.

 

[chookmama]

Wildflower, thanks for all of the detail on quinoa and comfrey - much appreciated! I recently had a couple of cups of quinoa w/ meal moths - not many bugs, but I wasn't about to eat it! I tossed it in a pan w/ some raw coconut and some bean flour (moths again!) and cooked it all up. I know people do coconut meal to replace soy, and I am giving this to my hens, not my chicks, and just in small quantities for their late afternoon snack, so I figured as long as I fed small amounts it should be ok. They went absolutely CRAZY over it. I ended up w/ about 2 quarts of the stuff, so froze it in smaller containers since I wasn't absolutely certain that all of the ingredients were hen-friendly. Still - I also figured it was good, high protein, healthy food, so shouldn't hurt them.

I've read that you shouldn't feed insect-infested grain, but also read that it's because the bugs lower the nutritional values. I couldn't believe that my bug-eating hens would be harmed by a very light infestation of super good ingredients, so..... it seemed like a reasonable way to deal with my meal moth problem without wasting all of that food!

Now, reading the detail on quinoa from you, I'm delighted (and yes, a little relieved to have my frugal instincts validated!)

I've planted comfrey and planned to feed it next year - and wanted to research growing amaranth grain for my chooks, too. Seems like it might be an easy thing to grow/harvest - just cut it and hang it in bundles from the rafters to dry, and feed the entire stalk? Have you ever tried/heard of anyone using amaranth? I figured I'd research it this winter, but if you have any advice I'd be grateful!

 

[Wildflower_VA]

Quote:
Coconut and coconut oil are both very nutritious. When it gets cold and my chooks need more fat and calories to keep warm, I plan on adding organic, extra virgin coconut oil to their feed in small quantities. Coconut oil has many properties which are good for health.

I have not tried growing amaranth YET, but I will do so next year. This year I totally focused on my gardens, fruit and perennials. Amaranth is an easy to grow annual, which is high in protein. It is one of the crops on the list of forage to grow for poultry. It is easy to feed, just the way you described. You can also feed the seed heads while they are fresh.

 

[johnny22cn]

nothigh t o say

 

[chookmama]

Thanks Wildflower. I'm new to chickens, but have read extensively abt. nutrition from the whole foods perspective, so I thought it should be safe. But - hard to be certain that there isn't something negative that's species specific, so I really appreciate your feedback. I'd love to be able to learn more from people who BOTH grow their own feed and who have high nutritional expectations. Seems that most folks I talk to who don't feed mixes exclusively are supplementing with things like white bread. I don't eat white bread and wouldn't ask my chickens to either. But I also don't eat GMO - and I know my chickens are, alas! Hard to find organic or open-pollinated feed in Michigan, especially at the higher protein levels. I've found some at 16%, but that's too low for chick starter or for keets, so have sourced from an Amish feed store that provides very freshly ground natural mixes.

I thought I remembered reading somewhere that quinoa can have a negative effect on growth if not cooked, so I did. But I don't know if that's true or not, haven't even been able to find my original source.

It's 5:00AM here right now, and I just finished rounding up 50 night-blind keets from their brooder, transfered them into a big box w/ shavings. Today they go outside to their hay-bale and wire coop for the next phase of growth. It's all cosy with deep bedding made from hay, lots of fresh air and sunshine. I hope they're as happy with their new home as their next-door neighbor chicks (25 Silver Laced Wyandottes and 25 Buff Orpingtons) seem to be!

I've been incredibly lucky - only one keet lost so far. Had a keet and 2 chicks isolated for brief "hospital" stays, but they bounced right back and were reintegrated into their respective flocks.

 

[A.T. Hagan]

16 to 28% is quite a spread. 16% is too low but 28% is too high. Chicken chicks can't utilize all of the protein in a 28% starter.

Purina Start & Grow is only 18% and can be used all by itself to produce good birds though I think personally 20% is better still particularly if it has some animal protein in it based on a number of years of trying different feed combinations with dual-purpose breeds.

Basically what I do now is to mix two parts Start & Grow to one part game bird starter which gives a combined total of 22% protein. Works well for me.

 

[jmtcmkb]

oh no, I didnt realize this! I am getting a mix of 5 different birds, 2 of which I now see are "heavy" Australorp and Orpington. The starter I purchased says 20% protein will this be sufficient?

 

[Ridgerunner]

There are a lot of different options out there. The 20% combined Starter/Grower works great from Day 1 until you switch to Layer. It is plenty high enough in protein and not too high. They can live and grow on the 16% protein for the first few weeks, but if that feed is all they are eating, they really do better on something around 20% to 24% the first few weeks. After 4 weeks, the 16% is good enough, but they can continue to eat the higher protein Starter longer without any real problems. There is a pretty wide range of what works. And it depends a lot less on the percentage protein than how much total protein they eat in a day. If you are up on your feeds enough to mix them, then the higher protein mixed with lower protein works fine. But it helps for you to know what you are doing.

There are studies that show that a real high protein level can damage chickens. 30% protein feed can cause avian gout if that is all they are eating. Can, not absolutely will each and every time. The 28% protein level is too close to that 30% for me to be comfortable. There is a reason that chickens are not listed on that high protein feed. It is not formulated for them. If the bag lists what it is good for and it does not list chickens, don't use it for chickens.

 

[A.T. Hagan]

Quote:
That should be fine.

 

[chookmama]

Good information, thanks. I'm not yet expert enough to mix things for my chicks, though I do a bit for my hens as supplement/snacks only. I hope to get there one of these days. Meanwhile they have layer mash in front of them all of the time. I only have 3 hens, a pullet and a rooster, so that group is small and easy.

Meanwhile I've got the 50 chicks on a 20% "all natural" starter from a local Amish feed store, and the keets on a bagged Game Bird product I pick up at the same place that's 28%. Neither are medicated. (The hens are on a 16% Layer Mash). I'm switching the chicks to an 18% organic feed I just found next week - at 6 weeks old, and when the hens finish the last of their food I'll probably give them the organic feed too, only with free choice oyster shell in their pen. (Currently mixed into the layer ration). I mix a little DE in everyone's food. I want to start them all on ACV in their water, but somehow just haven't gotten that organized yet. A little worried about the acidity on the plastic waterers, but I'm guessing the small amount in the water isn't a big deal. But - it's something else I'm a little uncomfortable/unsure about.

The chicks are outside now and I load up 25 of the 50 each day and put them on pasture, while the rest hang out in their fenced area. Who goes is a random process - some days I really focus on only catching the smaller ones to make sure they're getting a chance at the bugs. I do it partly for the extra nutrition for the chicks, but also to give me some help cleaning up/ manuring the garden before I cover it with straw for the end of the season. I also toss grass/clover/ragweed into the pen for those that stayed "home" - usually 2X a day. They're pretty tame - their idea of crowding to the front of the line at feeding time is fighting for the chance to stand on top of my feet - a very bad habit! But it does mean that catching them for pasturing is pretty fast/simple.

The keets are still in the brooder and won't go out until tomorrow, so they don't have a routine yet.

Thanks for the warning about possible risks of too-high protein - it's good to know to be careful. I didn't know if chicks weren't listed on game bird because the extra protein is bad for them, or if it's just wasted on them. I've heard of people raising a few chicks with their poults to teach them to eat/drink - and in that case I think they were feeding them the 28% stuff. I'd like to get some poults next spring, but figured I'd stick to Royal Palms and Slate's and hope that the genetics are such that they are able to remember how to feed themselves from one minute to the next. Most of the problems I've heard abt. are with the Broad Breasted Whites, and I'm guessing that it's like raising Cornish X - it takes a little more care and knowledge to do it right than with heritage birds.

But like everything else I'm doing here - it's just a guess.