Chickens not eating food?

[ShrekDawg]

You may find the argument amusing, but I have never found the farmer to be amused when they have killed all of their birds. I have seen this happen on countless occasions with customers...... It isn't the level of calcium that is the problem. It is the ratio of cal/phos, and it will absolutely cause skeletal development problems in younger birds, as well as kidney issues, if you feed them layer feed. The calcium/phosphorus ratio in layer feed is severely unbalanced for young birds.


Feeding a flock grower with free choice calcium is fine for all. The adult layers will go after the calcium on their own. Feeding layer feed to birds under 18 weeks of age, is absolutely not ok.

Wow thats some really scary stuff! So should I switch them over then or is ot too late? I did it a couple days before they turned 16 weeks and now they're turning 17 weeks tomorrow/today (Monday, it's after midnight here) cause i figured they would be okay. Been meaning to switch back but haven't been able to and now I'm terrified I'm gonna kill my birds does a week or two really make that huge of a difference or is it more like don't feed it to baby chicks/under 8 weeks, etc.? Cause it said right on the bag 16 weeks and older and now I'm worried they're going to have problems should they even be on it at all even as adults?

 

[ShrekDawg]

Another consideration is that there is less waste with pellets. The crumbles get spilled. So they may be eating close to the same in volume.

That could be it too! I never realized that before!

 

[ChickNanny13]

FF = no feed waste, firmer poop & less stinky & less poop, they like it whether crumble or pellet It is a bit more work but I love the benefits!

 

[ShrekDawg]

I might have to try that!! Wasn't sure about the extra work part but I guess it isn't that much extra work and saves work on the cleanup bit may have to try that!

 

[GreenMountainEric]

Wow thats some really scary stuff! So should I switch them over then or is ot too late? I did it a couple days before they turned 16 weeks and now they're turning 17 weeks tomorrow/today (Monday, it's after midnight here) cause i figured they would be okay. Been meaning to switch back but haven't been able to and now I'm terrified I'm gonna kill my birds does a week or two really make that huge of a difference or is it more like don't feed it to baby chicks/under 8 weeks, etc.? Cause it said right on the bag 16 weeks and older and now I'm worried they're going to have problems should they even be on it at all even as adults?

No, there is no cause for alarm at that age and for that duration of feeding. 16 weeks is developed enough to not cause issues. It is more of a major concern in weeks 0-14.

That said, it is common for them to not want to eat it. As I mentioned in my first post, your birds know that they don't need large amounts of calcium yet, and will shy away from a food that is too high in calcium. Usually, they will eat it for a day or two, and then their body will tell them to stop eating it (mostly because of the changes in processing in the kidneys, and the issues in getting rid of the extra calcium). At that point, they will shy away from it, and try to find other food sources. They will go days without eating the layer feed, and will just hope they find other stuff to eat. That will continue for days until they get too hungry and have no other choice...... At which point, they will start to eat it again because they have no choice.

It has been very popular in the last 5-10 years for people to put on a couple backyard chickens at their home. Many of them educate themselves, and are prepared to take care of their chickens. Many of them are not, which is how I run in to this problem frequently. Most commonly, a customer has chicks/young birds, and adult layers. They want one feed and figure they can just feed layer feed to all of them. In doing so, I eventually get a phone call with one of two different concerns.

1) My chicks don't like your feed, but my laying birds do.

2) My birds are 12-16 weeks of age, some have died, and the others are not moving much and are breathing really weird. It seems to be getting worse and worse.

If it's number 2, it is too late for all of them..... That would typically happen within 4-5 weeks of feeding layer feed to young birds. (For example, started layer feed at 6 weeks, and getting problems at 12 weeks)

Problems with feeding layer feed to young birds is further amplified in faster growing birds. Layer feed will kill a young broiler within a week or two. You wouldn't think anyone would ever give layer feed to broilers, but I have seen it happen many many times. They want all their chickens to eat the same food, and figure layer feed is the best choice. In fact, it is the worst choice for that. They should be buying a grower feed, and putting out oyster shell for the layers to grab on their own.

Nonetheless, in your case, you are fine. The major problem you will see, is just palatability issues. They will eat the layer feed much better once they start laying.

 

[ShrekDawg]

No, there is no cause for alarm at that age and for that duration of feeding. 16 weeks is developed enough to not cause issues. It is more of a major concern in weeks 0-14.

That said, it is common for them to not want to eat it. As I mentioned in my first post, your birds know that they don't need large amounts of calcium yet, and will shy away from a food that is too high in calcium. Usually, they will eat it for a day or two, and then their body will tell them to stop eating it (mostly because of the changes in processing in the kidneys, and the issues in getting rid of the extra calcium). At that point, they will shy away from it, and try to find other food sources. They will go days without eating the layer feed, and will just hope they find other stuff to eat. That will continue for days until they get too hungry and have no other choice...... At which point, they will start to eat it again because they have no choice.

It has been very popular in the last 5-10 years for people to put on a couple backyard chickens at their home. Many of them educate themselves, and are prepared to take care of their chickens. Many of them are not, which is how I run in to this problem frequently. Most commonly, a customer has chicks/young birds, and adult layers. They want one feed and figure they can just feed layer feed to all of them. In doing so, I eventually get a phone call with one of two different concerns.

1) My chicks don't like your feed, but my laying birds do.

2) My birds are 12-16 weeks of age, some have died, and the others are not moving much and are breathing really weird. It seems to be getting worse and worse.

If it's number 2, it is too late for all of them..... That would typically happen within 4-5 weeks of feeding layer feed to young birds. (For example, started layer feed at 6 weeks, and getting problems at 12 weeks)

Problems with feeding layer feed to young birds is further amplified in faster growing birds. Layer feed will kill a young broiler within a week or two. You wouldn't think anyone would ever give layer feed to broilers, but I have seen it happen many many times. They want all their chickens to eat the same food, and figure layer feed is the best choice. In fact, it is the worst choice for that. They should be buying a grower feed, and putting out oyster shell for the layers to grab on their own.

Nonetheless, in your case, you are fine. The major problem you will see, is just palatability issues. They will eat the layer feed much better once they start laying.

Thank you for clarifying that!! I wasn't sure with the other posts and you had me worried I was going to kill my birds! I understand wanting to educate people though and I'm glad you did! You also seem really knowledgeable so sorry for half doubting or being rude before!

I honestly can't believe people would feed layer feed to babies though! I mean, I guess if you didn't do research or didn't know better but I did some research so I guess that's how I knew though. But I didn't really research food that much and even if you don't, it says right on the bag. I fed mine medicated starter/grower until about 7 weeks when they ran out instead of 8 weeks then unmedicated until i just switched them.

I'm realizing now 16 weeks might be too young even if there's no health issues so next time I will wait.

Although do you think I should go back to starter/grower for a while? Or All Flock/Flock Raiser???

I know you said for mine it's fine (thank you again for clarifying) but I was thinking about it and i don't have any hybrids that would lay super early, I have fairly large breeds/late bloomers almost (Black Australorp, Buff Orpington, Barred Rock, Easter Egger) that, except for the EEs, may not lay until like 20-24 weeks or even later from what I've read, which is a really long time, so maybe I should put them on something else until then??

 

[junebuggena]

Thank you for clarifying that!! I wasn't sure with the other posts and you had me worried I was going to kill my birds! I understand wanting to educate people though and I'm glad you did! You also seem really knowledgeable so sorry for half doubting or being rude before!

I honestly can't believe people would feed layer feed to babies though! I mean, I guess if you didn't do research or didn't know better but I did some research so I guess that's how I knew though. But I didn't really research food that much and even if you don't, it says right on the bag. I fed mine medicated starter/grower until about 7 weeks when they ran out instead of 8 weeks then unmedicated until i just switched them.

I'm realizing now 16 weeks might be too young even if there's no health issues so next time I will wait.

Although do you think I should go back to starter/grower for a while? Or All Flock/Flock Raiser???

I know you said for mine it's fine (thank you again for clarifying) but I was thinking about it and i don't have any hybrids that would lay super early, I have fairly large breeds/late bloomers almost (Black Australorp, Buff Orpington, Barred Rock, Easter Egger) that, except for the EEs, may not lay until like 20-24 weeks or even later from what I've read, which is a really long time, so maybe I should put them on something else until then??

All of your breeds should lay somewhere between 20 to 25 weeks. Your Barred Rocks will probably be first to lay and the last will probably be the Orpingtons. Easter Eggers can be all over the place. Some will lay at 18 weeks, others won't start till they are close to 8 months.

 

[GreenMountainEric]

Thank you for clarifying that!! I wasn't sure with the other posts and you had me worried I was going to kill my birds! I understand wanting to educate people though and I'm glad you did! You also seem really knowledgeable so sorry for half doubting or being rude before!

I honestly can't believe people would feed layer feed to babies though! I mean, I guess if you didn't do research or didn't know better but I did some research so I guess that's how I knew though. But I didn't really research food that much and even if you don't, it says right on the bag. I fed mine medicated starter/grower until about 7 weeks when they ran out instead of 8 weeks then unmedicated until i just switched them.

I'm realizing now 16 weeks might be too young even if there's no health issues so next time I will wait.

Although do you think I should go back to starter/grower for a while? Or All Flock/Flock Raiser???

I know you said for mine it's fine (thank you again for clarifying) but I was thinking about it and i don't have any hybrids that would lay super early, I have fairly large breeds/late bloomers almost (Black Australorp, Buff Orpington, Barred Rock, Easter Egger) that, except for the EEs, may not lay until like 20-24 weeks or even later from what I've read, which is a really long time, so maybe I should put them on something else until then??

I have quite a lot of experience with this. I am the head poultry nutritionist for a company that feeds about 3 million chickens. Being an organic company, a larger than normal portion of that is backyard chickens (probably close to 1/3 of them). I have seen a whole lot of crazy things in 20 years!!

My recommendation would be- Close up the bag of layer feed and set it aside for a few weeks. Get some grower or flock raiser, and keep them on that until 19-20 weeks. Leave some oyster shell available from week 18 on. Go ahead with the layer feed after week 20. Your slower birds might not have started laying yet, but will be fully developed to deal with the excess calcium at that point. If you still have grower left over at 20 weeks, you can feel free to keep feeding that with free choice oyster shell until it is gone. It is also not a bad idea to leave oyster shell available after the switch to layer, especially if it is pellets or crumbles. Pelleted/crumble feed doesn't usually contain much large particle calcium (sometimes the mash doesn't either). They will usually use small particle calcium only, because it is easier on the equipment. Small particle calcium works well, but a little added large particle calcium helps with more efficient digestion. A little bit of free choice oyster shell or calcium chips helps out with that.

 

[ShrekDawg]

All of your breeds should lay somewhere between 20 to 25 weeks. Your Barred Rocks will probably be first to lay and the last will probably be the Orpingtons. Easter Eggers can be all over the place. Some will lay at 18 weeks, others won't start till they are close to 8 months.

Thanks for the info!! Unfortunately sounds like I could not be getting eggs for a while!! Hah only have 1 Barred Rock yet 3 Orpingtons! then 2 EEs and 2 Black Australorps. Let's hope the EEs lay early!

 

[ShrekDawg]

I have quite a lot of experience with this. I am the head poultry nutritionist for a company that feeds about 3 million chickens. Being an organic company, a larger than normal portion of that is backyard chickens (probably close to 1/3 of them). I have seen a whole lot of crazy things in 20 years!!

My recommendation would be- Close up the bag of layer feed and set it aside for a few weeks. Get some grower or flock raiser, and keep them on that until 19-20 weeks. Leave some oyster shell available from week 18 on. Go ahead with the layer feed after week 20. Your slower birds might not have started laying yet, but will be fully developed to deal with the excess calcium at that point. If you still have grower left over at 20 weeks, you can feel free to keep feeding that with free choice oyster shell until it is gone. It is also not a bad idea to leave oyster shell available after the switch to layer, especially if it is pellets or crumbles. Pelleted/crumble feed doesn't usually contain much large particle calcium (sometimes the mash doesn't either). They will usually use small particle calcium only, because it is easier on the equipment. Small particle calcium works well, but a little added large particle calcium helps with more efficient digestion. A little bit of free choice oyster shell or calcium chips helps out with that.

Oh wow! Definitely are knowledgeable then! Shouls have figured by the name too, think i may have heard of it a while ago.

Anyway, thanks for the recommendation!! Will definitely try that!! Thank you!!