Cocci is LETHAL...DO NOT take it lightly...

[speckledhen]

Well, hopefully, your thread will help the next person avoid any losses.

If anyone needs to know anything with chicks beyond feed, water and warmth, it's that coccidiosis is THE most common thing they need to be aware of while raising those babies up till around 12 weeks old. Past that, usually, it's not much of a concern, unless they're living in abject filth or a new bird with a different strain is brought into the mix.

 

[Miss Lydia]

We need to keep this going back to the top so it doesn't get lost.

 

[chicktwins]

Kaybats- I hope you didn't think I was trying to say you didn't do what you should have when it came to researching illnesses, etc. I was trying to say that even in my attempts at researching this venture, there were still unanswered questions that I never found information on until I came here and posted the question several times before finally getting the answer I needed. Sorry if it came out the wrong way.

Unfortunately, many veterinary offices do not offer any advice for what are considered "exotic pets" or "livestock and large animal" unless they offer farm calls or specialize in that area. Kind of like people doctors, you have Primary Care Physicians and then you have Specialists for just about anything other than the normal illnesses.

I worked in the veterinary field for nine years in different offices. Started out in a regular run of the mill small animal practice, then went to a small animal that offered exotics (snakes, iguanas, guinea pigs, birds) and moonlighted at an after hours animal emergency hospital. The after hours ER was part of a specialty group of practices that consisted of Orthopedic, Opthalmology, Internal Medicine and finally Allergy and Dermatology. I ended up in Allergy & Derm and we happened to share a suite with Opthalmology so I was lucky to get some experience there as well. We moved and I ended my career in another small animal practice that offered large animal services. There we saw dogs, cats, goats, horses and cows, etc. We did the occasional nail trim on a guinea pig or beak trim on a family parrot. Even though we were a small and large animal practice and spent a lot of time with horses and goats we still never once in the four years I was there saw a chicken. I guess my point here is many owners of farm animals learn to provide their own medical care because most vets don't often, if ever, get the opportunity to treat those animals. Many pet owners won't spend $ on their dogs and cats for things like preventative and maintenance care and lots of times it boils down to the veterinarian failing to explain and educate their clientele on the pros and cons of doing so. Sadly, it is often left up to the client or patient to do their own research and be their own advocate when it comes to medical care and advice. I am really fortunate to have experienced all of the things I did in those years. Now I can take my pets to their vet almost already knowing what to expect. There are lots of new treatments, medications, etc that have come out in the seven years since, so I am slowly beginning to feel more and more uneducated and I don't like it one bit.

I am sooo glad I found this site to help me with my chickens. I feel like I could question just about anything and someone here would have a definite answer or atleast had experienced the same issue and offer a solution or a shoulder to cry on. We are all very blessed to have one another!!

If I can help answer any questions about your dogs just let me know. I will do my best to help, even if that means calling and asking my vet a question about a new drug or treatment.

 

[Chickangel79]

I think I am battling cocci, 8 week old, long, bright red stringy poop. CHick just standing there, have fed it some crumbs and water but its not that interested. I can not get anything to help it around here and have to order it in and won't be here until at least Tuesday.
Question: can I treat the other four chicks it was with, with the coxoid as a precaution or should I not ? I have the sick one separated and indoors now.
Another question, is there anything I can give it that I can find locally or in my kitchen until the medicine arrives ?

 

[kaybats]

Quote:
OK, first be calm. my best instinct was to panic. Not a good idea. I did the best research I could in a short time and found that CORID is the best solution. And YES, YES, YES. treat the other birds. This is DEADLY. I lost 5 chicks. I only had to wait til the next day and still lost one third of the babies.

She won't eat,or drink and you can try to force her to do it, but I am afraid you may lose her (the others) if not for the Corid. I had , like I said 5 chicks die in my arms over the course of just a few days. Even getting the Corid the very next day did not save them.

But 10 out of 15 survived are are doing great. But with your small flock...

i don't know of any home remedies, but I hope someone might. Cocci is so horrible and it kills so quickly. REMEMBER, though it is NOT your fault! This can happen, most especially with new chicken lovers.

I'm sending you BIG BIG HUGS and hope you will come through this OK. Please answer the thread, or PM to let me know how things are going.OK?

 

[williamsl77]

Gotta chime in... I'm a new chicken owner and we just got over coccidiosis, too. I lost 4 birds. One with very bloody poop somehow managed to survive and is now doing just fine.

I went on a weekend trip (as if hard enough wasn't hard enough, it was to my sister's memorial service). When I got back, one bird was totally lethargic and a couple others were puffy. The lethargic one died that night. I took one bird to the vet (and she ended up being the one that survived). The vet gave her injections of fluids under her arms. Maybe that got her through? I already had her on sulfadimethoxine by that point because that was the only remedy available at my local feed store. Pretty much ALL of the useful information I found was on this website. The vet didn't really know much about chickens and wasn't all that helpful with the dosing. I told her how I calculated what I should give and she said, well, that seems reasonable. I also took one of the birds that died to the UNH diagnositic vet (they do autopsies) and the told me that it was likely two forms of cocci, one that they confirmed was the most lethal form of coccia out there (can't remember off the top of my head... tenella something?)

Edited here to add that they got sick shortly after being transferred to their coop. They spent the better part of an afternoon on the lawn waiting for transfer. Prior to that, they were in my living room. So I think I went from nothing to super exposure and then left town.

The remaining birds have been off of meds now for about a week and a half and so far everyone is still looking good. I kept them on the sulfadimethoxine for about 10 days total. I figured we had a pretty bad case since it probably went unrecognised by the folks feeding the chicks while I was away. I do still have at least one bird whose poop is loose and quite stinky. I haven't figured out which bird that is yet. I also think that antibiotics can cause those same symptoms (loose stinky poos). I am giving plain yogurt treats about every other day. I think they may need some extra protein, too, as some still have kinda prominent keels. I completely cleaned out the coop, scrubbed it with bleach and painted it (two weeks or so ago). I put new bedding in and mixed in a good dose of diatomacheous earth. I have been removing poop from perch and nest areas most days, stirring the flood bedding around daily, and adding new bedding with a bit more diatomacheous earth weekly. I also finished their run so that they would have access to some outdoor space. I spread a little bit of diatomaceous earth in the run, too. I have made extra sure waterers and surrounding areas are clean and dry.

I think I have covered my bases. Any other suggestions???

So now I have one other question. I just acquired two silkie chicks that are 4 weeks old. (All of my other chicks are now about 9 weeks old). These silkies are not vaccinated and have been living in a brooder. I'm guessing I should bring in some dirt to let them play in it, right? Or if this hasn't happened from the first week, should I wait until they are older? I am thinking that I will keep them away from my other chicks until they are... 8-10 weeks old or so? Any suggestions on how to build their immunity at this point? My other chicks are just now back on medicated feed. These two have always been on medicated feed. Also, do affected birds usually recover in growth? I know that sometimes there can be such significant intestinal damage that growth can be stunted if they were severely affected. That being said, do most recover without stunting?

Just as an interesting point... chickens have not been in our yard for at least the last 20 years. I hear that cocci are somewhat species specific (at least that's what the vet says). I'm guessing we have cocci in our soil from wild turkeys that come through our yard on a weekly basis. Otherwise, all of my chicks came from McMurray Hatchery. I was grateful for the earlier post that really laid it out that cleanliness of the coop/brooder at least sometimes has nothing to do whether your birds get coccidia. A lot of what you read makes you feel as if letting your coop get too full of poop is what causes coccidia. I thought I had read and researched a ton about this (and friends made fun of me for that approach!!). Yes, I too was a newbie who lost chicks to something that caught me a little bit by surprise. I don't have corid as I can't get that locally, but I now have sulfadimethoxine and sulmet on hand for the future!!

Best of luck to folks dealing with this. I'm glad this thread has gotten so much attention!

 

[Dudu]

Quote:
I think you are 100% right. But I am trying to think of these things in the light of karma. Everyone has his or her own, and if it's the animal's destiny to pass away at a certain time, it will pass no matter what we do. That still doesn't mean we should do nothing to protect them, but sometimes (as in this sad case with your baby) the circumstances are such that nothing can be done. Please, please don't beat yourself up - you gave her a wonderful life and she's forever grateful to you for that. Just think that she could have ended up with a different owner, in a battery cage etc. But she was with you.

 

[kaybats]

Quote:
First, let me express my sincerest condolences regarding your sister.

And for the loss of your birds.

Now, I think I have said this somewhere here, but my vet was totally useless while I was going through this. Same was true with feed stores, MFA, Orscheln's, Gordon Feed and Supply, on and on. It truly surprised me about the vet though. I'm in rural southwest Missouri and I thought at least they would be knowledgeable about farm animals. But no, sadly, she was not. I went to her about the dosing right after I got the Corid from MFA. the dosing on the bottle is for COWS and was very difficult to calculate for a baby chick. And like I said I got NO help from anyone at the stores. In my distress, I was infuriated that folks worked at these places and did not have one clue about chickens. The BEST and most informative information is what I got from the folks on this forum...SO....

and

. So glad you found BYC. This will be your very BEST source of help and information.

With my VERY limited experience I will tell you that I found that chickens will peck at just about anything they might think would be tasty. This includes all the dirt, grass, bugs, weeds etc. on your land. That's where they get the Cocci from. And from new droppings from a bird who may have/had the strain. I constantly see my chickens pecking at poop. While it is true that cleanliness of the coop is not so much a factor, what matters is if one of the birds has the disease, or is carrying it, and others pick and peck at 'their' poop. Through the course of my ordeal, I came to find out that animals (cows, pigs, etc.) were slaughtered on and near the very spot I built my coops. But that was more than 16 or 17 years ago. I still don't know if that had anything to do with my babies getting sick.

I can also tell you that my RIRs, who didn't go outside til they were about 4 months old (the coop wasn't ready yet, sigh) were just fine. It was the BOs and WRs that I put out at about 2 months old. I have also learned that a chick hatched in the coop, with the Mother, has a better immune system to ward off this disease than chicks acquired from a store or hatchery.

So the way I see it at the moment, new chicks need to be acclimated to your 'dirt' as soon as possible, or wait til they are older when they may be more able to fend off the disease for themselves.

I hope this helps you in any way and I hope that all goes well with your new found love for chickens. I'm sorry if I'm rambling on....I need another cup of coffee!

 

[kaybats]

Quote:
I think you are 100% right. But I am trying to think of these things in the light of karma. Everyone has his or her own, and if it's the animal's destiny to pass away at a certain time, it will pass no matter what we do. That still doesn't mean we should do nothing to protect them, but sometimes (as in this sad case with your baby) the circumstances are such that nothing can be done. Please, please don't beat yourself up - you gave her a wonderful life and she's forever grateful to you for that. Just think that she could have ended up with a different owner, in a battery cage etc. But she was with you.

I agree. I did everything I knew how to do and they still died. I made a sling to carry them around in so I could watch them constantly, but fate had other plans. They did hid have a wonderful life, short as it was, and I WILL see them again someday. I am grateful everyday they were with me and not....somewhere else.

(I don't think I posted it on this thread, but when I refer to 'they' and 'them', you should know I lost 5 chicks in that battle.

)

Thank you Dudu. You and many other folks here have been a Saving Grace for me!

 

[Chickangel79]

I'll start at the beginning.
3 days ago our uk temps dropped from 28c in the day to 9c at night, previous nights have been 16c etc, we found a 8 week old girl dead in the little tractor type run I use before the big coop.
Didn't think too much of it as I thought she got cold and didn't warm up the others. later that day My black Orp was hunched over, wings held higher than iths back eyes closed and I noticed about 5 inches of thin intestine looking poo, it was bright red, and some more on the walls of coop. I brought her indoors, put the other 4 babies in another coop and bleached and scrubbed where they had been. All four ok.

This black orp was given a heat lamp, hand fed chick crunbs and water, still had eyes shut. About an hour later its eyes were open and was actually drinking by itself, its wings were in the right place on its body. The bloody poop calmed down, and i fed it yogurt and crick crumbs, this morning its alert and walking but quite wobbly. No blood in poop this morning, it seems ok but is still not right.

this is her/him this morning. I am not sure whats wrong now. Maybe not cocci? Maybe worms? none detected in poop.