Color genetics thread.

[Wappoke]

Ok...any guesses? Bantam Orpington...this is all the info I know...
The pen the eggs came from is put together to produce chocolate(sex linked) silver birchen birds. There are silver based and gold based breeders. The pen has been known to throw mottled chicks occasionally. The owner said he "found out" one of the original hens for the project also somehow carried dun. I hatched all chocolate chicks except this one who was entirely yellow at hatch. Dun mottled maybe?

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The chicks down color would indicate the chick was dominant white or wheaten, The color in the chick would indicate the bird is carrying one dun allele or is chocolate (if it is a chocolate or dun color in the nonwhite areas) and may be mottled and according to the information, the E locus should be birchen. But the down is not birchen so the chick has to be wheaten.

The thing that is bothering me is the down color of the chick. If the chick was dominant white his feathers would be white- if the chick was wheaten, then there would be very little black pigment in the feathers (not the wing) coming in next to the wing and on the back. The chick has to be a melanized wheaten because the chick did not have birchen down. The chick could be dun but will have to wait and see; same for chocolate color.

The chick down color and your description of the pen parents makes this a real puzzle. It is possible the bird is a wheaten/birchen heterozygote. In this case, for some reason, the wheaten down color was dominant. Or two of your birds are split (heterozygous) for wheaten/birchen.

The first set of feathers on a bird are not always a good indicator of a phenotype- matching down color and adult plumage are better at determining genotype. Mottling ( small amounts) will sometimes show in juvenile plumage and disappear in adult plumage.

 

[Potoooooooo]

Hello there color experts! Does anyone know what would happen if a Spangled rooster were bred to a Mille Fleur hen? I've been guessing on some kind of half-spangling.

 

[ShadesofSable]

Hello there color experts! Does anyone know what would happen if a Spangled rooster were bred to a Mille Fleur hen? I've been guessing on some kind of half-spangling.

If I remember correctly, I think Millie fleur is spangled+mottled, so I would think all the chicks would come out spangled, split for mottled?

Someone correct me if that's wrong though!

 

[junebuggena]

Hello there color experts! Does anyone know what would happen if a Spangled rooster were bred to a Mille Fleur hen? I've been guessing on some kind of half-spangling.

Mille Fleur is caused by a recessive mottling gene, so all chicks would be carrying the gene but not express. Spangling is a complex pattern similar to lacing. It requires 3 different genes to be present for expression. Leave out just one, and you can get penciling or double lacing instead.

 

[Potoooooooo]

{Photo not mine}
@junebuggena @ShadesofSable
So, something like this I suppose?

 

[Wappoke]

{Photo not mine}
@junebuggena @ShadesofSable
So, something like this I suppose?

no,this bird is double laced

spangling is dependent upon birds carrying dark brown, pattern gene and melanotic with the E locus being birchen or brown,

when you cross a mille fluer which is columbian restricted, mottled and usually wheaten at the E locus- this will introduce genes that will cause the incomplete expression of single lacing- this will resemble spangling. most of the false spangling will show on the breast and will taper off toward the tail end of the bird

 

[Potoooooooo]

spangling is dependent upon birds carrying dark brown, pattern gene and melanotic with the E locus being birchen or brown,

when you cross a mille fluer which is columbian restricted and wheaten at the E locus- this will introduce genes that will cause the incomplete expression of single lacing- this will resemble spangling. most of the false spangling will show on the breast and will taper off toward the tail end of the bird

Wow! You learn something new everyday. Just as I'd predicted, some sort of false/half spangling. I'm trying to imagine that, perhaps I'll draw it. Thank you! Thank all of you for your contribution to my question. ^^

 

[Chicken5555]

(1) Is there a way to guess which female is the chick's mother by looking at the pictures? both of them lay nearly identical pale blue-green eggs.
(2) genetically, how did I get two chicks this color from these birds?
(3) how likely is it that I would get more chicks this color from these birds?
Thanks

The dad (wheaten Ameraucana)


One of these two is the mom...
white one was mostly yellow as a chick
blue one was classic easter egger chipmunk as a chick


two chicks just like this

 

[junebuggena]

(1) Is there a way to guess which female is the chick's mother by looking at the pictures? both of them lay nearly identical pale blue-green eggs.
(2) genetically, how did I get two chicks this color from these birds?
(3) how likely is it that I would get more chicks this color from these birds?
Thanks

The dad (wheaten Ameraucana)


One of these two is the mom...
white one was mostly yellow as a chick
blue one was classic easter egger chipmunk as a chick


two chicks just like this

Regardless of which hen those chicks came from, if that's the father, than those chicks are male. The chicks are silver base color. The rooster is not silver, therefore, it must have come from the mother. A silver hen can only pass her silver gene to her male offspring.

 

[Chicken5555]

Regardless of which hen those chicks came from, if that's the father, than those chicks are male. The chicks are silver base color. The rooster is not silver, therefore, it must have come from the mother. A silver hen can only pass her silver gene to her male offspring.

Fascinating. So they're both little cockerels. Does that mean silver is dominant over gold-based? What color hen do you think I should cross one of these little guys with next year to get silver colored female offspring?