Combining (or Adding to) my flock

[CoopedUpFamily]

So we have some guys that were born in March that are outside now. Exhibit A:

And we have these guys that are getting close. Exhibit B:

We have two seperate coops in the designated chicken area Exhibit C:

we have been putting out the little chickens in the brown coop during the daytime to get them used to being outside. We have let them mingle nearby only to have a couple hens attacked the little guys. Any suggestions on how to get them to coexist?

 

[Mrs. K]

You have a lot of birds for the space you have. This will make things pretty difficult, plus the littles you have are the fancy birds, they are are often picked on by full size standard birds, the crowded space will make that worse.

Both of the little coops are suitable for brooding chicks, not full size birds. Many of these pre-fab coops are darling and often state that they will hold 6 birds, but they won't. Birds kept in that tight of confinement are going to develop some very ugly behaviors.

I am counting 13 birds? And several of those birds still have more growing to do. I would want a coop that is 6 feet by 8 feet at a minimum for that number of birds. Letting them out of the assigned area does not allow you to cheat on the coop size. The long nights of winter are coming and they will spend most of that in a coop unless you are very far south. (Do put where you are on your status.)

If you cannot get a bigger coop, you need to sell some birds. You have got them up to the point of lay, and they should bring a fair price. In the two coops pictured I would not want more than 3 birds in each, so 6 birds all together.

With your space restrictions, I would not expect you to have an easy time of integrating the birds regardless of the tricks used.

Mrs K

 

[CoopedUpFamily]

You have a lot of birds for the space you have. This will make things pretty difficult, plus the littles you have are the fancy birds, they are are often picked on by full size standard birds, the crowded space will make that worse.

Both of the little coops are suitable for brooding chicks, not full size birds. Many of these pre-fab coops are darling and often state that they will hold 6 birds, but they won't. Birds kept in that tight of confinement are going to develop some very ugly behaviors.

I am counting 13 birds? And several of those birds still have more growing to do. I would want a coop that is 6 feet by 8 feet at a minimum for that number of birds. Letting them out of the assigned area does not allow you to cheat on the coop size. The long nights of winter are coming and they will spend most of that in a coop unless you are very far south. (Do put where you are on your status.)

If you cannot get a bigger coop, you need to sell some birds. You have got them up to the point of lay, and they should bring a fair price. In the two coops pictured I would not want more than 3 birds in each, so 6 birds all together.

With your space restrictions, I would not expect you to have an easy time of integrating the birds regardless of the tricks used.

Mrs K

The overall space we have for the coops is 16ft by 10ft. We do also have a wooden kids playhouse that we will probably convert into a coop additions if needed. There are 13 birds, however the younger ones were not sexed and chances are, only 2 or 3 will be staying. Not sure if perspective helps but at their current size, all 8 larger hens fit and sleep on one rail in the red coup. I do expect some cold winters here in New England.

 

[Mrs. K]

We might be talking at cross purposes, so just for clarity, the coop is the building where the birds sleep and sometime lay eggs. The area of confinement that the coop is in or attached to is the run.

You do have an adequate run. That is enough space for up to 15-16 full size full grown hens. I could be wrong, but what do the coops measure in footage? A common rule of thumb is 1 linear foot for each full grown bird for roosting space.

"At their current size all 8 roost together" those birds are not full size, by a long shot. They have quite a bit more growing to do. This forum is full of posts, where all of a sudden, birds that were raised together and allowed out of confinement for a spell each day, and who have never fought, begin to pick on one or two birds, literally trying to kill those birds so they have more space. The birds grow, the coop does not. What was enough space, is no longer.

I hate to rain on your parade, and if you can make it work, more power to you, and the strangest things DO Happen. But if they start picking feathers or leaving wounds, you will really need to do something sooner rather than later.

As to your original question, sometimes adding hideouts, platforms, roosts in the run, small walls where birds can get away from each other or out of sight of each other can really help. But the biggest issue for happy chickens is having the number and size of the birds fit the set up.

Being raised together or free time will not make up for over crowding in a coup.

Mrs K

 

[CoopedUpFamily]

The red coop is 43 inches high x 50.4 inches wide x 81.5 inches long. Inside has two opposing boxes.

Is having separate coops not ideal? We are new to this and are observing as much info as we can.

 

[Mrs. K]

A rule of thumb accepted here, and while not iron clad, it is a good place to start, when considering how much space in a building a flock should have is 4 square feet per bird. So if you are going to keep 10 birds x 4 square feet = 40 square feet. So you would need a coop that is 4 x 10 or 6 x 7 feet, not inches, you really need more of a shed like building for the number of birds that you have.

Then in the north, where winters are serious, you need about 15 inches of space above their heads when they are on the roost, not 15 inches from the roost to the ceiling. And you need space away from the walls. This allows the warm moist air to rise above them keeping them dry. Dry chickens are warm chickens, but they need space to keep dry. Good ventilation is the best thing for chickens to allow all that moisture to escape.

Imagine (or remember) being in a car in the winter with several people with the engine and heater turned off. Almost immediately the car fogs up because the cold on the outside makes the warm moisture filled air of breath condense. That is what you want to keep from happening to chickens.

It is so contrary to what people need, we think warm, close up the doors tight, keep the heat in, and that turn out to be nearly a guarantee for frostbite and poor health for chickens. They will be damp if they are too close to the ceiling and to the floor and to the walls. If they are damp, they are cold.

In South Dakota, by the first of December, my birds will be roosted up by 4:00. They will stay there all night until 7:30. They will spend a large part of the day in there in a blizzard, although mine do go out as I also have shelter in the run. That is a lot of time to spend too close together - ugly behaviors develop.

So those darling coops are just not big enough for full size birds, they do not have the space. The birds are both too close to the ceiling and to the floor, and as your birds get bigger, they will become more crowded. The more crowded, the bigger the manure problem. The bigger the manure problem the bigger the moisture problem.

Two coops are not the problem, it is the size of either coop and the number of birds that you have. IMO, you need either a larger coop, as in a more shed like building, or a lot less birds. I would not want to face the winter with those coops for anything less than a possible brooder for chicks. I would keep at least one of those coops, ideal for raising chicks, ideal for separating out a rooster if needed, but not as a real coop for a flock of birds.

I hope this helps. You can cheat in the summer, the birds are still smaller, the days are long, but come the fall, the number of birds needs to fit the size of the coop you have, and you really can't cheat. This is my opinion, I have had birds for 15 years, in somewhat similar climate for what it is worth.

Mrs K

 

[rosemarythyme]

Some people do have separate coops and make it work. The usual problem in many cases is you can't really control if the chickens will ALL want to stuff into one coop, or the other coop. While they're still young it's very likely that each group will return to the coop they're accustomed to, but that might change in the blink of an eye someday.

As to your original question, one issue with the common run space is a lack of clutter or hideouts for the birds to use. Mrs. K has a good thread on it: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/ Also you didn't mention how long the Silkies have been out in the brown coop... depending on how your other birds react, it can take a couple weeks of seeing, but not touching, before it's safe enough to open the door and allow interaction with supervision.

 

[aart]

Need a bigger coop for the older flock.

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