Commercial Poison (err... "Feed")

[Geena]

None of these other posters account for what would cause a flock to stop free ranging? Old hens - no winter eggs - possible. Old hens always free range in winter months.

My old girls don't, they have a pasture to themselves but in the winter if it's too cold, wet or windy they'll just go down and sit around under their favorite cedar tree all day. There's really very little for them to eat in the winter, so why bother.

I wouldn't consider no eggs from only three 3 year old hens all that odd. We get spoiled by all the eggs they give us for the first two years, but a severe decline around 3 is not unusual in my experience.

Could it be that the feed was old? Might have been several months old when you got it (always make sure to check the manufactured on date!) then I imagine it takes a long time for only 3 girls to go through a bag of feed.

 

[Huntmaster]

Just like to add some food for thought. With this feed conspiracy going on for so many months now and so many on both sides of the fence. How is there not any data on the bad feed other than what has been done that says the feed is what it says it is. With all the Anti-Government Anti Commercial Anti Purina how in so many months has there been no proven facts/lab tests to show anything is wrong with said feeds, lab tests are done fairly quick. There have been lab tests done from both sides of the fence and nothing nefarious has been found (That says a lot to me). If anyone does have proof that states something different other than anecdotal, please let us all know. But with one of the biggest conspiracy theorists with their own lab that would have loved to find something and unable to find anything with said feed and already moved on. I think it's time for all to move on and just feed your birds whatever you think is best for you and be done with all this.

 

[aart]

It was crazy HOT in June. What state are you in?

I was wondering too....many of the feed debaters leave this one variable out.

@Tango Charlie
Where in this world are you located?
Climate, and time of year, is almost always a factor.
Please add your general geographical location to your profile.
It's easy to do, and then it's always there!

 

[Brooks_]

I'm an educated, middle-class, engineer and family man, and am usually averse to conspiracy theories. HOWEVER… I’d recently come across multiple stories about how backyard chickens weren’t laying anymore, and I could relate. We have 3 girls about 3 years old and they all stopped laying last June (2022). The theory is that they’re (whoever “they” are) putting something in the feed. Vaccines for bird flu, vaccines for people… other more nefarious stuff? Poor quality ingredients for sake of profit? Who knows?

In addition to not laying, our chickens were lethargic, didn’t free-range when the door to the run was left open and just seemed “off”. The commercial “feed” was Dumor 16% Layer Formula from TSC.

So my wife and I mixed up a homemade feed of various corns, seeds, proteins, oyster shell & gravel, and the results are amazing! Within a week, they started to venture out of their run. Within 2 weeks they started “squatting and stomping” (a sure sign of fertility / productivity) which they also stopped doing completely.

3 weeks after purging their commercial “feed” we got our first egg in nearly EIGHT MONTHS! Now 4 weeks in, we’re getting eggs DAILY. I’m telling you all it’s as if they’ve woken up from an 8 month coma. More accurately “purging an 8 month poisoning”.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I'm an educated, middle-class, engineer and family man, and am usually averse to conspiracy theories. HOWEVER… I’d recently come across multiple stories about how backyard chickens weren’t laying anymore, and I could relate. We have 3 girls about 3 years old and they all stopped laying last June (2022). The theory is that they’re (whoever “they” are) putting something in the feed. Vaccines for bird flu, vaccines for people… other more nefarious stuff? Poor quality ingredients for sake of profit? Who knows?

In addition to not laying, our chickens were lethargic, didn’t free-range when the door to the run was left open and just seemed “off”. The commercial “feed” was Dumor 16% Layer Formula from TSC.

So my wife and I mixed up a homemade feed of various corns, seeds, proteins, oyster shell & gravel, and the results are amazing! Within a week, they started to venture out of their run. Within 2 weeks they started “squatting and stomping” (a sure sign of fertility / productivity) which they also stopped doing completely.

3 weeks after purging their commercial “feed” we got our first egg in nearly EIGHT MONTHS! Now 4 weeks in, we’re getting eggs DAILY. I’m telling you all it’s as if they’ve woken up from an 8 month coma. More accurately “purging an 8 month poisoning”.

What is your feed mix?

However "amazing" your results, its likely your feed mix isn't. Making a good mix for chickens is HARD. What were your targets for Protein, Fat, Amino Acid Profile, non-phytate phosphorus, key vitamins?

Also, I see you were briefly active on BYC roughly two years ago, then... nothing. Your first post back is titled "Commercial Poison". We should have seen you last spring on the Illness/Injury forum when your birds were lethargic and stopped laying. not after the fact peddling a theory based on "multiple stories".

 

[Ponyiqandhens2]

One definite difference people haven't mentioned is that his hens stopped laying in June. Definitely no winter issues there. At 3yo, they are just starting to see reduced egg laying, but still should be laying at a semi-regular pace. Interested to see where this goes.

BUT 3 year old hens,molt and winter 16% is just not high enough protein..every poultry textbook and scientific, peer reviewed article i can find says 17% is the bare minimum during laying season if allowing natural break, that it should be increased to 20-22% during molt etc.. i feed 20% nutrena naturewise all flock,22% gamebird chick starter when it was going to be 2-3 weeks to get my feed i got dumor 17% layer and 18% nutrena naturewise hearty hen mixed and added my normal lonestar chick starter to it..

My older hens free range well all do but as they get older the go furter intothe pastures, protein,lysine,methonine and cystine are vital

I would also question other changes, change inpest control companies,city spraying ( counties/parish mosquito spray programs- we had to file a request to not spray our ditches) crop dusting near, neighbors working nights instead of days ( nurses,ems,fire,police)..changes light pollution..but too low a protein level could certainely produce a low producing lethargic bird

 

[sdm111]

Awwwww geeze

 

[sdm111]

Please go read all the threads on this instead of starting a new thread.
Not one person on social media ran tests on the feed, just their mouths.
Most chickens who have been "poisoned" are covid chickens who reached 2 and 3 years old, so they don't lay their second or third winter or they've reached henopause. chickens stop laying for late summer molting, go into winter break and wait for needed 14 hours of daylight to lay. It's been unusually dark and cold this winter everywhere.
If you want to mix your own feed, this is a great place to research that but what is the approximate analysison your mix? It's hard to come up with a decent feed, especially if your source the recipe off the internet.
Imo, 16% layer isn't good enough for your modern dual purpose hens.
Tldr, nothings wrong with the feed, just tinhat Tony and homesteader Barbie who never bothered to educate themselves on the reproductive process in chickens blaming the feed for normal breaks in the lay cycle and running their fool mouths.
It's been dark, too dark to activate the pinal gland that controls laying, your hens were likely molting and taking awhile to come out of it as 16% protein isn't enough period, let alone during the molt. Find a good 18-20% feed.
First & third posts in this thread:
" https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/feed-tests-more-results.1565804/
This thread, posts 6, 10, 12, 14, 18, 22
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...en-feed-craze-posted-testing-results.1564737/
Post 581 of this thread (I think this link will go straight to it; same feed as the one just above)
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...-to-be-analyzed.1561749/page-59#post-26554912
This is the thread comparing feed labels (spoiler: not much changed.) The labels are sprinkled throughout many pages, so this one isn't a quick read. I doubt your client will care about this one, as she probably assumes they changed the feed but not the label.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/current-internet-theory.1561604/
As regards your client wanting something "better" for her chickens, maybe suggest that she try a particular kind of other feed. For example, "maybe you should give your hens chick starter instead, with a separate dish of oyster shell. They wouldn't bother to add an anti-laying ingredient to chick starter"

Daylight is the key factor, it was dark everywhere this winter, also stress, illness, lack of protein, newbie owners from covid not understanding lay/molt cycles... just a perfect storm of situations which a few 'influencers' exploited to make people hysterical and get views.
Byc is the biggest peer reviewed fowl website there is, if someone has bad info, it will be questioned, tested and proven. This is where there are some very smart people with decades of experience, who do scientific research on every aspect of bird keeping; people who can walk you through the process scientifically. ;]

THIS! read, read oh and READ

 

[ChickyMudder]

My old girls don't, they have a pasture to themselves but in the winter if it's too cold, wet or windy they'll just go down and sit around under their favorite cedar tree all day. There's really very little for them to eat in the winter, so why bother.

I wouldn't consider no eggs from only three 3 year old hens all that odd. We get spoiled by all the eggs they give us for the first two years, but a severe decline around 3 is not unusual in my experience.

Could it be that the feed was old? Might have been several months old when you got it (always make sure to check the manufactured on date!) then I imagine it takes a long time for only 3 girls to go through a bag of feed.

Seemed like the poster ruled out old birds but old feed coukd be a factor.
I just assume we all know that egg production declines in winter snd after the second year. But this sounded like a complete halt. No eggs for 8 months. Then with a feed change the birds began producing again. Seems logical to look at the feed.

 

[Huntmaster]

Seems logical to look at the feed.

Looking at feed is one thing calling it Commercial Poison is another.