- Aug 8, 2013
- 256
- 22
- 108
Haha, I can see why it's entertaining.
I'm the same way. Moderation is key. And yes, BOSS is great. We gave BOSS to our birds last year and they really liked them. Good luck with your birds!
Corn
- Thread starter TheChickenQueen
- Start date
I'm the same way. Moderation is key. And yes, BOSS is great. We gave BOSS to our birds last year and they really liked them. Good luck with your birds!
<sigh> If I soaked the BOSS before I gave it to my chickens they'd have bigger problems than fibrous shells.....they'd be trying to figure out how to eat the giant Sunflower Seed Popsicle I just put in their run! Soaked food and -12 degrees just don't go together.
I dunno. I've been following this and have reached a monumental conclusion! If you like to feed corn and do it moderation, then continue. If you don't like the idea of feeding corn, then don't. I don't know if a little corn at night helps chickens stay warmer or not. Obviously some say "yes", some say "no." But I do know that if it makes a dedicated chicken owner sleep a little better at night thinking that they've done all they can for their birds' comfort over a long, cold night, then the two minutes it takes to toss some out seems well worth it.
At the risk of adding fuel to the fire here, after almost 64 years on this planet I've come to realize that no matter which side of an argument or discussion folks are on, they can always cite a finding, a study, a research paper, passage in a book or magazine or, especially in this day and age, on the internet, which supports their position. The trick to thorough research is to seek out and find neutral sources - those which present all sides of a position in one spot. Admittedly they are hard to find but as a professional writer who strives for accuracy in the columns I write, I know that they do exist. Then, based on all of the information, form your own conclusion but realize that you are rarely going to change someone else's mind. You might be able to add to their storehouse of information, but if they have their own conclusion firmly entrenched then it becomes the better part of valor to leave them to it. The same with yours - if you have it written in stone in your mind then no amount of discussion to the contrary will chip away at that stone. And that's all okay - it's what makes us who we are.
If there was only one "correct" way to raise chickens, then this entire forum could be read in a half hour - both pages of it. The very size of this forum and the diversity of people using and contributing to it shows the opposite. The key to learning, and the path to good teaching, is to remain open minded and respect the experience and opinions of others. The key to the wealth of information and opinion here at BYC is our unique ability to sort through, try what seems like it might work in our situations, or choose to ignore it and go on the next thing.
Now, if you'll excuse me I'll just to back to my neutral corner.
I dunno. I've been following this and have reached a monumental conclusion! If you like to feed corn and do it moderation, then continue. If you don't like the idea of feeding corn, then don't. I don't know if a little corn at night helps chickens stay warmer or not. Obviously some say "yes", some say "no." But I do know that if it makes a dedicated chicken owner sleep a little better at night thinking that they've done all they can for their birds' comfort over a long, cold night, then the two minutes it takes to toss some out seems well worth it.
At the risk of adding fuel to the fire here, after almost 64 years on this planet I've come to realize that no matter which side of an argument or discussion folks are on, they can always cite a finding, a study, a research paper, passage in a book or magazine or, especially in this day and age, on the internet, which supports their position. The trick to thorough research is to seek out and find neutral sources - those which present all sides of a position in one spot. Admittedly they are hard to find but as a professional writer who strives for accuracy in the columns I write, I know that they do exist. Then, based on all of the information, form your own conclusion but realize that you are rarely going to change someone else's mind. You might be able to add to their storehouse of information, but if they have their own conclusion firmly entrenched then it becomes the better part of valor to leave them to it. The same with yours - if you have it written in stone in your mind then no amount of discussion to the contrary will chip away at that stone. And that's all okay - it's what makes us who we are.
If there was only one "correct" way to raise chickens, then this entire forum could be read in a half hour - both pages of it. The very size of this forum and the diversity of people using and contributing to it shows the opposite. The key to learning, and the path to good teaching, is to remain open minded and respect the experience and opinions of others. The key to the wealth of information and opinion here at BYC is our unique ability to sort through, try what seems like it might work in our situations, or choose to ignore it and go on the next thing.
Now, if you'll excuse me I'll just to back to my neutral corner.
Last edited:
- Aug 8, 2013
- 256
- 22
- 108
Hi there. I completely agree with you. There is no one-way to correctly raise an animal. I personally think corn is a great treat, but I don't think it would make a good staple diet. Just my opinion though. I was here to help Honey Bee, not to argue over corn. It's kinda a dumb argument lol.<sigh> If I soaked the BOSS before I gave it to my chickens they'd have bigger problems than fibrous shells.....they'd be trying to figure out how to eat the giant Sunflower Seed Popsicle I just put in their run! Soaked food and -12 degrees just don't go together.
I dunno. I've been following this and have reached a monumental conclusion! If you like to feed corn and do it moderation, then continue. If you don't like the idea of feeding corn, then don't. I don't know if a little corn at night helps chickens stay warmer or not. Obviously some say "yes", some say "no." But I do know that if it makes a dedicated chicken owner sleep a little better at night thinking that they've done all they can for their birds' comfort over a long, cold night, then the two minutes it takes to toss some out seems well worth it.
At the risk of adding fuel to the fire here, after almost 64 years on this planet I've come to realize that no matter which side of an argument or discussion folks are on, they can always cite a finding, a study, a research paper, passage in a book or magazine or, especially in this day and age, on the internet, which supports their position. The trick to thorough research is to seek out and find neutral sources - those which present all sides of a position in one spot. Admittedly they are hard to find but as a professional writer who strives for accuracy in the columns I write, I know that they do exist. Then, based on all of the information, form your own conclusion but realize that you are rarely going to change someone else's mind. You might be able to add to their storehouse of information, but if they have their own conclusion firmly entrenched then it becomes the better part of valor to leave them to it. The same with yours - if you have it written in stone in your mind then no amount of discussion to the contrary will chip away at that stone. And that's all okay - it's what makes us who we are.
If there was only one "correct" way to raise chickens, then this entire forum could be read in a half hour - both pages of it. The very size of this forum and the diversity of people using and contributing to it shows the opposite. The key to learning, and the path to good teaching, is to remain open minded and respect the experience and opinions of others. The key to the wealth of information and opinion here at BYC is our unique ability to sort through, try what seems like it might work in our situations, or choose to ignore it and go on the next thing.
Now, if you'll excuse me I'll just to back to my neutral corner.
Observations / Suggestions to Consider in This Discussion
A. No control over intake - Provide a few birds piles of shell corn, BOSS, oats, millet, formulated layer pellets and chick starter, dark greens, green grapes, dried meal worms and live meal worms. You will observe live mealworms will likely be eaten first, followed by dry meal worms. If piles large enough, then even the live mealworms will only be consumed so long before birds stop. To keep price down on live mealworms buy them in lots of 5,000. With unlimited access to meal worms then chickens will after a couple of days begin consuming other items at the expense of even the live mealworms. Multiple days may be required to get a stable balance with respect to piles of what is ingested. Weight may vary short-term but will likely stabilize at near starting point with birds in food flight / fighting weight. Control for breeding status and use adults.
B. Provide three in excess pile treatments - 1) Formulated feed only, 2) shell corn only, and 3) formulated feed and shell corn. Determine amounts consumed of each. Do a quick estimate of caloric intake for each treatment. Also do a quick estimate of protein intake. Results may vary greatly with temperature which is what I see.
C. Hot Feeds - High in protein requiring lots of liver and kidney function to transform excess amino acids / protein into carbohydrates and fat while detoxifying the resultant ammonia and excreting it as uric acid.
D. Heat Increment - Heat produced in association with digestion, transport, storage and transformation of carbohydrates. This process is particularly high with carbohydrate reach foods that are rapidly digested. Starchy foods are rapid while fibers such as cellulose are slow even though both are carbohydrates. All meals result in a heat increment although its impact on core temperature most readily detectable on larger animals such as cattle although we may be able to appreciate it as well.
E. Smaller animals like chickens I do not think benefit from the heat increment for staying warm. Impacts on staying warm likely to come from what is suggested by results of experiment B above.
F. The science with livestock, especially with poultry, has done little to explore how animals adjust intake when they have the ability to choose between feed types. Especially when temperatures deviate from optimal usually realized under commercial conditions for which information is developed to support.
A. No control over intake - Provide a few birds piles of shell corn, BOSS, oats, millet, formulated layer pellets and chick starter, dark greens, green grapes, dried meal worms and live meal worms. You will observe live mealworms will likely be eaten first, followed by dry meal worms. If piles large enough, then even the live mealworms will only be consumed so long before birds stop. To keep price down on live mealworms buy them in lots of 5,000. With unlimited access to meal worms then chickens will after a couple of days begin consuming other items at the expense of even the live mealworms. Multiple days may be required to get a stable balance with respect to piles of what is ingested. Weight may vary short-term but will likely stabilize at near starting point with birds in food flight / fighting weight. Control for breeding status and use adults.
B. Provide three in excess pile treatments - 1) Formulated feed only, 2) shell corn only, and 3) formulated feed and shell corn. Determine amounts consumed of each. Do a quick estimate of caloric intake for each treatment. Also do a quick estimate of protein intake. Results may vary greatly with temperature which is what I see.
C. Hot Feeds - High in protein requiring lots of liver and kidney function to transform excess amino acids / protein into carbohydrates and fat while detoxifying the resultant ammonia and excreting it as uric acid.
D. Heat Increment - Heat produced in association with digestion, transport, storage and transformation of carbohydrates. This process is particularly high with carbohydrate reach foods that are rapidly digested. Starchy foods are rapid while fibers such as cellulose are slow even though both are carbohydrates. All meals result in a heat increment although its impact on core temperature most readily detectable on larger animals such as cattle although we may be able to appreciate it as well.
E. Smaller animals like chickens I do not think benefit from the heat increment for staying warm. Impacts on staying warm likely to come from what is suggested by results of experiment B above.
F. The science with livestock, especially with poultry, has done little to explore how animals adjust intake when they have the ability to choose between feed types. Especially when temperatures deviate from optimal usually realized under commercial conditions for which information is developed to support.
- Thread starter
- #35
Okay, I think I will just continue giving the flock some of their scratch after they have been but in the coop for the night. And by the sounds of it I should really get my hands on some BOSS.
For your intent, corn would be more cost effective although I would still mix it with other feed stuffs such as BOSS. My cold weather supplemental mix is dominated by corn, oats and millet but does have a good amount of BOSS as well.
- Thread starter
- #37
My scratch has a lot of corn in it. Unfortunately I do not know what all of the grains in it are though
The way I explain this to people is that yes corn like any other food will generate heat while being digested, but corn digest a lot faster than a high protein feed mix, thus any additional heat corn might generate during digesting is not sustained for any length of time, while on the other hand a high protein feed will generate near if equal amounts of heat and it will be sustained much longer...
What this means is that if you feed a lot of corn the birds might very well be 'warmer' for the first few hours, but that is temporary and will burn out in short as the digestion duration is shorter, it's real similar to a sugar high that is followed by a crash... On the other hand a high protein balanced feed will provide a steady level of heater heat (over low protein feed) all night... IMO it's better to avoid the highs and lows that an excess of corn can introduce and aim for the sustained and level generation of 'digestive' heat...
Either way my coop is moderately heated holding 37° overnight right now, with outside temps in the 20°s overnight, so for me I don't fret over feed changes during the winter...
What this means is that if you feed a lot of corn the birds might very well be 'warmer' for the first few hours, but that is temporary and will burn out in short as the digestion duration is shorter, it's real similar to a sugar high that is followed by a crash... On the other hand a high protein balanced feed will provide a steady level of heater heat (over low protein feed) all night... IMO it's better to avoid the highs and lows that an excess of corn can introduce and aim for the sustained and level generation of 'digestive' heat...
Either way my coop is moderately heated holding 37° overnight right now, with outside temps in the 20°s overnight, so for me I don't fret over feed changes during the winter...
No label? If no label check the manufactures website... Like many things the mix can vary by season depending on cost of whatever grains, so a lot of manufactures fail to provide a label on the bag... Most scratch is high in corn (50% or more) and millet, with a few other grains tossed in light wheat or rye...
Normal crop function disperses the digest process over time. Compare crop emptying pattern as a function of dietary protein level. You will not see a pattern that correlates well with protein content. Then compare rate to dietary energy level.
Similar threads
New posts New threads Active threads
-
Threads with more replies in the last 15 days
-
Checking-In On Peeps - Post Here To Say Hello!- Started by Nifty-Chicken
- Replies: 2K
-
What’s the deal with you chicken people??- Started by z3lda3
- Replies: 347
-
-
Open Contest May Madness, a Random Funny Posting Contest- Started by casportpony
- Replies: 281
-
-
