Death by dusting?

[dlhunicorn]

actually ... yes I can say with a fair amount of certainty that the cases I spoke of were where they correctly followed the advised regimen etc. ... and because the word "prevention" was used , the people just never considered the possibility of worms thus they first tried different antibiotics and such which they would not have done if they were not so convinced beforehand of DE and its claims to "prevention"...this is my main concern. Use it by all means (I doubt it can harm and it does seem to firm up the poos) just be aware that if your bird becomes ill and you are on a DE regime that it CAN be worms.

 

[Chicken_Lover]

Cleanliness is an important factor and it sounds like most use the deep litter method, which is not very clean. I can't stress enough how important this is as part of the equation. Manure is not healthy for any mammal to live in.
Cleanliness can be open to interpretation. Ever walk into someone's house and thought 'how do they live like pigs?' and owners thought it was normal/clean?

Personally, I have never read anyone explaining their DE regiment, only they use it or don't use it.

I don't know how many posts I have read that people didn't know how to calculate 2% (or quoted the incorrect calculation/amount). Under 2% doesn't do the job, more than 2% doesn't hurt but is wasteful.

 

[SandraChick]

Quote:
well...I have posted my regimen and have also been clear about the fact that it's a personal decision, better used as a preventative or mild cases of worms and that I go with the route of an ounce of prevention is worth a pound (or ton) of cure.

My regimen-
--add food grade DE to feed at ~2-3% by weight (keeps it bug free, keeps it dry (no mold)- this however is not enough for my chickens as they freerange and eat VERY LITTLE feed overall. I know this addresses the "under 2% doesn't do the job" as I see it's not effective unless I give more.
--add food grade DE to treats daily to equate to ~1tsp per chicken, 2-3tsp per chicken if any have runny poops
--add food grade DE to bedding, roost, favorite dust bathing spots every 2-3 weeks

I also give DE to my dogs/cats and have seen marked improvement in my elder dog whom vets failed to help for over 10years...but if you want that story- you'll have to pm me.

I'd like to test DE on my own- in a scientific manner over a long enough period of time. I first need more property so I can have two separate areas for my control and test areas. In the meantime, i'm going to learn how to do fecal float tests.

What I do know is that when I run out of DE (i have to order it online)--i start to see problems with my birds poos and so I know it's doing something beneficial. That's enough for me.

My biggest issue is the lack of separation between food grade and Pool use/garden use DE. Garden use DE is often mixed with other things especial perythrin. Pool grade has been altered through heat. Even the article posted by bigzio doesn't separate issued between the two. It's like comparing apples and bananas....they're both fruit--one for me keeps the doctor away....the other one sends me to the doctor with hives......

I applaud all who have kept this DE conversation as an informative, well behaved, adult conversation/debate. As Dianna mentioned....I won't be going into another "DE war", but I'll stay in a discussion!

Sandra

 

[Barnyard Dawg]

I use a food grade DE I purchase from http://www.freshwaterorganics.com/. I have used it myself I have taken as much as 2 tablespoon a day now I usually take a teaspoon in warm water once a day. I have noticed many beneficial results with its use and will continue to use it. My oldest Labrador Retriever had Old Dog Syndrome or Canine Cognitive Dysfunction (CDS) which is a memory-related disorder that is not unlike Alzheimer's disease at the age of 9 today she is 14 now and has survived cancer. She would frequently stare off into space or walk in circles and have difficulty eating. Today she looks wonderful she has exhibited no signs of confusion, no staring off or the grazed eyes. She was overweight and my vet had told me not to worry just give her a good life and spoil her, well today her weight is just where it should be. I feed her and my younger 4-year-old lab DE twice a day with their food as a supplement. I feed my chickens DE twice a day and so far have not had any problems or health concerns. I also dust the coop and clean it daily of any droppings to keep it as clean as possible, I will turn the wood shavings and dust the floor and the outside pen once a week. . My results on myself are what convince me that there were some benefits of DE to many to be just a coincidence

http://www.freshwaterorganics.com/our theory.doc

 

[Barnyard Dawg]

Quote:
The microscopic shells in Diatomaceous Earth (DE) are composed of Silicon Dioxide and around 14 trace minerals. Being formed under water, they will not dissolve in Water. In fact, even in the stomach of animals or birds, surrounded with powerful digestive juices, they pass all the way through the body almost complete. A very small amount is leached out. As it passes through the stomach and intestinal tract, a number of important things happen. '-These happenings occur as physical actions, not CHEMICAL, not NUTRITIONAL. - JUST PHYSICAL! AND SAFE!

Because of the strong charge, each shell can absorb a large number of positively charged substances, whether they be chemical or in the form of bacteria or viruses, They pass on through the stomach and intestine, taking these harmful substances out of the body.

In today's world, most all food, (animal or human), all water and air contains harmful substances, which taken internally causes stress on the immune system, using energy that could go for the production of milk or meat, For example, `'Dr, Johnson, a Canadian Veterinarian, discovered that DE absorbs the bacteria causing "scours", takes them out of the body and the animal is protected from unnecessary stress and possible death.

Passing through the digestive system, it rubs against parasites, and being 'very abrasive, causes serious damage causing the parasite to die and pass out of the animial with no negative side effects, The effect on the animal is nothing but beneficial.

Most living creatures are in contact with parasite eggs and toxic substances on a daily basis. Kill parasites today, yet pick up additional eggs at the same time, Damage is done and energy is lost until the next worming process.

Having FOSSIL SHELL FLOUR in the diet every day tends to keep the animal free of parasites and toxic chemicals, so that he can get maximum benefits from the food and water he consumes, Vet bills tend to reduce around 75%,

 

[Barnyard Dawg]

Quote:
I use a respirator/dust mask for spreading dry DE.

 

[SandraChick]

Barnyard....

Do you have links or references? I think I 'm going to start my own little DE library, as I think many folks need more "proof". As a scientist, I understand that.....As a pragmatist, for me the proof is in the pudding....I've seen positive results in my animals.

Sandra

 

[Barnyard Dawg]

Quote:
Sandra here is some interesting reading this article is on DE and Bentonite Clay, 44 pages.

http://www.environmentsensitive.com/40.pdf

 

[kstaven]

I have read this topic from beginning to end and would have to say that no matter if you chemical worm or use DE, if your chickens live in filth no product will safe guard them or you. Preventative measures can go a long ways, but it must be accompanied by cleanliness and a decent diet.

Also ... if an animal not in the best of health the internal parasites can flourish to the point where nothing will stop them. Be it natural or chemical.

Just my opinions.

 

[kstaven]

As a further note. One must remember that even a dietary defieciencey can cause a swing in the intestinal flaura that will allow unwanted bacteria to flourish and create the ideal environment for parasites to flourish. So even if a bird dies from parasites or worms it could always be nothing more than a symptom of another problem. So without a full necropsy it would be impossible to tell if the preventative measures used truly failed or not.