Deep litter method

[Arielle]

Quote: Do I leave the bottom few inches? Or the top few inches at clean out?

 

[jamband]

Do I leave the bottom few inches? Or the top few inches at clean out?

remove top couple, set aside, clean all else out, use old top as new bottom

 

[Arielle]

Quote: Now I understand, many thanks.

 

[Beekissed]

I have read thru a few of the posts and I'm confused on one basic point. If the bedding is designed to keep the chickens warm in the winter that requires the littler to be moist for decomp; dry bedding will not decompose. What am I missing?

Ventilation...that's the missing component to your thought processes.

Yes, the bedding is moist but not sopping. Ventilation moves the humidity released by this decomposition out of the coop while the bedding is constantly creating heat. Ever placed your hand in the middle of a good compost pile? It's hot and steamy. This isn't a good thing in a closed in coop but the steamy part gets wicked away in a coop with good air flow and the heat part is a constant, so though it is getting wicked away also, it is still warmer than a bare floor or floor with just fluffy, dry bedding. The top layer of this bedding isn't moist but you can plunge your hand in and feel the moist warmth of the under lying layers.

I let my chickens aerate that bedding, even down into the deepest layers, to remove that moisture and release it to the air...where it is removed by good air flow. Some moisture=good. Too much built up moisture=bad....grows mold and keeps the coop environment too steamy and moist. I live in the mountains, so the humidity levels are high but the air flow is high also..I make use of both of these things to produce deep litter that is decomposing well, creating some warmth but isn't keeping too moist bedding underfoot and under their noses all the time.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: I totally agree that ventilation is ALWAYS very important.

My concern is if that much ventilation is necessary because the composting process is producing noxious gases ( for lack of a better description) how does this method benefit the chickens? I see how it benefits the keeper with less time spent on the bedding issues; but it makes me wonder about the chickens.

THe dry method is quite dusty , or it can be, may need a little misting. So this is dry and not a heat issue or gas issue for the birds. But it is not decomposing either.

I'm thinking it might be valueable in an open pen also, 4 sides open, like a grow out pen.

Hoping you have some answers for me Bee kissed.

 

[Beekissed]

I totally agree that ventilation is ALWAYS very important.

My concern is if that much ventilation is necessary because the composting process is producing noxious gases ( for lack of a better description) how does this method benefit the chickens? I see how it benefits the keeper with less time spent on the bedding issues; but it makes me wonder about the chickens.

THe dry method is quite dusty , or it can be, may need a little misting. So this is dry and not a heat issue or gas issue for the birds. But it is not decomposing either.

I'm thinking it might be valueable in an open pen also, 4 sides open, like a grow out pen.

Hoping you have some answers for me Bee kissed.

There shouldn't be noxious gases from regular composting...merely heat and water. If there is odor or ammonia gases, it is not being managed properly. Ventilation/aeration can prevent any build-up of ammonia levels. Actually that amount of ventilation is necessary for a healthy coop environment anyway, whether using deep litter or not. One can never have too much good ventilation in a coop, even in colder climes.

The main benefit of deep litter is not warmth for the chickens..that is a mere pleasant side effect. The main benefit is healthy microbial presence in the coop environment....good bacteria and fungal growth that can hold in check the growth and presence of more harmful pathogens. Just as healthy compost adds healthy microorganisms to the soil that can combat less beneficial bacteria and mold growth, so it can do the same in your coop environment...particularly for those chickens that don't get to free range on a regular basis and also in the winter, when healthy soils are covered with a snow layer or frozen.

Balance is the key in keeping healthy animals and deep litter can add to an already healthy, balanced environment or it can bring balance to one that has not been developed properly.

If you are starting out and not adept at creating balance, deep litter is more work than just raking out the coop every other day. If you get the hang of how it should feel, smell and appear, then it becomes very easy to maintain. Deep litter isn't just used so it will be "less time spent on bedding issues" because, in truth, no bedding is even necessary....none at all. I spent years of having chickens without adding bedding to the coop and didn't see the necessity in it. It's far easier to not fool with bedding at all.

But then my mind turned toward creating a balanced environment...not only out in my free range area but also in the coop. What I read about deep litter really opened the door for me to utilize that space in the coop, not only as a petri dish for good microbial growth that promotes good health, but also as a place to cook up a better additive to my garden soil. I'm always a fan of decreasing stress and work load and deep litter seemed like a great way to better use the chicken droppings, promote better health in my flock and also have a constant source of composted material for the garden....one that I didn't mind if the chickens scattered the materials...in fact, I got to encourage that they scratch through the compost.

It's a win/win situation for me and my healthy flock shows the benefits of it. The fact that the roos never get frosted tips on their combs any longer is just icing on the cake. Since frost bite is attributed to, not merely cold weather, but also to moist conditions in the coop, having deep litter actually decrease the incidence of frost bite shows me that excess moisture is not a problem in my deep litter system.

 

[Arielle]

Let me recap and see if I have the facts right.

Decomposing material adds warmth and very little moisture; the microbes are the healthy ones that keep the pathogenic types in check.

In these summer months when the weather is hot and humid already, should I skip this method until the cooler weather of September? I see my birds already panting as they head to the roosts at night and last night I did not lock them up as the full door is solid. (THe back has a 18" x 5 rat wire panel the width of the coop; and the front ( 2 solid doors) has rat wire across the top 8"x5 feet.). Not enough breeze in the summer months, I think.

My crew free ranges mostly; with an open topped run if need be ( though many have figured out how to fly over the top! LOL

If you can think of anything else I should know on the subject, feel free to enlighten me.

 

[Beekissed]

Let me recap and see if I have the facts right.

Decomposing material adds warmth and very little moisture; the microbes are the healthy ones that keep the pathogenic types in check.

Actually, it adds a lot of moisture...thus the need for ventilation. But the proper ratio of carbonaceous material to the nitrogen of the manure will result in less moisture/odor produced, thus the reason for adding bedding when it's appropriate to do so. Add bedding, aerate to release moisture pockets underneath every once in awhile, monitor for odors(there shouldn't be any...just an earthy, soil-like smell)

In these summer months when the weather is hot and humid already, should I skip this method until the cooler weather of September? I see my birds already panting as they head to the roosts at night and last night I did not lock them up as the full door is solid. (THe back has a 18" x 5 rat wire panel the width of the coop; and the front ( 2 solid doors) has rat wire across the top 8"x5 feet.). Not enough breeze in the summer months, I think.

I don't skip it...and neither do true proponents of this method...the heat of summer speeds the composting process and the open air style of summer coops also helps whisk away heat and moisture. My birds don't hang around the coop during summer months unless laying or roosting...neither of these activities take place on the floor. This deep litter isn't like a sauna bath for birds, with constant steam rising into the air and naked roosters in towels wilting on benches along the walls...

If it is then, again, your coop isn't ventilated enough. I can't stress enough the need for light and airy coops for healthy flocks.

My crew free ranges mostly; with an open topped run if need be ( though many have figured out how to fly over the top! LOL

If you can think of anything else I should know on the subject, feel free to enlighten me.

In the end, no amount of explaining is going to convince you that any one method is right for you and your coop....one must just try it. Give it a really good, intelligent try through changing seasons and see if it's something you find that benefits your methods/chickens. If not, then drop it. If so, hurray!

 

[Arielle]

Quote: hAaaahaaa, no you convinced about 2 posts back, I"m just looking for some details for the best sucess! THANK YOU.

 

[SadieT]

Love your name! I'm clueless, don't know about confident