Developing My Own Breed Of Large Gamefowl For Free Range Survival (Junglefowl x Liege)

[jurassicfish]

Interesting project. I myself have a few plans for my RJF/hybrid hens.View attachment 2381031This is one of them.

I may be interested in chicks. I can’t figure out how to pm on this site. You can pm me.

 

[jurassicfish]

also when one of us gets the book we should write a review
https://www.backyardchickens.com/reviews/categories/chicken-products-supplies.1/

I read Bullfrogs book. It is well written and worth the read.

 

[MysteryChicken]

I may be interested in chicks. I can’t figure out how to pm on this site. You can pm me.

Pm is the Start Conversation button when you select on a person.

My JungleFowl are done breeding for the season.

 

[ctrundy]

Where do we get the Cracker eggs?

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

Where do we get the Cracker eggs?

I haven’t been offering them in a long while. I’ve been working on increasing their size while maintaining their traits otherwise. If I ever get them where I want my line to be as a breed, I am considering letting selected trios out to breeders across the country and giving the breeders my blessing to sell them at low cost. I’m not interested in making money off of their propegagion. I simply want then readily available.

 

[Turkey chicken]

I'm creating this thread as a journal for a breeding project I've been planning for some time. I would like to take my small junglefowl hybrids that I've been raising for the last year and a half and increase their size and attitude substantially. They've already proven themselves to be great survivors in the predator-dense Florida woods. But they're very small and their practical use for meat and eggs is limited. Not totally non-existant, but not ideal. I'd like to have a larger version that's three times the size and has some more anti-predator fire. A bird that can respond to a predator in other ways besides simply being agile and avoiding being caught. To some degree, this bird already exists in the American gamefowl (albeit not as large as I'm imagining). But I want to utilize my junglefowl which have proven their hardiness. I've been compiling genetic materials over the past year and refining my junglefowl. Here's where' I'm starting:

1. My junglefowl hybrids. Their info is located in this thread:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...ngle-fowl-in-the-american-deep-south.1309995/

Here is my chosen bullstag to sire my F1s:

View attachment 2380952

I have many junglefowl hybrid stags, but this one is my favorite that has survived two major rounds of culling. He has an athletic build and good feathering and so far I like his attitude. Human aggression was a problem in my first generation birds that I've seemed to have purged from the next generation. Of course only further generations will tell for sure. I call this bullstag "Number 1" because of a picture in which I labeled him "1" of several stags.

2. The Liege. I obtained 3 quality Liege pullets just recently. Originally I was going to avoid using the Liege in my project, but I've been so impressed with them I think they'll suit my purposes fine for my F1s. I actually wasn't expecting to find Liege on a farm near me, but low and behold I was surprised. Big thanks to hydlemour and Didby57. I don't yet have good pictures of the pullets, but this afternoon I took a quick video of one of the pullets right after a rainstorm in the breeding coop I'm going to keep them with until I get a hatch from them and Number 1.

I want to see how much of the JF traits will pass on to the F1s. So far the JF traits seem to dominate anything I cross them to, including leghorns, Wyandottes, and OEGB. The Wyandotte cross I have running around is the first one I've produced that involved breeding the JF to something other than a straight comb. I presume that I'm going to lose the straight comb on these F1s, but I suppose that also depends on what is floating around in the background of the Liege.

I have aseel on my farm I'm keeping in my back pocket in case I need to breed more fire into them, but I also understand that may introduce a whole slew of other traits I may not want. My brother is going to undertake a project crossing aseel to both Liege and the JF, so we'll compare notes on our F1s to see what we like best. My original plan was to use the aseel for my F1s to the JF, but my choosen strain of aseel isn't showing the size I want. I'm guessing the aseel I have are going to top out around 5lbs at the most. I also have access to some straight Americans if I decide the next gen needs them.

I'm thinking to get the look somewhat close to what I want, its going to take junglefowl x Liege, then Junglefowl x F1. I should get some straight combs on the next gen. It will depend on how much size will be sacrificed on the next gen of crosses. Of course, if I like the F1s right off the bat, I'll formulate a plan to lock the traits in.

I'd love for my final bird to look mostly like my JF hybrids just much bigger. But I also want a functional bird first and foremost so selection for appearance is secondary. A definite must is for my final bird to be able to launch itself high up into a tree to roost. I basically want the final bird to do anything a wild turkey can. I have a few JF stags with abnormally large wings I may have to cross in. I can see a definite difference in vertical take off between the birds with very large wings and those with normal wings. All of them can fly up to roost fine but the big winged birds can shoot straight up into a large pine to the branches of their choosing in the first flight. That's going to take bigger wings on the Liege and also shaving a few pounds off.

Hey I sent you a conversation thing. Love you videos

 

[Three Mound High Fowl]

I’ve been following you for a long time Florida Bullfrog and absolutely love your work! I accidentally landed on you YouTube channel a few years back and have watched pretty much all your content regarding chickens more times than I’d like to admit As yourself I started have domestic chicken breeds and quickly wanted to have strong survival chickens and a more feral flock with similar traits to what you’re after. However im located in Scandinavia where the winters are harsh with snow, so I obviously had to adjust my breeding program quite a bit.

I invested a lot of time and money in pure liege fighters from Liege in Belgium, OEGBs and Icelandics but was wondering what you would recommend me?

I’ve bought your book and to say I am enjoying reading it would be quite the understatement! I can’t help but notice that you mention your friend and fellow chicken-survivalist-enthusiast Travis Hughes. You mention that he has chickens that without problems and without human intervention, thrive through snowy winters and that of course caught my attention! Can you somehow connect me or at least give me an introduction to how he got started with the different breeds he is using?

I’m planning on making a thread myself here on BYC to discuss the “rebirth” of a hypothetical European Junglefowl (Gallus europaeus) that I’m trying to breed. I have an Facebook group with all my progress and weekly updates where i more in depth discuss my plans and so on.

Sorry for the long post! Keep up the good work, you’re a huge inspiration!

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

I’ve been following you for a long time Florida Bullfrog and absolutely love your work! I accidentally landed on you YouTube channel a few years back and have watched pretty much all your content regarding chickens more times than I’d like to admit As yourself I started have domestic chicken breeds and quickly wanted to have strong survival chickens and a more feral flock with similar traits to what you’re after. However im located in Scandinavia where the winters are harsh with snow, so I obviously had to adjust my breeding program quite a bit.

I invested a lot of time and money in pure liege fighters from Liege in Belgium, OEGBs and Icelandics but was wondering what you would recommend me?

I’ve bought your book and to say I am enjoying reading it would be quite the understatement! I can’t help but notice that you mention your friend and fellow chicken-survivalist-enthusiast Travis Hughes. You mention that he has chickens that without problems and without human intervention, thrive through snowy winters and that of course caught my attention! Can you somehow connect me or at least give me an introduction to how he got started with the different breeds he is using?

I’m planning on making a thread myself here on BYC to discuss the “rebirth” of a hypothetical European Junglefowl (Gallus europaeus) that I’m trying to breed. I have an Facebook group with all my progress and weekly updates where i more in depth discuss my plans and so on.

Sorry for the long post! Keep up the good work, you’re a huge inspiration!

Travis Hughes is using Old English Game Bantams and more recently, Fayoumi. I have one of his Fayoumi-crossed birds in my current flock. I think he started with OEGBs simply because they're what he liked, and he tried the Fayoumi as an experiment.

I would say you're on the right path with what you're trying. Especially with the Icelandics. Something I've found about the Liege is that they're fickle by what they cross well with. When you cross them with large oriental gamefowl, you get a very carnivorous bird that will require you to give them some supplemental meat or animal protein. That's been consistent in both "terrorfowl" lines I created using different individual birds and sometimes different blood lines in each. Once you get them 3 way crossed, they become very resilient birds but they quickly lose their size at the point their genetics are so watered down. You end up with a bird that's about the size of a standard Old English or American gamefowl and built about the same. I'd wager I could pass off some of my 3 way Liege crosses as American gamefowl if I was inclined to lie about them. One of those often gets misidentified as a black mug.

What do we know about europaeus?

 

[Three Mound High Fowl]

Travis Hughes is using Old English Game Bantams and more recently, Fayoumi. I have one of his Fayoumi-crossed birds in my current flock. I think he started with OEGBs simply because they're what he liked, and he tried the Fayoumi as an experiment.

I would say you're on the right path with what you're trying. Especially with the Icelandics. Something I've found about the Liege is that they're fickle by what they cross well with. When you cross them with large oriental gamefowl, you get a very carnivorous bird that will require you to give them some supplemental meat or animal protein. That's been consistent in both "terrorfowl" lines I created using different individual birds and sometimes different blood lines in each. Once you get them 3 way crossed, they become very resilient birds but they quickly lose their size at the point their genetics are so watered down. You end up with a bird that's about the size of a standard Old English or American gamefowl and built about the same. I'd wager I could pass off some of my 3 way Liege crosses as American gamefowl if I was inclined to lie about them. One of those often gets misidentified as a black mug.

What do we know about europaeus?

OEGBs sound interesting but are again small birds with little amounts of meat and lay small eggs. Which is why I avoided breeding only OEGB but I might have to try again.

For a long time I have longed for a fayoumi but it seems impossible to acquire in Northern Europe. Multiple studies and articles also state that they aren’t super cold hardy, which eventually led to them being left out of the program.

That’s exciting and I guess that’s what you experienced with Indo etc? Exactly those 3 way crosses is what I’m aiming for.

Based on my research, Junglefowl were historically found across much of Eurasia, with a particular prevalence in Europe. However, following the last glacial maximum, their range became confined to the Indian subcontinent, Southeast Eurasia, and various Pacific islands.
The RJF (G. gallus) has been spread all around the world by humans much like you have stated. A bone from an interglacial deposit in Crayford, Kent, looked identical to that of a wild Red Junglefowl. Another bone (a coracoid) from early Middle Pleistocene deposits in Norfolk was very similar to the species, though it showed differences like those seen between different species of the genus Gallus. At least one species related to Gallus has been found in the Pliocene deposits of southeastern Europe. Based on patterns of animal evolution, it’s possible that a species of Gallus evolved in Europe during the Pleistocene. This species might have gone extinct during a glaciation or been hunted to extinction by early humans.

Nothing is for sure however I’d like to create a breed of feral chickens that would thrive in Northern Europe with no human intervention and be of use to humans. The name European Junglefowl (Gallus Europaeus) is just for namesake.

 

[No Coop No Problem]

Fayoumi are far too feral to be useful to humans in my opinion. Good bred gamefowl can be picked up like a baby and behave perfectly. Fayoumi scream and fly away the second someone gets within a dozen feet

They would function for a truly feral flock that lives without human support, but for farming purposes I would never recommend them

Many breeds free-range just as well, or better, while laying more eggs and behaving far superior