Developing the grass in your yard for increasing free ranging nutrition

[LindaB220]

Eureka! (though slightly off topic)

I've been moaning about how the science of poultry nutrition is more about economics than about health of the animal (how to provide the least amounts of the expensive ingredients and still get the maximum amount of poultry product) and therefore frustrating to research for those of us concerned about maximizing the health of our flocks by providing "good food" ...

While doing my daily reading of the Feeding Poultry book (http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003011545;view=1up;seq=287) I came across a reference to a report titled Nutrient Requirements of Poultry, so thought I'd google that. I found the 9th Edition of this title (1994) available free online here ... http://www.lamolina.edu.pe/zootecnia/biblioteca2012/NRC Poultry 1994[1].pdf ... it is downloadable and searchable.

This report seems to be pretty thick reading ... but a useful way to answer specific questions about balancing various nutrients. I did a quick search for "calcium," for example. If I'm reading it correctly, it seems to state that calcium supplementation for laying hens can start earlier than POL ... but that if started too early it did increase the occurrences of "stones" in the urinary system of the birds. It also seems to suggest that "larger particle size" of the calcium supplement is beneficial, and that birds are very good at self-regulating their calcium appetite. I take all this to mean that having a feeder of oyster shell available to the flock, even a younger flock, is a sensible way to provide calcium. But of course that's not a recommendation, it's just an example of how I'm accessing and utilizing the information in this publication.

I'm not sure if a more recent version of this report is available free online, but I'll put it on the list of things to ask google.

Really going to enjoy the first book. Second one, hmmm, very heavy stuff. My eyes started glazing after a few minutes. Definitely a treasure for on spot look ups but not for "I think I'll read this book".

 

[LindaB220]

I agree. There are many other ways to provide proteins for the birds than hanging a rotten carcass over their living quarters...what folks fail to realize is that rotting liquid, filled with the bacteria that help in the decaying process, is dripping into the soils there. Those are the very pathogens one doesn't want thriving in their livestock feed, soils, environment and botulism is a very quick bacteria to grow and quick to kill animals that do not have the digestive acids that can handle it.

I found that out this past fall in a roundabout way. I had obtained a pen of mixed breed roosters for the purpose of eating. They were penned for a few weeks and fed some healthy food to clean out their systems. All birds active, bright eyed and healthy. The day I processed, I let two young roosters loose with my free range flock to keep them awhile for the purose of putting on more weight. I didn't really think about the fact that these roosters knew nothing about foraging. When I disposed of the fresh remains of the process over in the woods, I had no fears of my chickens getting into the pile...usually they wait for the tender bits that I throw them during the processing but I've never seen them pick the gut pile as the rest of the tissues are long, stringy and not easy to ingest.

I wasn't thinking about the two inexperienced roosters not knowing how to forage on chicken appropriate foods out on the pasture and later saw them over at the gut pile. I didn't think much about it until that evening when I saw one of them lying down in the yard. I went to examine him and he got up and took a few wobbly steps, but clearly was having some issues. I left him be to see what would transpire...later I found him lying down again and he didn't get up that time, so I set him on his feet and encouraged movement...he was having some problems in his nervous system, couldn't maintain balance and had tremors in his muscles. I saw his crop was a little distended and green blow flies were lighting on his body, I took a whiff and he stank like rotten meat.

That fast...from around noon to 4 pm that evening, he had an infection. The tissue he had picked off that gut pile was fresh, not rotten, but when it hit his crop it immediately started to rot and the bacteria there were sending out toxins. I milked his crop and greenish brown water came out that stank like a rotten carcass. A long piece of windpipe came out and a stringy piece of gut also came out. But it was too late for that bird...he was fevered, couldn't stand any longer and the flies were blowing him like he was already dead. I dispatched him and disposed of him where the other birds would not venture, then moved the gut pile to that location also. The other young rooster may not have gotten gut pieces that hung up in his crop and couldn't advance, as he did just fine, so it wasn't the nature of the meat that caused this infection, but just getting the meat lodged in an airtight, warm place that can breed botulism. His symptoms were much like botulism, so I just assume that is what he had.

That was the very first time I've had a bird get sick while in my care in 37 yrs, so that impressed me greatly as to how dangerous botulism can be for an animal that small. Nothing to play with.

http://www.defra.gov.uk/ahvla-en/files/pub-vet-botulism.pdf

Wow, glad to see this. I was kicking around the idea of a maggot bucket. Not in the run but close to the wooded area. NOT a good idea. I'll do mealworms instead.

Edited: It's a sad day when I'm more comfortable with worms than maggots

 

[lazy gardener]

If pimiento peppers increase hatchability, and there is also the thought out there that hot pepper (? cayenne) will jump start a hen back into a laying cycle, why wouldn't it be a good idea to try adding a dash of paprika or chili powder to the girl's crumbles before setting some eggs. I'd love to see someone do a controlled study! It should take 2 weeks of supplementation to produce results. Perhaps pull a dozen eggs from your girls and set them, then do the pepper supplements for 2 weeks and set a dozen more eggs. Do a comparison of egg quality and hatchability for both sets of eggs. Any takers??? If so, start a new thread appropriately titled.

 

[Beekissed]

Here is an excellent site for finding out all about different types of feed, grasses, legumes, etc. for feeding livestock...it's pretty comprehensive! http://www.feedipedia.org/node/245

 

[Fentress]

Has anyone grown sorghum? I am thinking about it or other tall large plants to provide cover for the flock and something different for them eat. It is related to maize, I assume they would like the seed heads.

Mark

 

[lazy gardener]

Ordered some seed for this spring. I've never actually seen it growing, but am always up for a challenge, so we'll see what we end up with. Plan to do a mixed planting with Sorghum, comfrey, and sunflowers.

 

[Fentress]

By coincedence, the catalogue for Sand Hill Preservation Center arrived yesterday in the mail. I can't recommend their SC RIR, but maybe I will give their seeds a try. They have a big selection including cover crops. They also have what they call "poultry blends." Another candidate for a large summer plant/grain might be millet. I know the birds loved sunflowers last year so I want to grow something similar that they will also enjoy, in addtion to sunflowers. I am concerned about the grain being too big. Does anyone have any expeirence with chickens eating whole dry corn, that is not cracked. If so, and it's positive, then I wont worry about grain size.

 

[Aphrael]

By coincedence, the catalogue for Sand Hill Preservation Center arrived yesterday in the mail. I can't recommend their SC RIR, but maybe I will give their seeds a try. They have a big selection including cover crops. They also have what they call "poultry blends." Another candidate for a large summer plant/grain might be millet. I know the birds loved sunflowers last year so I want to grow something similar that they will also enjoy, in addtion to sunflowers. I am concerned about the grain being too big. Does anyone have any expeirence with chickens eating whole dry corn, that is not cracked. If so, and it's positive, then I wont worry about grain size.

I use whole corn to sprout and in my fermented feed and they gobble it right down with no problems. Even the bantams and youngsters eat and digest it with no problems.

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

If pimiento peppers increase hatchability, and there is also the thought out there that hot pepper (? cayenne) will jump start a hen back into a laying cycle, why wouldn't it be a good idea to try adding a dash of paprika or chili powder to the girl's crumbles before setting some eggs. I'd love to see someone do a controlled study! It should take 2 weeks of supplementation to produce results. Perhaps pull a dozen eggs from your girls and set them, then do the pepper supplements for 2 weeks and set a dozen more eggs. Do a comparison of egg quality and hatchability for both sets of eggs. Any takers??? If so, start a new thread appropriately titled.

I'm researching feeding for hatch-ability right now. Please post a link to the thread if you start it.

 

[Fentress]

I use whole corn to sprout and in my fermented feed and they gobble it right down with no problems. Even the bantams and youngsters eat and digest it with no problems.

Thanks!