Diary & Notes ~ Air Cell Detatched SHIPPED Chicken Eggs for incubation and hatching

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ozexpat said:
Without trying to beat a dead horse.

turn your eggs

If you choose not to follow the advice then that's ok. Just log how with the crappy air cells hatch. It won't be many. Then subtract the chicks that don't make it because they are stuck to the side of the shell. The benefit gained from trying to repair sure cells will bee lost in dead-in-shell chicks or those you will desperately try and save through assisting.

I may sound c old but I am really not. Of you read through the two years of this thread you will see an evolution of thoughts and practices.

I am not the perfect Hatcher by any means. I have however set over one thousand shipped chicken eggs, a thousand quail, a hundred guinea, and scores of Turkey and Chukar.

Every hatch has thorough records in an access data base. I can run statistics on humidity, turning and packaging material with p values that are statistically significant.

Every egg is precious to me. A batch that fails can mean a delay of a year in developing the breed. I abhor detached air cells and like everyone else I set them. Out of eighty three eggs with air cells that roll from one end to the other I have had zero hatch.

A saddled air cell decreases my hatch rate by twenty seven percent.

No turning for 12 hours does not effect my hatch rate. I get an increase of dead in shell chicks of twenty percent by not turning for two days

I hope this makes sense.
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Makes perfect sense and I appreciate your time and willingness to help others and share your experience! For someone like me who has never incubated it is a daunting thing and I know everyone has to start somewhere.

In your experience do incubators with egg turners in the upright position have better success with bad air cells versus incubators that lay eggs and roll them to turn?

I am probably going to save myself some bator space and discard my rolling air cells. I will double check them before I set just in case but after hearing your and Sally's experience with them I really see no point in trying to incubate them. Thankfully there aren't too many.
 
jbher said:
my hesitation for turning so soon is that my incubator is one where they eggs lay down in it and the auto-turner "rolls" them along... so they never are upright. 
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My eggs are upright because I use trays. For two years Sally was lying them flat and turning them.

The position of the egg is not important as turning. I turn mine five times a day now. If I had an auto Turner I would turn every two hours.

As far as late turning causing malpositioned chicks, I think that's a non issue. Broodies don't have a smart phone with a count down timer.

Mine are on resting on the Turner for twelve hours getting to temp. Turned fit the next 444 hours then go into lock down. At 504 hours (21 days) the hatch outs almost always over. I give the stragglers another six hours. Chicks that are later than that are special needs with bad feet and other issues. Those eggs stay in but I pull the chicks for the greater good of the many.

My chicks get a teaspoon of electrolyte and vitamin powder in a gallon of water. They get introduced to the water by doing their beaks. I feed medicated home made feed on a piece of card board so they don't try and eat the being. A light goes over them for three weeks at night and one week during the day. At three weeks they are in their coop.

This process goes on for between 30 and 50 local eggs per week and 200-300 shipped eggs every quarter.

My quail and guinea just started laying so I will be adding them to the turner as well.

Next




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Sally Sunshine said:
Quote: I have told everyone over and over, and pasted this several times. We have researched this alot, ozexpat has set a godzillion eggs at this point, not only shipped across the US to him, but then taken a flight to be hatched overseas in the phils!

Almost every set of information in this Hatching 101 article is based on fact and studies, it should never take place of doing your own research though, always do your homework, and that doesnt mean heresay. What works for one person will not work for another in most situations with incubating.

Remember when we step out of the realm of the perfect egg and jump into shipped eggs we must use our common sense and take into account all the typical conditions we know are reduce viability in eggs, one main issue with incubation is not turning or not enough turning. I seen it with my own hand turning, 3x a day just doesnt cut it, I cant imagine no turning. And then the air cells. Thats why every egg should be treated differently.

I also agree with the, never seen a rolling air cell hatch. I toss them at this point and I question those who say they HAVE hatched them, not saying its not possible, just not that I have ever seen, I would only trust a full documentation start to finish of an egg like that to believe it! I WANT to believe it trust me! LOL Most that say they hatched them are confused with the rolling vs loose! A LOOSE air cell does have a good chance at hatch depending on its severity, its the shape of the cell and if the chick can ultimately hatch under what conditions those air cells give them.

OZ at this point are we in what agreement on the following in the article? Does it need changes with more facts put into the article via links on viability and turning or what? I want to get the most accurate, and conclusions based on facts.


CONCLUSION ~ Shipped eggs
If an egg has a normal intact air cell PLEASE TREAT IT AS A NORMAL EGG!

For rolling, detached or disrupted air cells
(cells no longer at fat end of the egg but like a bubble level on the long side, rolling or saddle shaped cells), you’ll need to change your hatch plan. These eggs need to sit and settle to room temp 12-24 hours NO TURNING, pointy end down in a Egg Carton to possibly reattach air cells.

For SETTING in the incubator......

If your air cell is ROLLING end to end do not turn for 36-48 hours of the first incubation hours to help air cell re-attach and in some cases are really bad loose air cell should not be turned either, if after 48 hours and you have embryo growth and the air cell is still completely loose, do not turn another 24 hours.

If air cells are saddle shaped but intact (meaning not jiggly) I put them in the turner and begin with the gentle turning or you can turn by hand in the carton by simply tilting side to side, see image below.

TREATMENT AT LOCKDOWN.......
I personally have found that any shipped egg that survives to day 18 lockdown has an awkward but re-attached air cell so I lay my eggs down for hatch. Please refer to day 18 lockdown for more information on why laying eggs for hatching after day 18 is the best way to go.

REMINDER~ Never Set COLD eggs in the incubator.



Below image are Eggs in A Carton with Bottoms cut out for Ventilation



Below image of Turning damaged air cell Shipped Eggs, just lean to opposite side.
​
Last time I am sharing this, this is EXACTLY how I treat my shipped eggs, except I trash rollers. its in the article. I DO NOT TREAT EACH EGG THE SAME, I lay the good and treat normal even sorta loose ones, but the big loose ones I let upright and turn in carton, BUT I TURN THEM ;)
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I had 2 chicks hatch overnight and decided to take some pictures.
smile.png


Silver Laced Cochin Bantam:





Dark Brahma/Partridge Cochin:









 
Um...help? So I was just candling all the eggs I've got cooking and #2 a day 23 Ancona duck looks ready to hatch now... Big dip in air cell and nothing but dark inside. #1 in the same age but still have blank space lots of movement and a round air cell.

IMG_20140329_150251_zpsykfqqqnp.jpg


Anyone have any ideas why #2 seems so far ahead? I hope it waits until tomorrow.
 
foxvalleyfarm said:
Um...help? So I was just candling all the eggs I've got cooking and #2 a day 23 Ancona duck looks ready to hatch now... Big dip in air cell and nothing but dark inside. #1 in the same age but still have blank space lots of movement and a round air cell.

IMG_20140329_150251_zpsykfqqqnp.jpg


Anyone have any ideas why #2 seems so far ahead? I hope it waits until tomorrow.
Click to expand...
Have you seen movement? are you sure its not dark because it is rotten? sniff it!

Day 23 odd, can we compare to the others you speak of?
 
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