Do pecking order fights normally include shaking the other chicken?

[NewZealandChickenOwner]

Recently I got 2 new, barred rock hens. They were kept in a run with a covered cage to live in for an isolation period. This run is next door to the Wyandotte's chicken house, with an door between.
The new hens were let into the adjoining coop for the night but separated in the daytime. In hindsight, this was a bad idea.

A barred rock was already on the perch for the night, then an Wyandotte hen jumped up. The new hen grabbed the Wyandotte's comb and shook the Wyandotte like a dog shaking a rat. The victim's neck was twisting in all directions. The hen tried to escape via flapping their wings. I had to grab the Wyandotte hen to seperate them. Once outside the new hen restarted the attack, until they were separated again.

I have had pecking order fights before, which involving chickens kicking each other, batting their wings, pecking each other, biting each others combs and chasing each other, but no vigorous shaking.

Is this normal pecking order fight behaviour or is this over the top?

 

[azygous]

Short answer, yes, it's within the range of normal pecking order disputes. But, aggression involves so many factors that you really can't label a behavior as one or the other until it reaches the extreme point of the aggressor standing on top of the victim and hammering them with a beak.

Can you post a photo of the Wyandotte victim's comb? Some Wyandotte combs have a long "tail" extending beyond the back of the head. This provides a handle for an aggressor to grab and it can result in severe injuries. I had a Wyandotte hen that an aggressor detached the comb and left it dangling. After several "scalpings", I dubbed the tail close to her head and that solved the problem.

Barred Rocks are an aggressive breed. When they join a flock of more docile breeds, you often see aggression. Hopefully, as the new hens become more secure in their new home, their aggression will lessen.

I wrote an article on introducing an adult hen to an existing flock. You might glean some tips from it. The point is to provide safety for all by keeping them apart, yet visible, while everyone becomes familiar and comfortable. https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/introducing-a-single-hen-to-an-existing-flock.71997/

 

[Mrs. K]

Really, I think (Note, I know I wasn't there) but the shaking might have just been opportunistic of the original bird, she got the right grip, and made her point. So I think it was normal, but I also think you need to diminish it.

This will be a lot of monkeying around, so it depends on how badly you want to keep all the birds.

If this is a roosting problem, tape a large piece of cardboard to the ceiling, so as to divide the roost into two parts. At night, put the hens on the roost each in their own part.

Adding birds is tricky and generally depends on the size of the birds, the age of the birds, the size of the space, how the space is set up and luck.

So do you truly have the space? Measure and count head. While 4 square feet per bird is not set in stone, it is a darn good point to aim too.

How is the outside space set up? Often times I see just bare rectangle runs. Adding a bunch of clutter, makes it more interesting, adds use of the vertical space, gives more exercise, and allows birds to get out of reach and sight of each other.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/page-6#post-25037140

How old are the birds, how many old birds do you have? How many feed bowls do you have, and are they set up so that while eating at one bowl, a bird cannot see a bird at another.

Hope these ideas help.

Mrs K

 

[SamLockwood]

Recently I got 2 new, barred rock hens. They were kept in a run with a covered cage to live in for an isolation period. This run is next door to the Wyandotte's chicken house, with an door between.
The new hens were let into the adjoining coop for the night but separated in the daytime. In hindsight, this was a bad idea.

A barred rock was already on the perch for the night, then an Wyandotte hen jumped up. The new hen grabbed the Wyandotte's comb and shook the Wyandotte like a dog shaking a rat. The victim's neck was twisting in all directions. The hen tried to escape via flapping their wings. I had to grab the Wyandotte hen to seperate them. Once outside the new hen restarted the attack, until they were separated again.

I have had pecking order fights before, which involving chickens kicking each other, batting their wings, pecking each other, biting each others combs and chasing each other, but no vigorous shaking.

Is this normal pecking order fight behaviour or is this over the top?

It's a bit excessive, but maybe not out of line if they're still strangers to each other. How long of an "isolation period" did you have? How much roosting space is there? The most squabbling I have even in my established flock is over roosting space, and sometimes those conflicts get ugly.

I'd maybe keep them separated a bit longer, and watch more closely how they interact across the barrier. I'd also look at putting in more roosting bars as well if you can.

In my setup I have an outdoor brooder with a built-in mini-run below that's near the main coop & run. I move new birds into the outdoor brooder at two weeks, and usually a couple weeks after that they're ready to explore the "outside" in their personal run.

This gives the adults some time to look at them as they free-range. After about two to four weeks the aggression across the barrier tones down & I start limited visits, usually starting an hour or two before dusk and then for increasingly longer periods depending on how they interact with each other. So somewhere around six to 8 weeks of age.

The outdoor brooder is also rigged with roosting bars as well. It's essentially a small coop with no nesting boxes and an option to put a heater-plate in.

Generally, by the time they're around 16 weeks old the newcomers will have found a place in the main flock and will move into the "big house" with a minimum of fuss. When my flock grew a bit this year I noticed a bit more than the usual pecking & shoving at roosting time, and ended up adding some more roosting bars and things settled back to normal that very evening.

 

[NewZealandChickenOwner]

Sorry for my late reply. Thanks for everybody's advice. The wyandotte does have a long comb that sticks out at the end.

There are two perches in the wyandotte's house. Technically we have two chicken houses and the covered cage.
The first chicken house is quite big (very roughly 98cm+ wide x 276cm+ long, 155cm+ tall, rectangular, garden shed like).
The second chicken house is the Wyandotte's house, which is smaller (very roughly 110cm wide x 110cm long).

The run has the covered cage, two water containers, one open bowl of pellets, one step on pellet feeder, one mini outdoor perch, and some straw.
I think that I''ll keep them seperate for longer, move the food bowl out of sight of the step on feeder and maybe add some clutter to the run.