Edit: Urgent - Marek's or Injury?

[Waterfaery]

He might have slipped a tendon-usually you can palpate/visualize an enlarged hock. You can splint his leg and continue with the most excellent care you are now providing. If he dislocated/fractured his hip (Rare) cage rest will see if he can recover. There is surgery to repair both conditions but that requires a veterinary consult.

Thank you so much. His hock doesn't look or feel to be enlarged to us. The only difference I can feel between the left and right legs is the way they are sitting against his body.

Is there a particular way to check if it's a dislocation and would we be able to reset it? I'm not quite sure how to splint it. I'd hate to set something in the wrong way. My husband is going to look into that possibility today.

I'm really hoping the rest will help because we have no avian vet and two local, regular vets have failed us badly in the past. We did deal with an avian vet once who is really far away and that wasn't a great experience, either. I will consider it if all else fails.

 

[Waterfaery]

Video of his actions?
Upload video to Youtube or similar platform, provide a link.

This is one problem when you read lots and lots of threads, articles and use symptoms checkers. You can convince yourself of some serious disease and get yourself worked up.
It's been a day. The cockerel was fighting. He's in a bachelor pad with other cockerels which very often leads to injury. Serious injury.
Seeking vet care and having an xray to confirm injury and get it addressed is the best route to take instead of worrying about disease.

I would omit the aspirin.

Thanks. I don't use many online platforms so I'm not sure about a video but I'll see what I can do. Here are some more photos but I'm not sure how helpful they are.

Yes, I'm hoping you're right and I've just got myself panicked about disease unnecessarily. He was top of the pecking order and they were getting along fine until the other day so I worried that the others might have been picking on him because he was sick.

My initial thought was that it was definitely an injury and I only even considered Marek's after reading too much. I just have to really hope it's an injury he can actually recover from.

 

[Waterfaery]

So this is my third day tending to him. He's still eating and drinking but possibly less than the previous days. He seems less keen to stand up than before. I don't know if he's learned that he can't get very far or if he's getting more tired or in more pain. When we first let him out this morning I was so hopeful because he came out of the box on his own for the first time but since then he hasn't moved as much as previous days.

We examined him thoroughly again and I can really find no discernible injury at all. There isn't any particular joint that we manipulate that makes him flinch any more than any other. When he's in a sitting position, I discovered I can slide his right leg forward so it's under him the same way as the left one. When we hold him in a standing position, if we push his right leg forward, it will automatically go backwards.

I keep trying to feel what's different between each side but I can't identify any physical difference other than that. He definitely has some control over both legs apart from not being able to move the right one forward. He is able to resist us manipulating him somewhat and he is still able to bend his knees and toes. However, I could feel both of his thighs really trembling with weakness as I held them today. He was hardly able to stay in a standing position, at least for far less time than previous days. It's like his legs just aren't strong enough, but it feels like both are weak, not just the right one.

His droppings are solid but they have become very dark in colour. It's not sticky and tar like, just normal consistency but almost black. Does that indicate anything in particular?

I did manage to upload a video.

I hope that might help people to help me rule some things in or out.

 

[theoldchick]

You might have to make him a wheelchair:

It is helpful to get them up and active. If chickens lay on the sternum too long they will become less mobile. He might have a spinal injury/insult caused by trauma or infection. Sometimes we don't know exactly why a mature bird goes down like this but often pain management and hospital care can really help these patients.

 

[Waterfaery]

Thank you. That will be the project for tomorrow. I have been concerned about him staying in that one position for so long so my number one priority was to get him upright in a chair tomorrow. What a wonderful idea to put wheels on it.

I do fear he's starting to weaken and not eat enough. He's still interested in food and will eat a bit of everything we give him but he didn't fill his crop today. I was quite concerned sending him in for the night without a full crop. I really don't want to tube feed him while he's still able to eat but I don't want him to start losing weight. Hopefully being upright will help him eat more.

I managed to get to the pharmacy so he's started on his vitamin B and E therapy, just in case that helps. I decided to omit the selenium because I read it's easy to overdose on it so I'm going to try giving him small amounts of brazil nuts as they're naturally high in it.

We finally had some sun today after torrential rain storms that have been going on for the last couple of weeks. I was so happy to get him out onto the grass for some fresh air and sun and I let my Light Sussex hen spend some time with him. I know he should be isolated but I've been feeling so sad for him and he spends all day trying to call her through the fence. If it is something like Marek's, I thought it wouldn't matter since they were together the day before this started anyway.

I could hardly believe it but he actually managed to mate with her. I don't really know how he did it since he can't even walk but that just shows what motivates him. I think I'll hold off on putting them together again unless he improves a bit more. It seemed to take a huge amount out of him and he was definitely weaker after that. I am happy that he got to have a nice outing, though.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

He's a big boy.
I'd give him 1 whole tablet of B-Complex daily along with the 400IU Vitamin E. Give him some egg to help with the uptake of E.
Chick starter or an all flock feed to eat.

I still think injury, but disease like Marek's is always a possibility, it's a common disease and can pop up randomly.

Don't panic. I know you read a lot. I do too, have for years and years. Folks get Marek's in their flock, it can be heartbreaking, I don't dismiss the hurt, sadness and frustration at all!! Here's the thing. Even if it's Marek's, managing symptoms and offering supportive care like you are doing is as of right now "the best" thing to do. There's no real treatment so vitamin support and nutrition, along with fresh air, sunshine and encouraging them to move about seems to be what most do. IF, IF he declines or you feel he's in pain/suffering terribly and you make the hard decision to let him go, then getting testing through your state lab will give you answers.

None of this is fun. I love roosters and yours is a handsome boy, I sure do hope he starts to improve.

 

[Waterfaery]

Thanks.

Yes, he's huge and really special. He's always been a bit unique and different, right from when he burst out of his egg a day before the others and started running around the incubator immediately, not even resting after exiting the egg. He was bigger than the others all along growing up and has stayed much bigger since everyone has been fully grown. He's especially gentle and has always been so good with us and the hens. I always thought he was by far the strongest and fittest out of my whole flock so this is a bit of a shock.

Is it from the video that you think Marek's is a possibility? Is that the type of movement restriction you'd see with it?

It was keeping me awake overnight wondering if it was a huge mistake to put my hen out with him. Was I right about there being no point in quarantine at this point? They would all have been exposed to it if it's Marek's, wouldn't they?

I keep telling myself the logical answer is injury but then I'm watching him flailing around and not being able to walk and I just keep coming back to Marek's.

I've been thinking about my flock history as well. We got 6 point of lay production hybrid pullets from a very large breeder about 3 and a half years ago. Two of them are still alive. One died in a freak accident but the other 3 that died all sort of wasted away without clear symptoms. We've dealt with things like diarrhea, crop issues, general lethargy, not responding to treatments, randomly improving and then deteriorating again. Only one of them died quickly. The other two were just not quite right for a long time but sort of just hung on and kept going for several months, maybe even a year.

Of the two that are left, one hasn't laid an egg in about 9 months. The other gives us about one a week. They're both a bit lethargic but they've been like that for a year or maybe even two without declining.

It was around their first moult we started to see these issues. I had put it down to them being production hybrids and not bred for longevity. I would never have even considered Marek's because I thought it was a paralysis thing until I've read more about it now. So I'm a bit scared now that that's what we're dealing with.

The other thing is that we also keep peafowl and they were in direct contact with these hens in the early days and never got sick. I know peafowl don't get Marek's so that's another interesting sign.

My new flock were hatched in two batches from shipped eggs, one batch in June and one in July last year. We took their quarantine from the old aviary seriously and they grew up in a pastured situation in a separate part of the land with an electric fence. Then at the end of October with the bird flu housing requirements and our horrible winter weather, we moved them into the polytunnel for the winter. The polytunnel is where we used to bring our older hens when they were sick and dying. So if there is Marek's here, the new flock might have managed to not come in contact with it until they were 3 or 4 months old.

I know you say not to panic and I keep telling myself that constantly but I have to admit I am in a bit of a major panic about the new chicks. They are starting to pip right now. I don't think it's within our ability to manage the level of quarantine that's going to be required to keep them safe, especially while tending my poor Atreyu at the same time.

He's the same this morning so we'll see how he does today. My husband is starting to look into the options for his chair.

Sorry this is a massively long post and thanks so much to anyone who reads it all. I'm very sleep deprived and in a bit of a state. Any other feedback on whether his movement in the video looks like Marek's or not would really help me.

 

[Bertie-Merle]

This may not be of much help, but I've had two hens hurt a foot/toe or leg over the past year from jumping up/down on their ramp or the ladder into the coop or who knows what they did .... no signs of blood or anything beyond mildly discernable swelling, if any ... no type of infection or parasites ... just hurt. It took around two to three weeks before they healed to the point where they weren't noticeably "gimping". Tendons and muscles take at least a minimum of two weeks to really heal .... could take over 3 wks.

I wish you the best. ; -)

 

[Waterfaery]

Thank you. That does help and means a lot that you posted.

 

[Bertie-Merle]

Thank you. That does help and means a lot that you posted.

I hope it's nothing more, but I know you'll keep a close eye on your boy! I wish ya'll the best. Please keep us posted on his progress! Take care. ; -)