English Shepherd as Poultry Guardian

[centrarchid]

We were told never to clip double coated dogs for the same reason.

The heat / sun reasoning defies logic. Parties suggesting not to clip must have some other reasoning otherwise they need stop giving poor advice.

 

[OrganicFarmWife]

They can give me all the reasoning they wish. It was a very obvious behavior change after her hair cut. We went from a nearly motionless dog to one who would run and play. She was rather embarrassed at first, she just acted so ashamed of herself, looking so ugly. But once she got over that, she was clearly more comfortable.
I do insist that the groomer cut her hair long, so as not to give her a sunburn. But I am never going back to not cutting over summer.

 

[hellbender]

The heat / sun reasoning defies logic. Parties suggesting not to clip must have some other reasoning otherwise they need stop giving poor advice.

Your reasoning seems to spring from a priori concepts. One needs to know what they are talking about before offering information about anything and I happen to have just such knowledge and experience.

 

[aart]

Not sure I buy the 'fur insulates from sun/heat' either...but think of the heavy robes and turban worn in the deserts.
Maybe not a great analogy, but I've always wondered about it.

I've read multitudes of anecdotes about summer clipping/shaving double coated dogs on grooming and LGD sites...
.....some grew their back coat fine in time for winter, but some never did.
Might depend on the breed and/or lineage of dog.

 

[centrarchid]

Have someone in heavy robes and a turban run a marathon. Most working dogs are doing much the same and they are not masters of heat dissipation we humans are.


The heavy robes and turban do two things, block sun from hitting skin and allow air circulation. Such works great in a low humidity situation especially when same clothing is needed to help contend with cool to cold nights typical of deserts. Also consider diel activity patterns of those parties wearing heavy robes on a day to day basis.

 

[TalkALittle]

The bigger reason for not clipping/shaving down double coated dogs is that you run the risk of the outer coat (what provides protection to the undercoat) not growing back in correctly.

Also, while the slower growing outer coat grows back in, the quicker growing,but more easily damaged,inner coat ends up taking a beating.

The best thing to do for an Aussie or english shepherd (besides breeding for a good working coat that's not too thin OR thick) is regular brushing to remove the undercoat. Part the fur and use an undercoat rake. You can use a Furminator but don't go crazy with it. Do this regularly so that when it comes time for those twice a year super sheds, your dog doesn't have a buildup of dead undercoat. You can also use thinning shears to take bulk out of the coat without completely removing the top coat. A good blow out with a force dryer (or even a shop vac with the hose reversed) can remove any remaining loose fur.

Do not shave your double coated dogs. Maintain them. Their coat helps them to do their job in all kinds of weather. Unless you have a breed bred for one climate extreme and you live in the opposite extreme you should be okay.

If you are a smart farmer/rancher/homesteads you have routines that you do daily, weekly, monthly, and seasonally that keep your equipment in proper order. It should be the same for your dog's coat. If you find yourself in the position where a shave down seems your only solution, it means you need to adopt a better maintenance schedule.

 

[centrarchid]

Increased grooming can be employed. The heavier coat being an advantage during heat of summer is very much incorrect and indicative of someone that has not seen a dog under heat stress associated with sustained activity. If you dog has to work only a two acre patch with lots of shade with low relative humidity then you are not in a heat stressing environment.

 

[beginnergirl]

The bigger reason for not clipping/shaving down double coated dogs is that you run the risk of the outer coat (what provides protection to the undercoat) not growing back in correctly.

Also, while the slower growing outer coat grows back in, the quicker growing,but more easily damaged,inner coat ends up taking a beating.

The best thing to do for an Aussie or english shepherd (besides breeding for a good working coat that's not too thin OR thick) is regular brushing to remove the undercoat. Part the fur and use an undercoat rake. You can use a Furminator but don't go crazy with it. Do this regularly so that when it comes time for those twice a year super sheds, your dog doesn't have a buildup of dead undercoat. You can also use thinning shears to take bulk out of the coat without completely removing the top coat. A good blow out with a force dryer (or even a shop vac with the hose reversed) can remove any remaining loose fur.

Do not shave your double coated dogs. Maintain them. Their coat helps them to do their job in all kinds of weather. Unless you have a breed bred for one climate extreme and you live in the opposite extreme you should be okay.

If you are a smart farmer/rancher/homesteads you have routines that you do daily, weekly, monthly, and seasonally that keep your equipment in proper order. It should be the same for your dog's coat. If you find yourself in the position where a shave down seems your only solution, it means you need to adopt a better maintenance schedule.

Excellent advice. Double coated dogs do require maintenance. Blowing out the undercoat with a strong cool dryer after using a double tinned rake really makes a difference. My Tibetan mastiffs and Kuvasz did fine in high heat if they had access to water (sprinkler, child swimming pool and shade). When my Kuvasz had a disease which made overheating dangerous, we tried giving her a 1" puppy cut. It made no difference. I think she was cooler before.

If you read information from breeders of double coated working dogs, all I have seen does not recommend shaving or cutting the coat. The exception might be for a severely matted coat, but this shows a lack of maintenance.
The coat protects from insects, sunburn and in the event of an altercation with a predator, the coat also can save a dog from being hurt.

 

[hellbender]

Increased grooming can be employed. The heavier coat being an advantage during heat of summer is very much incorrect and indicative of someone that has not seen a dog under heat stress associated with sustained activity. If you dog has to work only a two acre patch with lots of shade with low relative humidity then you are not in a heat stressing environment.

You aren't arguing with me...you are arguing with science.

A while back, I saw 2 Bullmastiffs and one O E Mastiff go down with heat prostration at a dog show in Canada. Their coats were slick as a seal, as it was well into summer and these dogs hardly had 'profuse jackets'.

 

[centrarchid]

Experts on this breed will be consulted.