Everything Is Illegal In America??

[Zach123]

Thank you so very much for your service!

And thanks so much..

Hey no problem. Thank you for your support

Matthew, I think you've got it right. In fact, for most American history drugs were legal. The reason they outlawed cocaine and heroine? They thought they made Black people kill White people. The reason they made marijuana illegal? They wanted an excuse to deport Mexicans. The reality is, the reason dugs are a crime is merely because we made it that way, there is no other explination. Not because drug use is a blight on society, it only is that way because we made it that way. I know first hand how destructive dugs are, and even if they were legal I would never chose to use them again, I would hope that most people felt the same way whether they had ever used them before or not, but its not mine, or yours or the governments place to play "babysitter" and tell everyone what they can and can't do in their personal lives. I believe that this country was founded on the principles of indevidual liberty and a highly restricted government, somewhere down the line the roles were reversed.

 

[Matthew3590]

They used the race card on cannabis as well. Political figures would tell people that it made white women date black guys.

 

[thaiturkey]

I agree with most of what you said, but that last line was just dumb. If 55% of people in jail were child molesters then we should change the laws ?

That's a fair point. If serious offenders break the law, prison is an accepted punishment and protects the rest of the population from them.

The issue, only part of what the OP addresses, is whether drug use should be legalised. I can see the argument that prohibition creates associated crimes of violence but legalisation doesn't seem to reduce drug abuse. A free society doesn't mean absolute freedom to do anything one wants, including self harm. One wouldn't expect to be free to stand naked and drunk in the middle of a main highway, risking injury to oneself and others, so why should one be free to ruin one's health and the family wellbeing by hitting hard drugs?

The issue is not whether or not we have freedom but the extent to which it should to be limited in order to protect individuals and society as a whole. The drugs example is not a good one but others in the video are. Another example is the waterboarding story that's hitting the news around the world again. In a society that respects the right of individuals to fair treatment, is it acceptable to torture someone who may or may not be guilty in order to extract a confession or information that may be false? I can't decide at the moment. Torture is illegal and, in this case, was done in countries that are prepared to turn a blind eye. That alone suggests that the agency knowingly broke the laws of its own country. On the other hand, the guy might be guilty of what he boasts and he may have valuable information that could save lives in the future. What troubles me is the denials that waterboarding is torture and the boasts that it was done with pride when, in reality, it was carried out secretly in some backwoods elsewhere. If it was justified and legal, I would have expected the agency to have been more open and honest about it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17990955

 

[redhen]

Don't know...all the people that I know that went to jail for drug offenses were scum and needed to be off the streets anyways..

 

[hemet dennis]

As far as torture goes Those that say it doesn't work don't know what they're talking about. Ask any prisoner of N. Vietnam. They all broke.

Let me ask anyone if your kids were kidnapped and put in an underground locker with a limited air supply, and they find a guy in another country that was involved but he wont say where the kids are. Should he be tortured to save your kids ?

 

[hemet dennis]

Don't know...all the people that I know that went to jail for drug offenses were scum and needed to be off the streets anyways..

When they use that 55% they include people that robbed someone to get money for drugs but who is to say that person wouldn't still be robbing for money just because it's easier then working.

 

[cupman]

I believe the whole idea behind our stance on torture is that we are better than that. Waterboarding has proven to provide false results, why wouldn't other forms? I don't know, I imagine our country's position on the issue has a good reason. The genova convention and whatever. I agree desperation makes people do wild things but we also don't negotiate with terrorists, something we might do under duress. I think our country has an intelligent position on the issue.

 

[thaiturkey]

As far as torture goes Those that say it doesn't work don't know what they're talking about. Ask any prisoner of N. Vietnam. They all broke.

Let me ask anyone if your kids were kidnapped and put in an underground locker with a limited air supply, and they find a guy in another country that was involved but he wont say where the kids are. Should he be tortured to save your kids ?

That's an interesting dilemma that you outline. If it as my own kids, emotion would overtake reason. On the other hand, I can't imagine a government torturing someone to save a private citizen.

Referring to your first sentence, it's clear that torture does work to the extent that it usually extracts either a confession or information. I think it's also probable that not all such utterings are true. The victim of torture may say anything the torturers want to hear in order to get them to stop what they are doing.

The issue is a moral one as well as a practical one. If we claim to be civilised, or more civilised than the enemy, are we not condoning their standards if we behave in the same way as them? I think that Rodriguez is struggling with his conscience on this too, evidenced by way he tried to avoid some of the questions in the interview and his decision, against an order to the contrary, to destroy the tapes. If a person or government believes that torture is acceptable, it should be prepared to openly say so and do it on its own territory. Arguments in favour of waterboarding are damaged by the clandestine way in which it was done to avoid the scrutiny of the Courts at home.

 

[hemet dennis]

That's an interesting dilemma that you outline. If it as my own kids, emotion would overtake reason. On the other hand, I can't imagine a government torturing someone to save a private citizen.

Referring to your first sentence, it's clear that torture does work to the extent that it usually extracts either a confession or information. I think it's also probable that not all such utterings are true. The victim of torture may say anything the torturers want to hear in order to get them to stop what they are doing.

The issue is a moral one as well as a practical one. If we claim to be civilised, or more civilised than the enemy, are we not condoning their standards if we behave in the same way as them? I think that Rodriguez is struggling with his conscience on this too, evidenced by way he tried to avoid some of the questions in the interview and his decision, against an order to the contrary, to destroy the tapes. If a person or government believes that torture is acceptable, it should be prepared to openly say so and do it on its own territory. Arguments in favour of waterboarding are damaged by the clandestine way in which it was done to avoid the scrutiny of the Courts at home.

When you have a group of prisoners that you are getting info. from you can use the other prisoners to find out what is true and what is not. A skilled interrogator can tell from body language. For instance under water boarding the guy tells you they plan to blowup a blue building and when he tell another that we know they plan to blow up a blue building that person will show some sign that will say if we are on the right track.

We hold our self to a higher standard to our determent.

 

[hemet dennis]

That's an interesting dilemma that you outline. If it as my own kids, emotion would overtake reason. On the other hand, I can't imagine a government torturing someone to save a private citizen.

The point of the torturing was to save private citizens.