FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

Discussion in 'Feeding & Watering Your Flock' started by Beekissed, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. Katt66

    Katt66 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Aug 10, 2013
    Barnesville, PA
    I guess what I was trying to say there was pretty much there's nothing actually natural about keeping chickens. We selectively bred them so far away from whatever their wild origins were there really is no genuine natural way of keeping them. Whatever keeps a particular flock happy and healthy and producing well is what that person should continue to do. For me, my birds have an enclosed draft free raised coop and a lower area, also enclosed in plastic with roosts but the front open. An enclosed run and an open yard to choose from. They have a bowl of FF in the morning (well, 2 actually) and a compost pile to play in now. In warmer weather they've got grass random weeds and my flower gardens to choose from as well. They have all of these options open to them all day long, weather permitting, and can come and go freely and do what feels right to them. I try not to coop them up or force them out of their shelter but let them choose what they want do trusting their instincts to guide them.

    If somebody else's birds thrive better for them being fully enclosed with strictly monitored feedings, lights on timers, etc. then that's what's for them. It's all dependent on what your situation is, what your resources are and how much time and thinking power you have or are willing to put towards your birds' well being. I see people around throwing out all kinds of numbers and calculating their birds' nutrition down to the calorie, fat gram, and protein gram. If I tried to do that, my brain would liquify and start dribbling out my ears. DX But if it works for them, more power to them. Everybody's got a different approach to keeping chickens I'm discovering. And what works for one may not work exactly for someone else. All we can do is look around, absorb what we can and see what works for us.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2014
  2. Beekissed

    Beekissed Flock Master

    And there is where you and I differ in opinion. I feel that keeping domestic chickens is very natural as I believe in certain historical facts that others may not believe that tell of the very first humans farming domestic animals. I don't think they had "wild origins" because this historical record denies that, so I center my flock methods around those beliefs.

    It's not for everyone and each have to decide for themselves how they will tend their animals. Whatever is right for you may not be right for me...is most decidedly NOT right for me and I'm sure it's the same for you and for others.

    Again, no one is dictating flock management paradigms on this thread, but merely trying to help people learn how to use FF if they should want to do so. Anything said here can be used or thrown away as each person sees fit.

    I'm not the one having trouble with FF freezing, so I'm not the one asking for ways to adapt to that. I offered a solution and explanations but these do not have to be accepted and are offered freely and with no expectations that one will adhere to them just because I said so.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2014
  3. ChickenCanoe

    ChickenCanoe True BYC Addict

    Nov 23, 2010
    St. Louis, MO
    I agree with both of you.
    Everyone's needs, desires, breeds and therefor, management technique is different.

    Instinctively, most breeds of chickens retain much of their jungle fowl origin. Just the last few hundred years, some breeds have been selected for super egg production, fast growth, some for other things. It requires different nutrition to accommodate the needs of these specialists.

    Starter feed, grower feed, finisher feed, layer feed, breeder feed all are formulated for different niches in the growth/maturity phase of commercial poultry.
    It's important that we remember that. Those of us that don't have thousands of layers, hatched the same day, kept on strict lighting programs in blackout buildings, photo-stimulated to commence lay within a week or two of each other need to consider - should my whole flock be on layer feed? I think not.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2014
  4. LeslieDJoyce

    LeslieDJoyce Overrun With Chickens

    Jul 30, 2012
    Sherwood, OR
    My Coop
    Today I decided to search the online version of the Feeding Poultry book ( http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/009110299 ) for mentions of "fermented" and came up with these entries ... I've included the footnotes for these entries as well ... but I didn't spend too much time verifying that my typing was perfectly accurate, so I encourage everyone to follow the link and check out the quotes themselves.

    Note: there is some discussion in this book about experiments in feeding times, etc.

    Chapter 5, Poultry Feeds -- Cereals, Seeds, and Other Mash Constituents

    p. 122
    It is thought by some that wheat may be concerned with the incidence of pullet disease or blue comb. However, all wheats do not seem capable of producing this result. yet trouble has frequently been reported as the result of feeding new grain. Although the feeding of new wheat is not always fatal and may not prove even noticeably injurious, it seems best not to feed new wheat or other grains, especially those with high moisture content. Birds which are affected show profuse diarrhea, darkened comb, and decided enteritis. The digestive system is usually full of fermented wheat.

    p. 133-134
    Yeast. Dried yeast is the yeast of the botanical classifications Saccharomyces, Torulopsis, or Dandida, which has been separated from the medium in which it was propagated and dried. It shall contain not less than 40 per cent crude protein.

    "Irradiated Yeast is yeast which has been subjected to ultra-violet rays in order to increase its antirachitic potency."

    "Brewers' Dried Yeast is the dried, nonfermentative, nonextracted yeast resulting as a by-product from the brewing of beer and ale and shall contain not less than 40 per cent of crude protein on the moisture-free basis."

    "Dried Torula Yeast is a yeast of the botanical classification Torulopsis which has been separated from the media in which [it was] propagated and dried. It shall contain not less than 40 per cent crude protein on the moisture-free basis."

    "Grain Distillers' dried Yeast is the properly dried yeast resulting from the fermentation of grains and yeast, separated from the mash, either before or after distillation."

    "Molasses Distillers' Dried Yeast is the properly dried yeast resulting from the fermentation of molasses and yeast, separated from the medium, either before or after distillation."

    Yeast, a rich source of the vitamin B complex, can be used in poultry rations for this purpose. Yeast can also be used to produce a fermented mash.

    Adding yeast to normal chick ration has shown no advantage in some experiments. (139) In some cases (140) the growth rate has been increased owing probably to an increase in some of the nutrients or to increased food consumption.

    Some feeding experiments (141) with laying birds showed no apparent advantage in supplementing the regular laying ration with commercial yeast or diastase from the standpoint of egg production, egg size, body weight, mortality, or cost of feed per dozen eggs. On the other hand, the feeding of yest-fermented mash and live yeast at the North Carolina Station resulted in higher egg production. The writers indicate that the feeding of yeast-fermented mash stimulated the appetite and led to higher feed consumption and to higher egg production. They also indicated that the enzymes of the live yeast were causative factors for higher production. Temperton and Dudly (143) reported fodder yeast as satisfactory for for laying pullets.

    Chapter 10, Feeding Systems and Practices

    p. 314

    The North Carolina Station (68) reported benefits from feeding yeast-fermented mash as compared with wet mash. The yeast-fermented mash, when fed both to White Leghorns and to Rhode Island Reds, stimulated the appetite and led to higher feed consumption and higher egg production. The birds also came into production more rapidly. In one test the mortality rate was also lower.


    (Chapter 5, p. 153)
    139. Kempster, H. L., and E. M. Funk. Influence of yeast on growth of White Leghorn chicks. Mo. Bul. 310:49. 1932

    (Chapter 5, p. 153)
    140. Mussehl, F. E., and C. W. Ackerson. The growth promoting value of yeast added to certain chick rations. Poultry Sci. 10:369. 1931
    Grau, C. R., and M. Kamei. Yeast culture investigations. Live yeast culture tested for production efficiency as feedstuff for chicks. Calif. Agric. 3:13. 1949

    (Chapter 5, p. 153)
    141. Cassel, L. W. Feeding experiments with Leghorns. Wash. Bul. 210. 1927
    Carver, J. S. The supplementary value of yeast in the laying ration. Wash. Bul. 354. 1937
    Barton, O. A. Experiments with poultry at the North Dakota Station. N. Dak. Bul. 233:108. 1930

    (Chapter 5, p. 153)
    143. Temperton, H., and F. J. Dudley. Fodder yeast for laying pullets. Harper Adams Poultry Jour. 26:172. 1941

    (Chapter 10, p. 329)
    68. Dearstyne, R. S., and C., O. Bollinger. Some effects of feeding yeast-fermented masth to laying pullets. N. C. Bul. 55. 193
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2014
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  5. Scott H

    Scott H Chillin' With My Peeps

    Oct 29, 2012
    Twin Lakes, ID
    My Coop
    OK ...I took in all other feed offering only FF this morning. They came out and ate it and went about their business scratching around in the snow for the organic scratch I toss about. Took them out a plate of greens mid morning which they ate. As they gathered at the coop this evening I offered FF again and they wanted none of it.....guess they had enough in their crops.
    1 person likes this.
  6. chickengirl1193

    chickengirl1193 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Oct 12, 2013
    north Jersey
    So I noticed that my girls picked at their FF throughout the day but they didnt finish it. We will figure it out lol. Thanks everyone for the support!
    Does the feed have to be really wet or can it.ferment if its only moist and not soupy?
  7. Beekissed

    Beekissed Flock Master

    Here's a few vids of the texture I usually feed mine and sometimes it's even drier.

  8. chickengirl1193

    chickengirl1193 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Oct 12, 2013
    north Jersey
    Okay thank you! My feed is starting to smell more like alcohol than sourdough bread... but this morning my girls ate their feed! I think im going to be able to make it work :)
  9. kpgoldstar

    kpgoldstar Chillin' With My Peeps

    Sep 25, 2013
    West Coast of Arizona
    This is what mine looks like in the morning after the water has been absorbed. You can see small pools of water in the corners. Sometimes it is even drier than this. Like Bee's 2nd video, more like a dry mortar grout.
    I use a fine mesh strainer to feed it as dry as possible so they don't get it all over their necks! This is simply chick starter and water, no ACV, no other grains. Mine always has just a slight sour smell.

    After 4 months, I finally made a trip out to Walmart and picked up some BOSS. I fed it in the bottom of their snack feeder last night and they gobbled it all up. Then I put a couple handfuls in with the crumbles when I refreshed my bucket last night and boy did it expand even more than it usually does! Do you feed BOSS with commercial feed all year? I know I won't be offering scratch once April hits. We are supposed to be in the mid 80's even by the end of the week here! The scratch must really heat them up because they drink like crazy after they've had it.
  10. chickengirl1193

    chickengirl1193 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Oct 12, 2013
    north Jersey
    Okay thats what mine looks like now. Thanks :) im just now at the point where im.figuring out how much to put out so they eat it all before it freezes.

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