FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

[JodyDI]

Hi Trina, fellow Georgian! I've been doing this for 5-6 months now.I don't have alot of Chicks, so I use a large Plastic mixing bowl. I don't always put ACV in it. It still ferments. I believe the yeasts are in the air. (especially after doing it for a while). I use the Countryside organics, so its like grains that get soaked up, not mush. They love it.

 

[22qZoo]

Hi, I tried this last fall but had trouble with it getting moldy. Is the temperature where it's kept important? I realize now that I should have stirred it more often. Do you keep it outside , in the garage, in the house? It can get really hot here and freezing cold in the winter. Also,I haven't found a source around here for gmo free or soy free chicken feed that is practical can I just use the feed that is sold at say, TSC or some similar farm store ?

 

[wlhtx]

When you say "moldy," what exactly did it look like? Mine (and many others from reading on here) typically get a grayish whitish film on top that we all just stir back in. Is that what your mold looked like, or something else? Black fuzzy stuff is bad...

I keep mine inside our shop or sometimes outside. I'm in TX and it's been really hot here. The heat has not affected mine except for possibly speeding up the fermenting process by helping the batch "cook."

I am not one that's on a no-GMO, no soy kick. I feed whatever chick starter/grower I can buy that's cheapest, whether from TSC or my local feed store. It's not organic. Just regular feed. I do add in some scratch grains - mainly because they chickens love it.

 

[Beekissed]

Hi, I tried this last fall but had trouble with it getting moldy. Is the temperature where it's kept important? I realize now that I should have stirred it more often. Do you keep it outside , in the garage, in the house? It can get really hot here and freezing cold in the winter. Also,I haven't found a source around here for gmo free or soy free chicken feed that is practical can I just use the feed that is sold at say, TSC or some similar farm store ?

Temps between 50-100 seem to be the most conducive to healthy FF, so if it's colder than that, it won't ferment as well and hotter than that, it may grow a bit too well and ferment quick and strong, so it must be fed out and freshened more than at more moderate temps.

If you stir it every time you feed, it should be sufficient. I keep mine in the coop until temps drop to the 40s, consistently, and then I bring mine into the house. No one wants to feed wet, cold AND unfermented feeds to the birds on a winter morn.

You can use whatever feed you find..makes no matter. I also am one that doesn't bother about the presence of soy or GMO...keeping chickens shouldn't cause that much stress nor break your wallet. If it does, it defeats the purpose of having the birds.

A light film of grey, white, or beige is normal to be found on your feed each time you go to feed..that is the mother or scoby and is the good stuff. Stir it in and feed it out.

Here's a pic of my feed with a light skim of the scoby on top of the feed..before it has been stirred:




And here's the same feed once it has been stirred up.....

 

[22qZoo]

Thanks Whltx and Beekissed, I think it was just that I just didn't stir down the sides enough and it was a little drier . I'm gonna try this again

 

[sarahsunshine]

Hi All, I’m new to chickens, but have already read many a thread and lots of great information from BeeKissed… enough that I am already a follower.

I have read many threads, including the rescue from last year almost in its entirety… OK, enough! All I can say is that I am soaking up information as fast as the fermenting feed!

So this is what I have done, and I have a question or two.

At the last minute, when our order of chicks didn’t pan out, I found a dozen 6wk ‘broilers’ of indeterminate type (after posting in the what type is this thread they are likely not broilers!) and 7 layers that someone was getting rid of because they had to move (2 Isa Browns, and 5 White leghorns).

I started out feeding organic heritage wheat (about 14% protein), and nothing else (because DH said he bought it as chicken feed from his organic grain farmer friend at a really good deal). I would like to try to stay away from GMO and soy, within reason, but we went out and bought a large bag of grower feed to help the chicks make up for the days of nutrients that they were lacking.

Shortly after, I discovered fermented feed, and have made up a 5 gallon bucket which I have been feeding from and adding to twice daily. I haven’t used any ACV or molasses or apple juice, but after 5 days the feed seems to be fermenting quite well, and the chickens just attack me whenever it shows up – they love it! But now I want to try to get back to the non-GMO and non-soy diet (within reason).

I plan to mix the feed 50/50 with the organic wheat (fermentation increases protein, so it should still have sufficient protein at a 50/50 ratio mix. What other non-corn grains are suggested? I need something high in carbs (like corn), and I don’t think fermenting a legume is a great idea (but others could tell me I’m wrong!). I know Beekissed uses generally 3 grains (can't remember what), but not sure about other supplements.

Also, we are giving the layers extra calcium in the form of oyster shells. Is there any other good calcium source that works as well that would be more local? I live in central Alberta/prairies in Canada. Oysters are imported from a long ways away!

If I am feeding fermented feed and grain mix, so I need to add vitamins? I know someone had a problem with niacin deficiency, and several have had issues with low quality meat. The purpose of growing our own birds is to have healthier meat – so I want to avoid commercial feed, yet make sure these chickens are fed properly. No, I don’t have free range chickens (would love to, but the dogs would too!). But they are in chicken tractors with ample space (not piled on top of each other like Salatin’s). They have about 7-8sqft per bird, and their tractors are moved every 1-2 days. They get lots of grasshoppers and the occasional frog that the kids catch on feed to them!

 

[Beekissed]

Quote:

I'm so glad you are finding all this info useful! You'll have to keep pics and tabs on the changes you see so you can report to others about the efficacy of it all.

You don't need to add any vitamins if you are feeding that mix...maybe someone had a niacin deficiency with formulating their own feed mixes? Not sure about all that...everyone I've seen is reporting increased nutrition and not a deficiency.

Your very best calcium source is going to be found on free range...I never supplement calcium any longer. Years ago I did a couple of times and found it made no different whatsoever to my flock if they had it or if they didn't. So, now I don't. Most are reporting an increased strength and thickness of the shells with feeding FF. Most birds are going to have thin shells at certain times of the year and adding calcium will not change that outcome greatly...usually this passes with time, as per usual.

Grains I've used are barley, oats, cracked corn(not so much any more) and wheat(this is a hard grain and seems to resist fermenting...the birds will leave it to the last to eat and sometimes won't eat it at all...even the CX, and that is saying something), BOSS, millet.

 

[sarahsunshine]

Thanks for your help!!!

I have to take some photos of the process tonight for my blog! Thanks for reminding me.

Interesting about the calcium and free ranging. Unfortunately I can'e let them truely free range, but they do get lots of greens and bugs (and leftovers). What do chickens generally get calcium from in a free-range diet? If I knew, I could make an educated guess as to how much they might need supplement-wise (I'm a wildlife biologist with a keen interest in nutrition). I have noticed that the ISA Browns have very thick shells, but the leghorns have quite thin shells. I wonder if this is simply a breed difference or diet-related. I would hate for them to be so deficient in calcium that they are using up their bone stores.

So glad it seems that I am doing things right! In terms of wheat, the stuff we have is roughly ground so I think that might help the fermentation. I know that it is definitely gone before the rest of the 'mash'. I will get my DH to get a couple other grains at his friend's/the mill. Let him know what to look for. I also want to make sure that the feed he is getting isn't medicated (note to self)!

Looking forward to some more eggs... And I swear the 'broilers' are much bigger than Friday when I last saw them! We went away for the weekend and our friend took care of the chickens. The layers look a little heavier too - but maybe that's my imagination. It's only 3 days, but they did look a little "skinny" to my non-chicken connaisseur's eye!

 

[Beekissed]

You will get more calcium rich nutrition from legumes, so this is fairly easy if you plant or already have plenty of clover in your forage area. If you cannot provide forage, you can build grass frames right in your run and plant the types of grasses that are high in nutrients, with the legumes being the highest. Whatever legumes grow easily and are native to your area are the best pick for your plantings and just a mix of grasses that are tender and easily digested would be a good choice as well...winter wheat is a great choice because it is cold tolerant along with the clover and will often grow right through the winter months, though the winter wheat may need reseeding each year if not let go to seed and replenish it's own growth.

Applying pelleted lime to your forage areas will also increase the calcium content of the grasses and the soils, as well as the bugs and worms that feed on them. If you have deep litter you can apply lime to that as well, which will help balance out your litter...go easy on it and don't use caustic lime.

Providing more exercise opportunities for the chickens will also increase their calcium uptake, as calcium generally stays in the blood stream until it is needed in the bones...putting stress on the bones signals the calcium to be deposited there instead of cycled out by the kidneys as unneeded mineral. Serious free ranging~not letting the birds out of an evening and letting them peck around a little before roosting~but serious foraging, requires a lot of exercise, which puts stress against the bones, so any calcium consumed will be more readily stored in the bones and can be drawn upon later for egg laying and feather regrowth.

This is why confined broilers often have difficulty with mobility at a young age...little weight bearing exercise, low calcium intake, too rapid of weight gain and high protein feeds. All of this contributes to bone loss but feeding the correct calcium and lower proteins at a young age and requiring they exercise for their feed will drastically change the outlook of that bone density and one can grow fantastically large birds if that early development is attended to.

 

[22qZoo]

That is so cool to hear you say that about calcium absorption . That exercise calcium uptake principle applies to almost all critters . Horses,kids,dogs.... It's good to be outside stomping flies , climbing trees,& chasing rabbits. Being raised indoors like a hot house flower throws it all of balance . Sorry , tripped on the soap box. There is safety from predators to consider too. ; )