Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[RedRidge]

Quote: OK, I suspect we are talking two different things here...
Deep litter is for confined birds in a small space?
A paddock situation is acreage conducive to enough forage and bugs to provide adequate nutrition and health without providing bedding...?
At first I thought people were purposely adding bedding to paddocks and that sounded silly... then I realized you meant coops.

I'm not usually dense, but was having trouble following the deep bedding thread as I couldn't figure out why anyone would ever use deep bedding and all the trouble it involves unless they were cramped for space.

 

[RoseMarie1]

We are up on fairly high ground too, but the house is at the top of the hill and everything else is headed down hill. Rain is just falling so fast it has nowhere to go! I guess if the coop was at the top of the hill I might have chicken turds running through my living room! LOL August is always hot and dry here. Any year in the past I would have had plenty of dry weather and time to get the fall monsoon-ready coop prepared, but nooo not this year. This is so weird, it is just like October-November weather.

lol I got a visual of the turds rolling down the hill into your living room. lol

 

[Beekissed]

Might help to know what some definitions of "large paddock" are. Guess I'm a little confused and and finally figuring out that a large paddock is maybe? An area a little larger than the coop? I just can't get a handle on the necessity for deep bedding in such circumstances?

Definition of PADDOCK

1
a : a usually enclosed area used especially for pasturing or exercising animals; especially : an enclosure where racehorses are saddled and paraded before a race

b Australian & New Zealand : an often enclosed field

If one is pasturing and exercising animals in a paddock, by this definition, it would indicate that this area is sizable in relation to the livestock being pastured and exercised. In a paddock, it would not necessitate deep litter, though if it is a stationary paddock, one would have to rotate certain areas in the enclosure so that the grass and forage would not soon be depleted by continual usage.

So, paddock is relative to the number of livestock and what size of area they would need to actually graze/forage on it and exercise without depleting the resources in it. Pretty sizable, in other words. Not the size of a coop or a run, but much larger and probably more like a quarter acre of land for a standard flock of 10-20 birds.

A run, on the other hand, would definitely benefit from a deep litter system as it is smaller and usually stationary. Because it is small, the grass is quickly depleted and the ground very compacted from foot travel of the birds. This leaves soil that is stagnate, filled with nitrates, unable to cleanse itself when it rains, attracting flies and the growth of harmful bacteria. Deep litter in that situation is necessary, IMO, if one wants healthy birds in a confined situation.

 

[Triple Willow]

@Bee... Ya know, I think it would be a real waste if you let the knowledge that you have gained over your lifetime from your mom, grandma and other farmers just disappear. Of course you spread a lot of knowledge here BUT if you were to write it down in a book it would never be lost and it would spread even further. That would be one nice tribute to your mom, grandma and the rest. I know you are like me, just a pilgrim passing through, but you could leave a legacy and do it your way, putting in it any and everything you want without having to be "politically correct". You could teach people a lot more than just chicken keeping. Think about it. ...And you would make money! If you don't need/want the money just send it to me and I will do away with it for you. LOL

 

[RedRidge]

Definition of PADDOCK

1
a : a usually enclosed area used especially for pasturing or exercising animals; especially : an enclosure where racehorses are saddled and paraded before a race

b Australian & New Zealand : an often enclosed field

I always thought of paddocks as being small dry lot areas close to a barn that provide temporary housing for various livestock.

I guess our "paddocks" by the above definition are the "sub-pasture area" we rotate to each day. Each "paddock" is 164'x164' and is in a different location each dawn.
Native grasses and legumes are used to not only provide and encourage proper nutrition for a variety of foraging livestock, but there are no concerns about parasites or soil imbalance since the proper pH, nitrogen, phosphorous, etc are well maintained without reseeding due to the proper grazing (never less than 4") and stomping or organic matter while encouraging growth of the beneficial forage.

 

[Triple Willow]

lol I got a visual of the turds rolling down the hill into your living room. lol

LOL No rain today. I tell ya, this country is so diverse. One place literally burning, one literally flooding, others dry, some having a drought and places like mine having such unusual weather. Definitely diverse! I look at the news and feel so sorry for people. I talked to a friend in Pakistan today. They are having weather like mine - usually hot and dry but it is raining A LOT there and most people in his area (including his family) are suffering with leaking roofs. I guess my talking to him today was my message to quit complaining.

 

[RedRidge]

In the forage classes that I teach we always encourage people to work with their native grasses as opposed to planting anything annual unless the annual benefits far outweigh the time of money of other forage.
For instance... rye and oats are frequently planted this time of year to extend grazing seasons here, but without enough lbs/acre converting it then it would just be a waste.
Using your native grasses with encourage a higher population of native bugs, dung beetles, etc... thereby maintaining soil quality for the long haul.

 

[Beekissed]

@Bee... Ya know, I think it would be a real waste if you let the knowledge that you have gained over your lifetime from your mom, grandma and other farmers just disappear. Of course you spread a lot of knowledge here BUT if you were to write it down in a book it would never be lost and it would spread even further. That would be one nice tribute to your mom, grandma and the rest. I know you are like me, just a pilgrim passing through, but you could leave a legacy and do it your way, putting in it any and everything you want without having to be "politically correct". You could teach people a lot more than just chicken keeping. Think about it.

...And you would make money! If you don't need/want the money just send it to me and I will do away with it for you. LOL

I've almost done it a time or three and many people have encouraged it, but for some reason I cannot do it...hit a wall of "NO" each time I try. I take that as a leading from God and gave up my desire to write it all down for posterity and sell it for money..and that's something because I love to write and have always done well in that area.

As for money..no, I do not need it, though many would look at my circumstances in life and say that I am a pauper.

I look at my circumstances in life and claim that I am rich beyond compare and have need of nothing..and that would be the true statement, as all my needs are provided for on a daily basis. All I own can be fit into a few duffel bags and the back of a small SUV and they are nothing but rags, but I am the wealthiest woman on Earth.

I have no desire to leave a legacy or tribute to me or my mothers, as I pay tribute to them each and every day by telling their stories and honoring what they taught me. A legacy created by man will be dust and a forgotten puff of air one day soon, so I have no desire for that either. I guess you could say I'm very content to pass along tidbits here and there in a spontaneous manner and meet you wonderful people along the way. That is much, much more satisfying than mere money, useless legacies or tributes to ancestors, I'm thinking. Everything here will turn to dust and pass away, but the fellowship I have with some of you folks will live on in my heart for eternity!

 

[Windy Bay Farm]

Use whatever materials you see in nature and try to emulate that....bark, wood shavings, pine needles, woody weed trimmings, leaves, dried grass clippings(if you live in a hot and arid climate).  Whatever encourages bug and worm life, keeps the barren soil covered, creates a depth of carbonaceous materials with which the nitrogen of the feces can bind and decompose properly.  Keep adding to it as time goes along to keep that depth and proper balance of materials to promote good composting of all the materials. 

It's the equivalent of giving your chickens a big compost pile to live on, with all the healthy bacteria and insect life that they need underfoot and in their habitat.  Imagine the feral chickens of tropical climates and how rich is their diet when they forage under the canopy of a tropical forest.  Think of how deep that forest floor litter really is and how rich in bug life, how clean the soils are so that they are loamy, spongy and able to absorb water instead of letting it stand on the top to grow harmful bacteria and attract pestilent mosquitoes.  Their climate may be humid and damp,but their footing is dry due to all the leaf and twig litter on which they are walking. 

If you live in a dry climate, use bedding that absorbs or has natural moisture, like grasses, hay, etc.  If you live in a humid climate, add more dry materials that decompose more slowly, like bark and shavings. 

 

Thank you, Bee ! I absolutely love your information and explanation of things... You're a wealth of knowledge beyond what I can find in any book or the Internet.

Currently I am putting all my fresh grass clippings I'm the run and adding some pine shavings as well. I live in a moderate climate so it's sometimes humid and sometimes dry; we're kind of in between for the most part. The grass clippings seem to be holding up fairly well and I have the run covered at present time so it doesn't get really soaked when it rains. So far everything is trial and error for me as I am fairly new to the chicken world but at this point it all seems to be going smoothly and I owe a lot of that to you, this thread and BYC in general.

Thanks again !

 

[Beekissed]

YW! I'm so glad you are trying this in your run...you'll have to let us know the differences you see as time goes along. No more muddy feet in the nests, for one..hurray! No more water standing in stinky pools after a rain, yay!!