Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[Lacy Blues]

Try some yogurt? (plain and unsweetened) Has his food been fermented chick starter or grains?

 

[maryhysong]

Try some yogurt? (plain and unsweetened) Has his food been fermented chick starter or grains?

Organic broiler feed, fermented. Have given some yogurt and mixed a tiny bit of feed with it to get him to eat it, which he did, but still got a water balloon crop.

 

[SunnysMama]

Organic broiler feed, fermented. Have given some yogurt and mixed a tiny bit of feed with it to get him to eat it, which he did, but still got a water balloon crop.

What breed of bird and how old? Sometimes meatbirds will feel like that because they build up fluid in the chest cavity, also known as ascites or congestive heart failure.

 

[maryhysong]

What breed of bird and how old? Sometimes meatbirds will feel like that because they build up fluid in the chest cavity, also known as ascites or congestive heart failure.

Black Copper Marans, about 10 weeks old. Acts fine, except moving a bit slower than normal; eating and drinking, just a big, really huge crop; all squishy and somewhat gassy. Breathing and heartrate seem to be OK; Just an oddball I guess. I figure if the yogurt hasn't licked it by the time I get home from work tomorrow evening I may try the Monostat recommended on one of the forum threads for it.

 

[cutechick2010]

We get Organic Fishmeal in 50lb bags from a local Feed store, I believe it is the Fertrell brand now, and the protein is about 60%. It is quite expensive, up to about $1.50 per pound where we get it now, but it is worth it since only a little bit, say 3-6% of your feed, raises the protein significantly. We couldn't do soy-free feed without it!

And no, I don't think it is too smelly when fermenting the feed. I mean, yes, the Fishmeal itself has a "fishy" smell obviously, but it is dry, so you don't notice it much except when you are measuring it out. Our fermented feed just smelled nicely fermented, not terrible. There is such a small amount of the Fishmeal in the feed that I don't think it makes much of a difference in the smell overall.

Oh, and by the way, I know prices are different everywhere, but with the cheaper bulk grains that we get at the local organic processor, our total feed ends up costing around $0.35 per pound, or $17.50 for 50lbs. Just to give you an idea.

Well, I asked my usual feed store about it today, and they said they don't carry it. I will try calling around and asking other places tomorrow. So I am a little bit confused on one point, do you add the fishmeal to your ferment, or just mix it in when you are about to feed? How much do you think you would add to a five gallon bucket of the FF? I usually feed slightly over half of a five gallon bucket each day right now.

 

[cutechick2010]

I see you are in Illinois. I belong to a co-op, Azure Standard, and they carry the feed listed below. It $33.45 per 50 lbs delivered to the co-op drop-off. Where are you in Illinois?

Product Description

Corn & Soy Free!
Product of Oregon.
Cascade Feeds has changed our ration. We are dedicated to being Certified Organic and supplying you with the VERY BEST for your flock. Being Certified Organic means never any GMO grains or grains treated with pesticides and or herbicides! There is a shortage of Certified Organic grains in the Midwest (which is where the majority of it is grown) due to the draught, which has made the cost of some of the grains out of our price range to make into feed, (food grade prices). Our feed is formulated by Fretrells, and is nutritionally balanced for your birds health. We use our own flock to test the feed on and before ever sending out to you for quality control, and our girls have done great on the new ration! So, yes our ration looks and smells different, however it is still Quality Certified Organic feed you have come to expect from Cascade Feeds. Thank you for your continued support and understanding.
Ingredients:Organic Wheat, Organic Flax, Organic Peas, Shrimp Meal, Fish Meal, Organic Flax Oil, Dicalcium Phosphate, Dehydrated Seaweed Meal, Salt, Calcium Carbonate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Menadione Nicotinamide Bisulfite Complex, Riboflavin Supplement, D-Calcium Pantothenic Acid, Niacin Supplement, Choline Chloride, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Folic Acid, Thiamine Hydrochloride, Pyridoxine Hydrchloride, Biotin, Manganese Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Calcium Iodate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, , Saccharomyces cerevisiae, Dried fermentation product of Lactobacillus acidophilus, Dried fermentation product of Lactobacillus casei, Dried Fermentation product of Lactobacillus plantarum, Dried fermentation product of Enterococcus faecium, Dried fermentation product of Bacillus coagulans, Dried fermentation product of Bacillus Licheniformis, and Dried fermentation product of Bacillus Subtilis, Dried Asperfillus Niger Fermentation Extract.
FEEDING INSTRUCTIONS: Feed this complete mash feed to poultry one day to 6 weeks of age, Provide plenty of fresh water.
CAUTION: Do not feed to cattle or other ruminants.
Guaranteed Analysis
Nutrient Name Amount
Crude Protein min 19.00%
Lysine min 1.06%
Methionine min 0.36%
Crude Fat min 6.06%
Crude Fiber max 8.04%
Calcium min 2.13%
Calcium max 2.17%
Phosphorus 1.06%
Salt min 0.28%
Salt max 0.35%

I am central Illinois, about an hour south of Champaign. I don't know that I could afford that feed right now though, it's almost double what I am paying for the whole grains I have been getting.

 

[herosaku39]

Making your own ACV is child's play. Of course you'll need a start of it by getting Braggs or similar. Or if you want to wait for 3-6 months you don't but... Best juice to use is frozen apple juice WITHOUT added calcium. It's ok if it has the "Added Vitamin C" but not the calcium. Just mix up the frozen juice, glugg in some Braggs, cover with coffee filter (held by a rubber band) and sit the whole works in the pantry for a month. Only use a glass or ceramic jar. You'll end up with a slimy layer on top that is tan to cream colored. That is the real "mother." You can taste it with a straw or with litmus paper to see if it's done yet.

Take out the slimy thing and plop it into the next batch instead of glugging in Braggs and you're off and running.

PS - there are more than one reason why the frozen juice is best, the main one for me being that it's only going to cost you $2 a gallon that way if you get the generic. But besides that, the frozen is not pasteurized and so the enzymes you need to make the ACV are still present.

Could one cut this time in half by using less sugar/juice and adding some everclear or high proof alcohol?

 

[JoyfulPromise]

Well, I asked my usual feed store about it today, and they said they don't carry it. I will try calling around and asking other places tomorrow. So I am a little bit confused on one point, do you add the fishmeal to your ferment, or just mix it in when you are about to feed? How much do you think you would add to a five gallon bucket of the FF? I usually feed slightly over half of a five gallon bucket each day right now.

I hope you can find the fishmeal somewhere nearby! We actually have to travel about 45 minutes to get ours, because the only place we can find it is at Uncle Luke's Feed Store in Troy. Maybe there is a similar store in your area?

I mix the fishmeal right into the feed whenever I make it up, as part of the whole recipe. I use an Excel Spreadsheet to figure out how many pounds of each grain/supplement I need to get the protein/fat levels that I want. We include Fertrell's Poultry Nutribalancer also at the recommended rate. I try to use as little of the fishmeal as possible, because of the cost.

For Example - In one of my Broiler Chick Feed recipes, which is almost 20% protein, I use the following for a 50lb batch of feed...

15lbs of Organic Corn
9lbs of Organic Garbanzo Beans
7.5lbs of Organic Wheat
6lbs of Organic Oats
6lbs of Flax Pellets (the only non-organic ingredient, but at least it is non-GMO!)
3.75lbs of Organic Fishmeal
1.5 lbs of Poultry Nutribalancer
3/4 lb of Wheat Germ
1/2 lb of Thorvin Kelp

We have a small feed grinder that we use to lightly grind or crack the corn, beans, Flax Pellets, and Oats. Then we mix them with the whole Wheat and supplements and powders. This mixed feed is what I put in the Fermenting buckets to soak.

Now I realize this is a bit more complicated than just fermented grains, but it is what works for us right now. The Flax Pellets, BTW, can be found as "Linseed Pellets" at some Feed stores also, and they also help with the protein, being about 34% protein themselves. You could probably be just fine with some Organic Corn, Beans or Lentils, and whatever other grains like Wheat, Oats, Barley, that you can easily find, grind them a bit for chicks, mix in some fishmeal (maybe 3-4lbs per 50lb batch) and then ferment the mixture!

Hope this is helpful!

 

[Impress]

I need some advice, I have decided fermented feed is the way to go from all I have read about it. We are big eaters of fermented food ourselves, we lived in South Korea for a while and the kimchi grew on us.

I decided to do the double bucket method, so I got my buckets, drilled my holes, added some glugs of ACV with Mother, covered it with a towel....and checked it and it has swollen big time. I know it is meant to, but do I need to top the water off to get it covering it back up again? Or do I just stir it? I tried searching for an answer but shew is this a giant thread!

 

[opalwednesday]

Impress, adding more water is advised since the beneficial collonies are anaerobic. Keeping the mix topped off will limit the amount of air allowed to hang about and therefore keep mold at bay. Also the wetter it is the more you can see how active it is! LOL, I LOVE watching the bubbles come up.